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Author Topic: Queenless splits.  (Read 1007 times)

Offline Jburkey

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Queenless splits.
« on: September 22, 2018, 06:37:38 pm »
Hi all,
I'm wanting to make some splits, normally I'd just buy in some queens but this year I'm just going to let them build their own. I've heard good and bad things about doing that. Anyone have much first hand experience. Normally I'd be happy if i was able to use queen cells but most of mine don't even look like they are thinking of making any yet, though they are filling up bloody fast. Any suggestions on if it's even worth the time or not would be great. Cheers guys. Jason.

Offline max2

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Re: Queenless splits.
« Reply #1 on: September 22, 2018, 07:07:38 pm »
son,
I posted this on the forum a while ago:
What do you make your nucs out of?

!!!I keep a pretty good record of all hives. I mark the best ones and use them to provide 3 brood frames. I use these 3 frames ( not all capped brood, I like some un-capped as well to keep the generations coming) with two frames with new foundation to make a 5 frame nuc.
The early ones this Spring I let make their own queens. Try NOT to open them for a month and you will find generally eggs, some larvae in them. Occassionally some capped brood.
The absolute "best" ( exeptional pattern, large queen, quiet..) ones I transfer into a 10 framer and split them until Christmas. Some I will keep and some are sold - there is always a demand for instant singles for those who had a FLOW gifted to them - and they want bees.

The other nuc's I sell when the pattern is up to scratch.

I also make nuc's  as per above but buy a mated queen - much quicker. Two weeks and they are just about readdy to sell.
At this point queens are still in rather short supply and I'm only set-up to make Queen Cells - and I use them.

At the moment I'm making some nuc's pretty well every week. Not too many as I have a space issue.

The " trick" is - I think to leave the nuc's alone for about a month. Most will make a queen if you give them some eggs and young larvae

Offline Jburkey

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Re: Queenless splits.
« Reply #2 on: September 23, 2018, 04:34:41 am »
Thanks for your reply. I'm making splits for myself just to build numbers. My other hives are pumping so I'm going to split straight into 10 frame boxes. I did it last year but moved the queen and the old hive had queen cells. At the moment i have plenty of every stage of brood so that's handy. Just some stuff I've been reading is saying that if you split without queen cells then the queens will be inferior because they use older eggs and it's not really how they do it naturally. Queens are expensive these days!!

Offline max2

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Re: Queenless splits.
« Reply #3 on: September 23, 2018, 05:13:32 am »
At the moment with pretty ideal conditions and early in the season, you will get away with most things.
Generally I would not make splits into a 10 frame hive but use a nuc box or use a divider - simply to reduce the chance of a slime-out.
The only negative you will find is a set-back in honey production.

Offline blackforest beekeeper

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Re: Queenless splits.
« Reply #4 on: September 23, 2018, 06:09:58 am »
I have never bought a queen in all my beekeeping life.
Make them yourself!

Offline blackforest beekeeper

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Re: Queenless splits.
« Reply #5 on: September 23, 2018, 06:33:11 am »
Another thing:
I also do consider "wild queencells" to be inferior. Better to use swarm-cells (of strong-going, honey-rich hives!). Or artificial queen-breeding, of course.

Offline beepro

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Re: Queenless splits.
« Reply #6 on: September 23, 2018, 07:21:23 pm »
I have very positive result in queen rearing of my 6
seasons of beekeeping so far.  This season I use a method of syringe
injecting extra RJ into the developing QCs before they are cap.  This
resulted in extra healthy mated queens right on schedule of laying.  When done right it is all positive by using the eggs frame to start.  An example, one
young mated queen just starting to lay.  She laid 2 eggs in 2 queen cups made by the bees.   On hive inspection I've noticed this.  So took this frame out and allow the bees to make a new queen from the queen cup that has an egg in it.   Then injected about 2.5 ml of RJ into this developing QC.   The bees quickly cap the QC.  Resulted in a healthy solid  laying mated queen now.   No beekeeping program is complete without a queen rearing process to learn from.   I have 95% return on the queen's mating flights.  So far so good!