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Author Topic: Why Trump should not be reelected  (Read 3963 times)

Online gww

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #140 on: January 12, 2021, 02:23:28 pm »
Micheal
This election also went to the supreme court and 50 plus other courts.   The judges, some being trump appointments, made rulings with statements like "the presidents claims have no basis in fact or law.  That is how it is done under the constitution as it was in gore.  Gore supporters did not decide that they cared not for the constitution and knew enough more than the courts and officials that they justify an insurrection.  That is a bit different that just having sour grape sore loser thoughts.  Some states have counted three times.  They have run audits on some of the claims to just disprove some of the conspiracy theories.  Both sides had hundred of lawyers thought out and only one side can come up with nothing that will stand up in court  You ask people to think something is wrong with zero proof and to hold up who is president based just on faith.  . That is not a constitutional process. "You say that is all people want" but I say "they are willing to destroy our constitutional government if they don't get what they want whether we like it or not based on just their feeling".  Many of these feelings have been disproved.  The last one is ballot signature.  Before that is was voting machines. Before that is was undocumented voters based of drivers license.  The ball will always switch every time one thing is addressed and there will be a new faith based thing that might have happened.   It could never end and so that is why we have a process in the constitution.  Every body who did not vote like me wants to cheat?  The whole system is rigged and every body in any position of authority is in on it?  It is over, get over it.  Heck, trump claimed fraud when he won in 2016.  What a cry baby.  This feeling of faith with no proof is not a reason to go commit murder.
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gww

Offline salvo

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #141 on: January 12, 2021, 07:49:49 pm »
Hi Folks,

I like to think government is better because of my involvement.

However, there is an old saying: He who does the least amount of work, for the most money,... WINS!

OH! And never kill the job.

Appellate Boards will contort themselves shamelessly to claim No Jurisdiction for a particular case.

State lawyers, this year, refused to interact with me, telephone or e-mail, on some issues, because they perceived, not incorrectly, that I was asking them questions for which they had no competent answer. COVID, wrote they.

?Never write if you can speak; never speak if you can nod; never nod if you can wink?.

Sal

Salvo

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #142 on: January 13, 2021, 05:24:04 pm »
There was no insurrection.  A few BLM, Antifa, and radicals broke some windows and illegally entered the Capitol for which they should be punished.   If the people were there for an insurrection it would have been quite a different outcome.  I did the math.  There were people pretty much shoulder to shoulder for more than a mile behind us, and a half mile either side.  Not counting what I couldn?t see on the other side of the Capitol.  At one person per square yard that is more than 3 million people gr.  That is 1% of the population of the US.  That?s one person out of a hundred.  If they were trying to take over no one there could have stopped it.
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Online gww

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #143 on: January 13, 2021, 06:26:33 pm »
Michael
While some were beating the cop, there were others picking him up and asking if he was ok.  I give you that.  It is a lie to be blaming the great republican fall back crutch of blm and antifa for the actions at the rally.  It is also wrong for all the republicans using that same crutch to ok their bad actions as if that would make doing evil ok and it should be a race to see who can be worse.  I do not trust your math but also do not know the crowd size but do agree there were many people there.  None of this changes that the reason the president called every one there was the same reason he called the officials in Georgia to find votes.  He was open in this while telling every one that jan 6 would be wild.  Now you may have went just as a show of you liked
 the president and not as a way to put pressure on the representatives to not do their jobs under the constitution.  However, if you went to put pressure on the representative to keep them from following the constitution, it is still an unpatriotic act by you.

The lie that it was some one else who did all the really bad stuff would not justify or change an unpatriotic act.
There is no question that there are different levels of culpability in almost any crowd of people.  Still, If the goal was to change the election out side of the constitution, it is a an affront to america and those in america that believe in the constitution and do not want a dictator gotten by violating the constitution. 

