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Author Topic: Frame assembly  (Read 1280 times)

Offline Sydney guy

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Frame assembly
« on: July 03, 2020, 05:00:14 am »
Hi everyone, I'm curious to see what people are using to put their frames together. I want to buy a stapler for the air-compressor and look at making or buying a jig.
Anything that is recommended?

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Offline Garigal

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #1 on: July 03, 2020, 05:23:36 am »
I'm doing mine the old way with nails, glue and a square, it's working well but I'm only doing 200 frames in batches of 10 a day.

The next 200 will be done with a stapler and jig lol, although the only jig I've seen for sale here is $185 dollars, it does look good though.

I bought a cheap wiring board (all metal imported) it's very rustic but gets the job done well, I'll probably try and sell it on and spend the extra $20 on one made here, they look much better.

Offline Sydney guy

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #2 on: July 03, 2020, 05:58:36 am »
Yeah I was doing it the same way but have over a 1000 to do so need a faster way lol.

I was tempted to just start buying the cheap ones assembled and wired from Hornsby beekeeping but don't like that it's all done in China. I try to buy only Australian. I pay a bit more for my stuff but at least I know it's all Australian made or at least what I can get Australian made.

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Offline Garigal

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #3 on: July 03, 2020, 06:12:43 am »
I've found that most of the suppliers in Sydney are selling either Chinese or NZ imported stuff so their dimensions are generally wrong or incompatible between manufacturers.

I've just bought a heap of stuff off John L. Guilfoyles in Werrington, its all made in QLD from Hoop Pine and they still use imperial measurements on all their hive components.

I'm not sure if there are multiple manufacturers up in QLD of if they're buying wholesale off Guilfoyles but it seems to be the only place in Aus where you can source locally made stuff. It's not even that much more expensive than imported.

Offline Sydney guy

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #4 on: July 03, 2020, 07:34:53 am »
I buy my boxes and frames from David Angilley, they are in Forbes NSW. His boxes are really well made and it's all made on his family's farm.


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Offline Garigal

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #5 on: July 03, 2020, 09:25:38 am »
They look well made.

I have just found Lockwood Beekeeping out near Bathurst, their stuff looks great and they also distribute Mann Lake products in NSW.

I don't think I can be bothered assembling and painting boxes any more so I'm going to go ready made next time. Might even go back to assembled/wired frames and just do the waxing lol.

Online sawdstmakr

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #6 on: July 03, 2020, 09:59:20 am »
I use a hive box and put wood spacers in the ends so that it holds the frames square. I stack all of the top boards together, stack the side boards and the bottom boards together using clamps. Then I put glue on them. I then put them together in the hive box with the shims I put a piece of plywood in the bottom to put pressure on the bottom boards, and staple all of the tops of the frames. I then turn the whole box over and staple the bottom boards. The staples hold the boards square  until the glue dries.
I have made up many thousands of frames using this method. It works real well.
Jim Altmiller

Offline Honeyeater

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #7 on: July 03, 2020, 10:19:34 am »
I was tempted to just start buying the cheap ones assembled and wired from Hornsby beekeeping but don't like that it's all done in China. I try to buy only Australian. I pay a bit more for my stuff but at least I know it's all Australian made

I came across some Chinese stuff at a couple of new stores popping up selling cheap  hive ware from garages. They are rubbish. I won?t touch them especially foundation.

I only have a couple of hives so don?t have a lot of frames to put together. I also make them in batches of 10.... any more and start to fit my finger with the hammer :). I admit I enjoy making them. I made a wiring jig and that?s about it.

If you have a 1000 and make 10 a day, that?s three months. I bet you won?t stand the sight of a frame by the 8th day.

Online Ben Framed

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #8 on: July 05, 2020, 02:51:13 am »
I use a 2 in 1 air nailer/stapler. 18 gauge staples; A frame jig, and Trubond II or II glue. Both work well for frames. Love it!
For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Offline Garigal

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #9 on: July 05, 2020, 08:35:59 am »
Ok well after nailing 100 frames together I'm done lol.

Going to buy a Ryobi 2 in 1 air nailer & stapler with a compressor from Bunnings for about $150 tomorrow before I assemble the next 150. And all my other equipment from now on.

What are the best size staples for frames 1"? Boxes 1 1/4"?


Online Ben Framed

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #10 on: July 05, 2020, 08:47:32 am »
Ok well after nailing 100 frames together I'm done lol.

Going to buy a Ryobi 2 in 1 air nailer & stapler with a compressor from Bunnings for about $150 tomorrow before I assemble the next 150. And all my other equipment from now on.

What are the best size staples for frames 1"? Boxes 1 1/4"?

You will love it. Be careful with it. If the staple hits a knot in the wood, the driven staple will sometimes (turn out). Make sure at all times your other hand is away from potential danger. Let us know how well you like your new set up. I like 3/4 inch for frames. Plus a touch of Tightbond  II or III glue.
For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Online Ben Framed

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #11 on: July 05, 2020, 08:53:18 am »
I also recommend building a simple jig. At least a 10 frame one. You will be glad you did.
For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Offline Garigal

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #12 on: July 05, 2020, 09:20:59 am »
I also recommend building a simple jig. At least a 10 frame one. You will be glad you did.

I'll give it a go and will watch the fingers haha, cheers.

I think ill spend a bit more and get this:

https://www.bunnings.com.au/ryobi-airwave-3-in-1-air-brad-nailer-and-stapler_p6210571

Would 50mm brad nails be enough for box construction with really good glue? Maybe a few extra screws for reinforcement?

