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Author Topic: State your political leanings.  (Read 1576 times)

Offline bwallace23350

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State your political leanings.
« on: October 06, 2016, 05:52:50 pm »
I will go first. I am a Burkean Conservative or also known as a High Tory.

Offline Psparr

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #1 on: October 06, 2016, 05:58:42 pm »
I vote life. That first, then I'll worry about the small stuff.

Offline bwallace23350

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #2 on: October 06, 2016, 06:12:46 pm »
I am also 100 percent pro life from birth to death.

Offline Psparr

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #3 on: October 06, 2016, 07:59:25 pm »
I am also 100 percent pro life from birth to death.
Not when it has a heart, can hear and feel pain, drink amniotic fluid? Just from birth?

Offline gww

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #4 on: October 06, 2016, 08:53:28 pm »
I agree with roe versus wade.  Think the war on drugs is bad for america.  Like guns.  Don't like free trade as it is practiced.  I am not much on zoning laws.  Believe in anti trust in the teddy rosevelt fassion.  Don't really trust police but reconize somebody has to do it and of the need for laws.  Think that most gov inities, departments and branches end up thinking they are more important then the whole government and fight for more money and power once they are created.  Don't believe in seizure laws unless done with proof through a court prior to seizing.  Don't believe rules should be made that make a landlord act or lose property due to tenets aledged law breaking.  Believe in the cavate of buyer beware more then a goverment inspection and zoning.  Don't like the money in politics cause I haven't got enough to compeete.  Beleive in collective bargining and the rights of workers.  Think you are innocent untill proven guilty.  Don't believe unemployment bennifits should be denighed with drug testing and pretty much think any drug testing should be illeagal with out probable cause like dna and blood testing or searches.

I could go on and on.
gww

Online herbhome

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #5 on: October 06, 2016, 10:00:17 pm »
gww,

You kind of lost me on the first line but everything else you said I say "Hear Here!"
Neill

Offline Psparr

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #6 on: October 06, 2016, 10:00:53 pm »
Gww I'm with you on a lot of the government intrusion stuff, but unemployment and welfare are not rights. They are privileges, payed for by you and me. And as a privilege, I believe mandatory drug testing should be required. I would at least like a return on that investment.

Offline gww

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #7 on: October 06, 2016, 10:30:45 pm »
Psparr
Quote
Gww I'm with you on a lot of the government intrusion stuff, but unemployment and welfare are not rights. They are privileges, payed for by you and me. And as a privilege, I believe mandatory drug testing should be required. I would at least like a return on that investment.

Buying house insurance could be considered a privilage but it would still be wrong to denie a person who payed their premium coverage for their house that got blown away cause they had a wood stove that they forgot to tell the insurance company about.

Unemployement is an insurance plan just as ssi is.  Drug testing is wrong cause you are taking somebody that is innocent and testing him also just to try and find a guilty guy.  They say driving is a privalage but have sobrioty test and stop a bunch of poeple that are not guilty to find one that is.  We all do pay taxes for the roads and parks and policeing but we are not innocent untill proven guilty and there was no probable cause to check us.  If I am paying for these things then why is using them only a privalage?  That is an aurgument that I have never understood.  I do understand poeple getting together with rules to use these things but due to that feel I have a right to persue rules that I more agree with then some that are there now If I could convince enough people that those are wrong.

You already know someone has problims if they have a need for welfare (drugs might be one of those problims or maby not) and you will pay in some fassion either by food stamps or jail if they have no other way of getting what they need to survive.  Plus they get to use my taxes to pay for the stupid testing with some company that I am sure I will trust.  In the end you still pay and kids still need to eat. 

I don't look at unemployment the same as welfare though because it is imployers and workers that pay into an insurance plan and not just tax payers.

I still on welfare would rather feed a bit and try to help rather then pay with more prisons.  We already have 25% of the worlds incarcerated populace and only are about 5% of the worlds population.  If you look at my taxes that are spent on housing prisoners, I would come out like a bandit giving welfare insted.

Why make some new buisness that gives test a billionare and then have to pay in some fassion anyway.

Cheers
gww

Offline Psparr

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #8 on: October 07, 2016, 12:55:03 am »
You are correct that "we" pay for welfare. But that's just it, I pay for it as well, and don't like my money going to waste. ( I know that's a whole other topic)

As far as the incarnation rate and the cost. I don't see a way around it. You brake the law, you pay the price. Yes the war on drugs costs way too much for little results, but we don't know the dollar cost to society if drugs were legal.  Heck it could be more.

Offline Psparr

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #9 on: October 07, 2016, 12:58:35 am »
An aside about Roe v Wade.
The whole argument is it's her body and she should be able to do what she chooses. So why can't I sell a kidney or half my liver?
I'm an adult, I could use the money, and someone could live out a healthy happy life. A win win all around, unlike abortion.