There is nothing wrong with trying to change the constitution if you can get 2/3rd the votes of the representatives.  Because than you would be still following the constitution.  Trying to stop representatives from meeting their obligations under their oath to the constitution is wrong and that is their job to America and having less than even half of trump voters trying to do this is still a wrong act.
Just saying.
Cheers
gww

Offline Acebird

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #144 on: January 14, 2021, 09:31:06 am »
If they were trying to take over no one there could have stopped it.
They didn't.  The capital was taken over.  What they did not achieve is taking prisoners because there is a safety protocol in place to protect the congress in lieu of an attack.  Assumed to be from a foreign country.
The rioters are as guilty as the rioters in the BLM demonstrations.  There are Trump supporters that disagree with that.  Trump was impeached a second time because he encouraged the rioters.  It fits the definition of treason, could be punishable by death.
Had the senate done their job on the first impeachment this would have never happened.  The election would have been Biden against Pence and might have been a different outcome.  If you want to look for what went wrong look to the senate and their ring leader Mitch for reneging on their oath of office.
Many of the republican senators know what they have done was wrong and have admitted behind closed doors but they fear the mob.  They don't fear Trump anymore but they still fear the mob.
The Trump empire is crashing and Ivanka's hopes and dreams of being the first woman president are vaporizing.  She and her husband have already been snubbed by high society.
Those senators who knew what they were doing was wrong but did it anyway for fear of primary challenges are going to have a hard time justifying their record in next elections.
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Offline Michael Bush

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #145 on: January 15, 2021, 12:46:42 am »
>The rioters are as guilty as the rioters in the BLM demonstrations.  There are Trump supporters that disagree with that.

Absolutely and I have heard NO ONE disagree with that.  They should all be charged with whatever crimes they committed and prosecuted.  If they broke windows or assaulted a police officer they should be charged with that.  A lot of them, however were just let in by the police.  I don't know if you've seen that video, since the mainstream won't show it, but they were.  Those people, I'm not sure committed any crime.

However the narrative that the President incited this is inconsistent with the timeline.  Several DAYS before the FBI was saying there was a plot to do this and there were several arrests before Jan 6.  Then the break-in occurred before Trump finished giving his speech.  Then the people at the rally walked peaceably down to the Capitol.  I left a few minutes early to try to miss some of the crowd and there were flashbangs going off.  I thought it sounded like a cannon and couldn't figure out what they were at first.  None of those people leaving the rally were rioting.  The rioters were already there.

>Trump was impeached a second time because he encouraged the rioters.

Except he didn't.  Both Don Jr and Trump asked for peaceful protest.  Specifically.  Don Jr. made it clear that being violent and destructive was not who we are.  Trump asked for everyone to peacefully and patriotically walk down to the Capitol.  And the riot had already taken place and the Trump people were still at the rally listening to the President.
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Online gww

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #146 on: January 15, 2021, 01:57:11 am »
I think this is pretty good reasoning. 
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-55640437
He did not do much to help the situation for the six hours he watched it on tv to stop it.  Instead after several hours he repeated his election unproven fraud claims and called them very special people. He defiantly shirked his responsibility here.
He stirred hard with subordinates and tweet invitations  before the date of the riot.
He knew rudy  and others were there stirring also. 

His pattern is clear in his communication style of trying to get his point across in a way that does not pin him down.  You know like, no I did not do it, but if I did it is not wrong.  His one peaceful remark was surrounded by tons of instigating war talk   I guess his call to Pennsylvania was also a perfect call because of this same speaking practice but of course it was not a perfect call. 

In his speech he told the people who to dislike and there are plenty of voices taped from the people breaking in showing they got the message.
There is more coming out daily and probably even more going to be known soon but why wait on impeachment when the above is enough.  It was an attack of the executive branch on the legislative branch where at the very least trump shirked his responsibility but the fact show more that he wanted it and caused it.

Either way you want to look at it, it shows he is too dangerous to hold such an office of responsibility whether being too dumb to know what his actions would cause and to dumb to help while going on or being smart and wanting it to happen.  Either way, people died. This is the kind of thing that happens when promoting a lie over and over.
Cheers
gww
« Last Edit: January 15, 2021, 02:13:37 am by gww »

Offline sawdstmakr

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #147 on: January 15, 2021, 08:12:09 am »
GWW,
Obama did far worse in inciting riots all over this country, cities burned for weeks, about the police shootings, that proved to bee self defense, and nobody in the media or congress did or say anything about it. Not one word. All of them are a bunch of Hippocrates.
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Offline Acebird