Will probably upgrade to this too:

https://www.bunnings.com.au/selleys-460ml-aquadhere-durabond_p1232226

Online Ben Framed

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #13 on: July 05, 2020, 11:01:35 am »
>. Would 50mm brad nails be enough for box construction with really good glue? Maybe a few extra screws for reinforcement?

50mm = 2 inch Brad nails. Yes exactly what I use for box construction. I run a line of glue for sealing the edge from moisture instead of paint calk. Which serves two purposes, sealer and strength. I buy glue by the gallon. But you will be surprised at how far a gallon will go. (A long way). Maybe over kill but I shoot several brad nails along the edge of each corner. No screws, not needed, also putting a dab of glue on each nail entrance as a sealer. I am very happy with the results.
For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Online Ben Framed

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #14 on: July 05, 2020, 12:03:17 pm »
>I think ill spend a bit more and get this:
https://www.bunnings.com.au/ryobi-airwave-3-in-1-air-brad-nailer-and-stapler_p6210571


I will give you a good laugh, I bought the cheap Harbor Freight 2 in 1 18 gage nailer/stapler for about $15.00 and can't seem to wear it out or make it jam! 
For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Online Ben Framed

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #15 on: July 06, 2020, 08:17:48 am »
For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Offline Garigal

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #16 on: July 06, 2020, 09:06:09 am »
Yeah looks like the same stuff - Polyurethane vs PVA.

Selleys is probably the goto glue in Aus, like your Titebond, although a few specialist places here stock that too.

I've also found a cheaper air nailer and a mate owes me for some work I did so I'll be using his account at the tool shop to by it and a compressor :happy:

Offline Garigal

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #17 on: July 11, 2020, 08:20:45 am »
Ended up getting the Ryobi 2 in 1 stapler/bradder, does up to 32mm so just for frames and lids etc, I'll keep using decking screws for my supers as they're so cheap and hold well.

Got bored after dinner so made up my own frame jig, only took me an hour and still needs some adjustments but it works quite well as is :grin:.

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Offline Ralphee

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #18 on: October 09, 2020, 02:24:57 am »
Can i ask a really new-bee question here?
Why so are people building so many frames?
Are you expanding that aggressively? Selling lots of Nucs/boxes?
If you can spin a frame and put the stickie back in the hive, why do i see posts of 'i have made x thousand frames'??
Is it an issue of not being able to give the same frames back to the same hives and avoiding any disease spreading?
I only have 3 hives and haven't actually extracted any frames yet, but with a small number i could easily put those frames back into those hives.

I am missing something really basic here, i know it, and that really annoys me!
Thanks

Offline Honeyeater

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #19 on: October 09, 2020, 02:57:20 am »
Hey Ralph. I only have two double brood box hives and will have a maximum of three. I bought a pack of 100 frames because they were a lot cheaper than buying individually but also because these frames fit perfectly in my boxes unlike others I bought previously. Nothing is standard in beekeeping and the previous frames were too short for my boxes so the bees ended with too much space which they filled with burr comb. Now I have a life time stock of frames that fit perfectly.

From next year I do plan on selling some nucs too.

Online sawdstmakr

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #20 on: October 09, 2020, 09:13:21 am »
Ralphy,
I have built thousands of frames because I was growing the numbers of hives pretty quickly. Each hive needs 40 to 60 frames, depending on where I have them. I went from 2 hives to 10 to 20 hives and I now have enough equipment for 37 hives.
20 times 50 frames is 1000 frames.
Jim Altmiller

Offline Ralphee

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #21 on: October 12, 2020, 12:19:34 am »
Thanks, i thought i was missing some basic bee keeper knowledge about never using the same frame twice or other weird reason.
I see so many posts about building 1000+ frames
Using 8 frame boxes here (lighter and was guided that way at the start) so one brood box and one super is only 16 frames, so 1000 frames would give me over 62 hives.
That's a lot of hives!

I know that old frames (going black) should be swapped out every other year or so and always keep in mind disease containment when mixing gear etc etc
Even for a commercial bee keeper i couldn't work out why they would need to make so many frames so often.
What about the wax inserts? Do you make your own?
Maybe i should start a new post for my questions... Sorry to steal your post!

Offline Acebird

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #22 on: October 12, 2020, 08:08:21 am »

Using 8 frame boxes here
So do I but I have had a  hive 8 boxes high.  Not here in FL though.  Depends on your flows.
Brian Cardinal
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Offline Michael Bush

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #23 on: October 15, 2020, 02:49:36 pm »
I use a jig.  I glue them.  Then I staple them with 1" long 1/4" crown stables from a pneumatic gun.  I have three different brands and I think only the newest one is working now.  I wore two of them out over the years.
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Online Ben Framed

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #24 on: October 16, 2020, 08:36:43 pm »
I use a jig.  I glue them.  Then I staple them with 1" long 1/4" crown stables from a pneumatic gun.  I have three different brands and I think only the newest one is working now.  I wore two of them out over the years.

Mr Bush there is no telling how many staples you have shot throughout the years!
For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Offline Troutdog

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #25 on: October 18, 2020, 09:47:27 pm »
Do you get a lot of those uncapped cells in the picture you have with your profile post pic?
Do you ever get any cells that never get capped?


Offline snispel

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Re: Frame assembly
« Reply #26 on: October 22, 2020, 02:25:56 am »
I use a jig.  I glue them.  Then I staple them with 1" long 1/4" crown stables from a pneumatic gun.  I have three different brands and I think only the newest one is working now.  I wore two of them out over the years.

I use a jig and glue and nail like Mr Bush. It works quite slick. It's basically one bottomless box inside another bottomless box. The frame sides fit snug between the two boxes. The top bar goes on first. Once stapled, pull out the inside box and add the bottom bars. Once stapled, remove outside box. Poof!