Welcome, Guest

Author Topic: Home-made spacer for twelve-frame hives  (Read 434 times)

Offline Sour Kraut

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 100
  • Gender: Male
Home-made spacer for twelve-frame hives
« on: April 07, 2019, 08:13:35 pm »

Needed a way to evenly space 12 frames in a 20 x 20 square hive.

Built this out of scraps.

Might get the local metal shop to make a couple out of 1/4" aluminum later

But for now...it works

The 'points' are 0.390 wide and are on 1.500" centers

That gives about 0.050" 'wiggle room' to allow fro top bar width variations.

First and last top bars are 1 " center to hive wall.

[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]

Offline blackforest beekeeper

  • Field Bee
  • ***
  • Posts: 572
  • Gender: Male
Re: Home-made spacer for twelve-frame hives
« Reply #1 on: April 08, 2019, 05:19:18 am »
you will have more fun with the bees if the space in between is fixed by a spacer. something like this:
https://www.imkereibedarf-bienenweber.de/epages/imkereibedarf.sf/de_DE/?ObjectPath=/Shops/imkereibedarf/Categories/R%C3%A4hmchen/Material_fuer_Raehmchen/Abstandshalter
I use "Pilzk?pfe". Better than the thicker sides on most frames.

Offline Acebird

  • Galactic Bee
  • ******
  • Posts: 5572
  • Gender: Male
  • Practicing non intervention beekeeping
Re: Home-made spacer for twelve-frame hives
« Reply #2 on: April 08, 2019, 08:24:21 am »
When you use a spacer tool it leaves a space between the side bar rests.  The bees then propolise in that gap and then it is a PITA to remove and replace frames.  I don't like spacer tools.  Frames if anything are too wide so thin them down if you want the frames closer or just push them together.  No need for spacer tools.
Brian Cardinal
Just do it

Offline Sour Kraut

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 100
  • Gender: Male
Re: Home-made spacer for twelve-frame hives
« Reply #3 on: April 08, 2019, 02:47:20 pm »
Well, excuse me.

I'll just NOT post anything more if that's the kind of response(s) it gets.


Offline sawdstmakr

  • Global Moderator
  • Universal Bee
  • *******
  • Posts: 10711
  • Gender: Male
Re: Home-made spacer for twelve-frame hives
« Reply #4 on: April 08, 2019, 04:47:46 pm »
Well, excuse me.

I'll just NOT post anything more if that's the kind of response(s) it gets.


Sour Kraut,
What did I miss? I read both replies and I only saw honest advice. The answer from BFB is in German and due to language barrier, not much help. Brian is just speaking from experience about the problems caused by the bees glueing everything together when you leave a small gap.
Please let me know. We are here to answer your questions.
Jim Altmiller

Offline Sour Kraut

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 100
  • Gender: Male
Re: Home-made spacer for twelve-frame hives
« Reply #5 on: April 08, 2019, 08:34:04 pm »
You did not miss a thing

I posted what I thought might be a guide for others to build something similar, and got two responses telling me what a bad idea it was to use it.

'Acebird' says he 'doesn't like spacer tools'.

That's his choice, nowhere have I insisted that anyone use it, just 'here's how to build one if you want one'.

As for the 'propolizing' thing, SO WHAT ? Bees will be bees and stick everything together anyway.

No, it was an attempt to show how easily a useful tool could be built out of scrap, and and folks can TAKE IT OR LEAVE IT.

( And don't get me started on that 'thinning down the frames' road.)

For myself, I'll just stop trying to assist others, if that's how some of the folks on this board react when reading something that goes against their personal beliefs.

Clear now ?

Thanks


Offline sawdstmakr

  • Global Moderator
  • Universal Bee
  • *******
  • Posts: 10711
  • Gender: Male
Re: Home-made spacer for twelve-frame hives
« Reply #6 on: April 08, 2019, 09:44:47 pm »
Sour Kraut,
I see what you are saying.
I have posted many of the things that I have designed with pictures only to have no one make any comments. It?s like why bother. I can see how you feel when they make negative comments. Don?t let bother you and please continue to post your ideas.
I?m sure you have helped many Beeks. We have 400 to 500 quests on BeeMaster every day and none of them can post their comments until they register.
Jim Altmiller

Offline CoolBees

  • Field Bee
  • ***
  • Posts: 779
  • Gender: Male
Re: Home-made spacer for twelve-frame hives
« Reply #7 on: April 08, 2019, 10:39:15 pm »
Sour Kraut,
I see what you are saying.
I have posted many of the things that I have designed with pictures only to have no one make any comments. It?s like why bother. I can see how you feel when they make negative comments. Don?t let bother you and please continue to post your ideas.
I?m sure you have helped many Beeks. We have 400 to 500 quests on BeeMaster every day and none of them can post their comments until they register.
Jim Altmiller

+1. Pls keep posting. Many of us read, but don't post much. I read this site daily for 1.5 yrs before signing up. I went gar back into the archives reading. Your audience is MUCH larger than those that post. If your posts help only 1 person, you've made the world a better place. ... I have learned so much from so many here - including you Sour Kraut. What you post today, may help someone 20 yrs from now. Pls keep posting, regardless of what some one person says that is bothersome.

