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Author Topic: Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?  (Read 282 times)

Offline BAHBEEs

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Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?
« on: February 09, 2020, 03:09:09 pm »
Think I had one go down to hive beetles.  By the time I got into it, less than 30 bees in the whole hive, small bunch of dead ones. Lots of little Tiny white particles.

Hive is chock full of honey. Is it safe to harvest, or just leave a frame a day out in the yard for spring help to my remaining 5 hives.

Barry

Offline van from Arkansas

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Re: Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?
« Reply #1 on: February 09, 2020, 05:04:46 pm »
Mr. Barry, sorry about your loss,I know the unpleasant feeling.  N. Alabama and hive beetles this time of year does not make sense.  Lots of white specks informs me of Varroa, but can be bits of wax?!  Hive beetles leave a unmistakable trail of maggots, slime and an awful smell.  Worms or maggots are the small hive beetle larva and will be crawling over the frames if beetles were/are the cause.  Do you see worms?

Your honey frames can be frozen, stored, or feed back to the bees if you conclude disease is not an issue.  Freezing destroys most contamination, not all, but most.

Health to your bees.

Van
Bless the Beekeepers.  Dealing with venomous insects takes courage, patience, dedication and a desire to be with nature.

Offline BAHBEEs

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Re: Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?
« Reply #2 on: February 09, 2020, 05:16:04 pm »
No. And that always why I said I think.  I can find no pests nor webs.  Maybe frass.  Could be varroa, but they where fogged right before Xmas.

Offline BAHBEEs

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Re: Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?
« Reply #3 on: February 09, 2020, 06:03:05 pm »
Btw,

Van,
Do you think the almost 3 medium supers (was an odd adopted hive) of honey is edible?

Offline van from Arkansas

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Re: Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?
« Reply #4 on: February 09, 2020, 06:23:21 pm »
I would not hesitate to eat capped honey from a Varroa dead out.  Honey does not spoil.  Pharaoh?s tomb contained honey 2,000 years old, unspoiled.  Now I am not saying I would eat that 2,000 year old honey, but maybe a taste, just cause.

As far as I am concerned, all honey is exposed to Varroa, not directly, but Varroa is in the hive, especially the brood area.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2020, 07:38:17 pm by van from Arkansas »
Bless the Beekeepers.  Dealing with venomous insects takes courage, patience, dedication and a desire to be with nature.

Offline jvalentour

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Re: Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?
« Reply #5 on: February 09, 2020, 09:00:42 pm »
Was the honey fogged with the bees?
By fog, do you mean OAV?

Offline BAHBEEs

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Re: Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?
« Reply #6 on: February 10, 2020, 07:22:52 am »
Was the honey fogged with the bees?
By fog, do you mean OAV?

Yes. OVA.  All hives get it in dead of winter.  Maybe should have done more often...

Offline jvalentour

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Re: Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?
« Reply #7 on: February 10, 2020, 09:47:46 am »
In that case I'd reuse it in another hive.
Someone correct me if I am wrong, comb honey treated with OAV is not fit for human consumption.

Offline jimineycricket

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Re: Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?
« Reply #8 on: February 10, 2020, 09:53:01 am »
       Hey, I am wondering:  In the dead of winter when bees are clustered up tightly, can OAV even penetrate into the cluster?   How efficient can this treatment be if it only reaches the outer bees of the cluster?
jimmy

Offline van from Arkansas

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Re: Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?
« Reply #9 on: February 10, 2020, 10:13:58 am »
       Hey, I am wondering:  In the dead of winter when bees are clustered up tightly, can OAV even penetrate into the cluster?   How efficient can this treatment be if it only reaches the outer bees of the cluster?

Good question.  OAV coats the outside of the cluster, agreed. The bees outside the cluster rotate to the inside slowly, to warm up, thus spreading the OAV throughout the entire cluster.  I like the thinking Mr. JC.
Bless the Beekeepers.  Dealing with venomous insects takes courage, patience, dedication and a desire to be with nature.

Offline van from Arkansas

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Re: Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?
« Reply #10 on: February 10, 2020, 10:22:59 am »
In that case I'd reuse it in another hive.
Someone correct me if I am wrong, comb honey treated with OAV is not fit for human consumption.

Honey supers are supposed to be moved prior to treatment.  Those are there instructions.  Agreed, yes.

However the supers in this case were capped honey, OAV does not penetrate capped honey as Formic acid does.  Thus is why I used the wording I WOULD NOT HESITATE TO EAT as opposed to saying YOU CAN EAT.  I doubt the OAV is still present in the honey combs.  This is based on the fact that I have to conduct repeated applications of OAV, every month of summer.  The residual effects of OAV appears not long lasting.

So I said I WOULD NOT HESITATE as I believe the capped honey would be safe.  Now if roaches, flys or whatever were crawling over the capped honey, I would reconsider.  However such was not stated.

Van
Bless the Beekeepers.  Dealing with venomous insects takes courage, patience, dedication and a desire to be with nature.

Offline Acebird

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Re: Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?
« Reply #11 on: February 11, 2020, 09:00:12 am »
Lots of little Tiny white particles.
Varroa poop.  Hive stressed by varroa succumbs to hive beetle.  I would be more concerned with the varroa poop and the hive beetle slim for harvesting.  It might tend to ferment the honey.
I would not treat hives that are clustered.  It is too late to accomplish anything.
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Offline Ben Framed

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Re: Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?
« Reply #12 on: February 11, 2020, 09:09:04 am »
Lots of little Tiny white particles.
Varroa poop.  Hive stressed by varroa succumbs to hive beetle.  I would be more concerned with the varroa poop and the hive beetle slim for harvesting.  It might tend to ferment the honey.
I would not treat hives that are clustered.  It is too late to accomplish anything.

I did not see that he posted a picture, but for the information that he gave, I agree with you Ace. I would not eat it either.
Phillip

Offline BAHBEEs

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Re: Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?
« Reply #13 on: February 11, 2020, 01:55:45 pm »
It is mixed bag.  A few frames show frass.  Cant find any slime, larvae or webs.  I will be going into the frames tonight to decide what might be usable and what needs to just go out in the yard the next warm day we have.  Will take photos then.  also plan to take a microscope to the remaining bodies just out of curiosity.

Offline Acebird

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Re: Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?
« Reply #14 on: February 12, 2020, 08:31:30 am »
There is no hurry.  Freeze the frames while you make sure of the cause of the hive's demise.
Brian Cardinal
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Offline CoolBees

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Re: Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?
« Reply #15 on: February 12, 2020, 11:29:00 am »
There is no hurry.  Freeze the frames while you make sure of the cause of the hive's demise.

+1 good advice. Freezing the frames will kill any eggs/larvae from SHB or wax moths - preventing additional problems a week or 2 from now.
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Offline BAHBEEs

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Re: Dead out full of honey...do I or don?t I?
« Reply #16 on: February 12, 2020, 12:53:49 pm »
They are already in deep freeze!