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #148 on: January 15, 2021, 08:58:25 am »
How can they claim self defense during a insurrection?
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Offline Acebird

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #149 on: January 15, 2021, 09:05:46 am »
A lot of them, however were just let in by the police.  I don't know if you've seen that video, since the mainstream won't show it, but they were.  Those people, I'm not sure committed any crime.
If you drive the get away car you are part of the crime.  If you stand by and watch your partners in crime shoot or kill someone you are part of the murder.  So I am having a hard time understanding your logic.  The crime was committed when you unlawfully entered the building.  The only only difference is that is was white people.  White people have different standards for themselves.
Apparently you don't watch main stream media because you got that wrong.
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Online gww

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #150 on: January 15, 2021, 11:46:35 am »
Saw
Good to hear from you.
If it is your position that blacks are bad than it is even more hypocritical to say the capitol is not bad.  That always seems to be the defense in a race to the bottom.  Two wrongs make a right.  That is a whole different subject but not a good defense for wanting to change the will of the people by taking on the government and intimidating representatives to violate their oath.

It was not only all black people that voted for biden and so the trump supporters if successful, would be stealing white people votes also. 

Just saying.
Cheers
gww

Ps  I am pretty sure the cop they killed was white.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2021, 12:20:20 pm by gww »

Online Ben Framed

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #151 on: January 15, 2021, 01:16:55 pm »
> White people have different standards for themselves.
Apparently you don't watch main stream media because you got that wrong.

Ace if that is what main stream media is saying, perhaps they got it wrong? Why is it that you have brought race into this? ie Mr Bush did not mention any race, creed, or color. Unless he edited before I had a look and see above?  From the pictures and videos there were both black and white folks involved in this situation. Including a fellow named John Sullivan. As in the city burnings there were clearly multi-race folks. Are you trying divert the attention of what Mr Bush and sawdstmakr ask? If so why?

ie Mr Bush
« Last Edit: January 16, 2021, 12:19:34 pm by Ben Framed »
For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Online gww

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #152 on: January 15, 2021, 01:43:19 pm »
Ben
Don't be silly.  What were the riots over police shooting.  Jim was comparing the two riots as a round about justification using the issue that the people complained now did not complain before.  It is different but also hypocritical to dislike the earlier but not dislike now.  You will probably take this post and try and go only by the word as written and leave out the substance of the statement.   However in jims defense, he wrote it clear enough for most readers to understand.
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gww

Online Ben Framed

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #153 on: January 15, 2021, 02:39:23 pm »
Ben
Don't be silly.  What were the riots over police shooting.  Jim was comparing the two riots as a round about justification using the issue that the people complained now did not complain before.  It is different but also hypocritical to dislike the earlier but not dislike now.  You will probably take this post and try and go only by the word as written and leave out the substance of the statement.   However in jims defense, he wrote it clear enough for most readers to understand.
Cheers
gww
> It is different but also hypocritical to dislike the earlier but not dislike now.

GWW,
Obama did far worse in inciting riots all over this country, cities burned for weeks, about the police shootings, that proved to bee self defense, and nobody in the media or congress did or say anything about it. Not one word. All of them are a bunch of Hippocrates.
Jim Altmiller

Saw
Good to hear from you.
If it is your position that blacks are bad than it is even more hypocritical to say the capitol is not bad.  That always seems to be the defense in a race to the bottom.  Two wrongs make a right.  That is a whole different subject but not a good defense for wanting to change the will of the people by taking on the government and intimidating representatives to violate their oath.

It was not only all black people that voted for biden and so the trump supporters if successful, would be stealing white people votes also. 

Just saying.
Cheers
gww

Ps  I am pretty sure the cop they killed was white.

I can not speak for Jim. Although his post 147 is clear. He said not one word about race nor did he bring race into it. He simply pointed out facts of what he considered hypocrisy when unlawful events and situations which have taken place, are compared by comparing the reactions of media and congress ? Is that right? Or did I miss something?  Adding I did not read where sawdstmakr "disliked the earlier but not dislike now."  To suggest my reply my be to silly, in this case, is not justifiable. I will ask you as I ask Ace. Are you also attempting to defer or deflect the points of Mr Bush and Jim by adding race into the situation?

> White people have different standards for themselves.
Apparently you don't watch main stream media because you got that wrong.