Oh, and I LOVE the many variations of true German Sour Kraut. Mmmmm!

Alan
You cannot permanently help men by doing for them, what they could and should do for themselves - Abraham Lincoln

Offline blackforest beekeeper

  • Field Bee
  • ***
  • Posts: 572
  • Gender: Male
Re: Home-made spacer for twelve-frame hives
« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2019, 02:48:07 am »
o well.
I just meant honest advice. if spacer tools would be a good idea, commercial beeks would use them. they don`t. in my supers the "spacers" are built into the boxes themselves. that way frames won`t slide around while transporting or removing and adding again of boxes. you might use nails or staples or anything that will fill the space in between the ears of the frames. they will stay put. not crushing capped honey nor crushing bees while handling boxes.

super of mine:
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
in the last pic you might see the spacing device on the brood frames. look on the right side, about couple inches from the box side. you see a little knob of "shiny" metal nailed to top bar. another one sits further down on the side bar.
the OHTER side of the frame has them, too, just on the other side. this way the combs have the same space in between always. and are easiert to loosen and put together than the normal "Hoffmann"-sides as we call the thicker parts of the side bars, as I think most frames are like in US (and around here mostly, too).
frames with straight side-bars and something like these little knobs are much easier to make than the standard frames. they are NOT glued together, but are indeed much easier to work with.

hope that helps.
 :smile:

Offline blackforest beekeeper

  • Field Bee
  • ***
  • Posts: 572
  • Gender: Male
Re: Home-made spacer for twelve-frame hives
« Reply #9 on: April 09, 2019, 02:59:06 am »
didn`t work
first pic of super again:

Offline blackforest beekeeper

  • Field Bee
  • ***
  • Posts: 572
  • Gender: Male
Re: Home-made spacer for twelve-frame hives
« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2019, 03:01:32 am »
scn pic of supers
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]

Offline CoolBees

  • Field Bee
  • ***
  • Posts: 779
  • Gender: Male
Re: Home-made spacer for twelve-frame hives
« Reply #11 on: April 09, 2019, 03:42:30 am »
Blackforest - I like that. That makes so much sense. It bothers me when I go pick up swarms (2 times now in 2 weeks) - the only thing I can think of on the way home is the frames banging around inside and maybe crushing the queen. Your built-in frame spacers would definitely help with that problem. ... it might be hard to clean them at times though, I imagine. Hmmm ... much to think about.

Alan
You cannot permanently help men by doing for them, what they could and should do for themselves - Abraham Lincoln

Offline blackforest beekeeper

  • Field Bee
  • ***
  • Posts: 572
  • Gender: Male
Re: Home-made spacer for twelve-frame hives
« Reply #12 on: April 09, 2019, 04:44:33 am »
Alan,
they are only suited (in my opinion), in supers.
when you got brood, you might get into a pinch while pulling them. or setting them back at a different place.
in the supers, I have no need to pull frames. during flow I might pull a couple of many hundreds. I harvest with escape boards and the only time I pull them is in front of the extractor. the spacing is larger than in brood-chamber (though I have a few hives on those, too. but it ain`t ideal), so comb will be wider than the frame. so I can use a hot-knife to uncap fast clean.
in brood-chamber, I use space-holders on the frames (and sides of boxes). see link above ("::bienenweber...")

Offline Sour Kraut

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 100
  • Gender: Male
Re: Home-made spacer for twelve-frame hives
« Reply #13 on: April 09, 2019, 09:06:21 am »
While we're getting it all out into the open, here is another thing (actually two) that irritates the heck out of me:

BlackForest said (not singling him out, others do it too):

" if spacer tools would be a good idea, commercial beeks would use them. they don`t."


This is a perfect example of what I term 'the sweeping generalization'.............making a statement that ALL (insert subject here) do / do not DO (whatever).

In this instance, BFB tells us that NO commercial beekeepers, anywhere, use frame spacers.

Really, he knows this how ?  Better to say 'My experience has been that very few, if any, commercial beekeepers use them'.

And finally the use of the term 'Beek'..........if you are too lazy to type the last 5 letters..............
« Last Edit: April 09, 2019, 01:07:27 pm by sawdstmakr »

Offline blackforest beekeeper

  • Field Bee
  • ***
  • Posts: 572
  • Gender: Male
Re: Home-made spacer for twelve-frame hives
« Reply #14 on: April 09, 2019, 10:17:08 am »
you get angry easily, don`t you?

Offline Sour Kraut

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 100
  • Gender: Male
Re: Home-made spacer for twelve-frame hives
« Reply #15 on: April 10, 2019, 10:22:30 am »

"you get angry easily, don`t you?"

Actually, it takes quite a lot to anger me.

I didn't survive 48 years of electronics field service by getting angry, in spite of radio station owners, two-way systems operators, 'supervisors' at Capitol-EMI, and others telling me how stupid I was because I couldn't squat down, grunt, and produce a magic solution to a problem out of my *ss, within 30 seconds of being notified of a problem.

No, 'angry' is the wrong term.  I used what I consider the proper term for the two items cited....'irritates'.

Irritation at people making overly-broad generaliztions, and irritation at cutesy-abbreviations.

Versteh ?