Ace if that is what main stream media is saying, perhaps they got it wrong? Why is it that you have brought race into this? ie Mr Bush did not mention any race, creed, or color. Unless he edited before I had a look and see above?  From the pictures and videos there were both black and white folks involved in this situation. Including a fellow named John Sullivan. As in the city burnings there were clearly multi-race folks. Are you trying divert the attention of what Mr Bush and sawdstmakr ask? If so why?

« Last Edit: January 16, 2021, 12:22:07 pm by Ben Framed »
For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Online gww

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #154 on: January 15, 2021, 03:07:48 pm »
ben
You are silly in your word play.
I will make the point really simple for you.  There is no excuse to justify trying to intimidate or stop elected representatives from fulfilling their oath under the constitutions.
Bait and switch all you want but all post including micheal's' and jims is around the justifications of what happened at the capital.

You too are posting on defense of something there is no defense for.  You try and change the subject to my and ace's actions instead of the subject at hand.  You are silly in this and I just called it out.
Cheers
gww

Online Ben Framed

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #155 on: January 15, 2021, 03:20:04 pm »
ben
You are silly in your word play.
I will make the point really simple for you.  There is no excuse to justify trying to intimidate or stop elected representatives from fulfilling their oath under the constitutions.
Bait and switch all you want but all post including micheal's' and jims is around the justifications of what happened at the capital.

You too are posting on defense of something there is no defense for.  You try and change the subject to my and ace's actions instead of the subject at hand.  You are silly in this and I just called it out.
Cheers
gww

Bunkum.........


Our nation's capital building is a sacred place in my opinion. A person cannot walk more sacred Halls in any other building; (in my opinion) unless it was in a Church. I am saddened that anyone would even consider entering without authorization, its security boundaries. I am shocked that any person who did so is alive today, that includes members of both sides which were photographed inside. It is sad that the 14 year Air Force veteran lost her life. Our Capital should be secure no matter the protester or the protesters views. In my opinion. Not one person or group of people should ever storm our Nations' Capital Building, breaching its boundaries and intruding period. I am astonished that the whole group was not riddled with a spray of gunfire, killing many of both sides. Thankfully that did not happen. Had it been China or Russia, the results might have been much different.


For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Online gww

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #156 on: January 15, 2021, 03:44:53 pm »
ben
That is a nice post of highlights however, your position is though out this thread, that the courts and the officials are crooked and that ted cruez and binnell are not lieing,  it is this very lie that is the justification for those to destroy our system of government.

This makes your statement that you highlighted of your disgust about as believable as trumps statement with one peaceful reference surrounded by 90 minutes of war talk.

You were also calling out hypocrisy of others in a discussion of justification or not of capitol protesters in these later responses today.  There has to be intent for that input from you.

Which are we to believe, the last highlighted statement or the whole thread put in context?
Just saying.
Cheers
gww

PS  To make the point even more, in your own highlighted statement, you posted this misleading thing.
Quote
that includes members of both sides which were photographed inside.
  Yea, right.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2021, 06:09:00 pm by gww »

Offline MikeyN.C.

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #157 on: January 15, 2021, 07:39:44 pm »
Gww, where is Nancy's laptop, have a clue, I'll wait for your response. Ok , and I'm sure I'll be waiting rite.
M. Bush said their was people all ready their before , Trump's speech was done. Do we know this for sure or are we listen to what we're told ? If u have those answers please share.

Online gww

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #158 on: January 15, 2021, 07:53:15 pm »
mickey
Can't answer your questions. Don't understand meaning of your questions either except for the bush part which he covered.  However, a 90 minute speech would give plenty of time for people to come and go and does not have much real meaning in the big picture.  Maybe the mob got turned on by different parts of that speech.  Maybe you can tell me?  If you can't then I guess we have to go on the things there are no questions about.  Of course they are finding more every day.  I am patient.
Cheers
gww

Offline MikeyN.C.

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Re: Why Trump should not be reelected
« Reply #159 on: January 15, 2021, 08:00:53 pm »
My question to everyone on this thread, why on God's green earth was there not security measures not takin. Before this . FBI knew about it. Was it Pelosi and sergeant of arm, that declines support.?