Offline bwallace23350

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #10 on: October 07, 2016, 09:11:11 am »

Offline Psparr

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Re: State your political leanings.
? Reply #3 on: October 06, 2016, 07:59:25 PM ?

    Quote

Quote from: bwallace23350 on October 06, 2016, 06:12:46 PM

    I am also 100 percent pro life from birth to death.

Not when it has a heart, can hear and feel pain, drink amniotic fluid? Just from birth?


A better description would be from conception to death.

Offline gww

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #11 on: October 07, 2016, 11:16:29 am »
psparr
First off I would like to say that I appretiate you guys that can get stuff across with just a few words.  When I type it ends up being a big long paragragh.  I would enjoy having better comunication skills then I currently have.

Quote
As far as the incarnation rate and the cost. I don't see a way around it. You brake the law, you pay the price.

I don't dissagree with this.  I do however think that fairness of the law being a law could be important in the big picture.  There are laws on the books that say every house has to have a spittoon.  There are laws in places that get you in trouble if you own a pistol.  If I was sitting on a jury and someone was violating a law that I just thought was stupid, I would not be saying guilty even though it was proved they broke the law.  Breaking a law is only half the picture.

Quote
An aside about Roe v Wade.
The whole argument is it's her body and she should be able to do what she chooses. So why can't I sell a kidney or half my liver?
I'm an adult, I could use the money, and someone could live out a healthy happy life. A win win all around, unlike abortion.

Before roe v wade there was differrent type of pain which brought it about.  We are living now with roe v wade and so those old memories prior to roe v wade are not our current memories.

However the real reason I quoted was that the arguement you used on the kidney and liver has bearing on the war on drugs (which is still not stoped drug use).

If I can be taken to a hospital bleeding and refuse a blood transfusion due to my religious beliefs even though that refusal may cause me to die, then why could I not take drugs that hurt only me?  If I steal to buy the drugs, I stepped on others and deserve punishment.  If I hurt myself why would that be differrent then hurting myself by refusing a blood transfusion.  I do understand the antibotic arguement and abuse causeing resistant strains of germs but other then that, I have know people that where screwed up but holding a job that I now get to pay for because they are now in prison. 

I see people all the time that I think are doing dumb things (some see things I do that they think is dumb).  You can't legislate smartness.  You can legislate that people should not step on other people.  That is how I try to draw the line.  I do believe that we are a more violent sociaty due to the ideal that no one deserves punnishment until they commit a crime and that thinking some one might commit one should not be enough.  This is the only way to have a sociaty that alows people to not have to conform with the goverments ideal of religion and non weirdness.  In america we have the right to have differrent views and lose a bit of safety then if we were all forced to go to the same church have the same size house and have gov. inspections on every fauset of our life.

Just my views and I know I am not jesus christ and therefor not perfect.
Cheers
gww

Ps  If you sold your kidney or liver only a rich guy would be helped, I would still die cause I am not rich. :smile:
« Last Edit: October 07, 2016, 11:27:52 am by gww »

Offline Psparr

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #12 on: October 07, 2016, 12:00:28 pm »
The rich guy argument doesn't fly. Organs are distributed on a need basis. That doesn't have to change just more availability.

To say that drugs only affects the user is a stretch. Why do you think 3000 people were shot in Chicago this year? Just the other day in Pa. a 7 year old told her teacher she couldn't wake up her parents before school. They were dead of a heroin overdose with a 9 month old, a 2 year old, and a 5 year old in the house.
But drugs only affect the user?

Online iddee

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #13 on: October 07, 2016, 12:09:46 pm »
I agree with psparr there.

Dumb laws??  It is against the law to commit suicide, although no one has ever been charged.  :tongue:   :cheesy:
Charged for attempted, maybe, but not for doing it.
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Offline gww

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #14 on: October 07, 2016, 01:47:50 pm »
pasparr
Quote
The rich guy argument doesn't fly. Organs are distributed on a need basis. That doesn't have to change just more availability.

To say that drugs only affects the user is a stretch. Why do you think 3000 people were shot in Chicago this year? Just the other day in Pa. a 7 year old told her teacher she couldn't wake up her parents before school. They were dead of a heroin overdose with a 9 month old, a 2 year old, and a 5 year old in the house.
But drugs only affect the user?

The kidney liver.  If you are selling somebody is paying and I doubt need will have much to do with it.

Drugs are illegal and your example still happened, How did drugs being illegal help in this situation?  Alcohol is leagal and simular things happen with it.  Pork is leagal and people die of heart attachs and leave loved ones.  It is proven that vegitarians live longer and would affect less people and health care cost if everyone was a vegitarian.  3000 people shot in chicogo might be remanisent of what was happining during proabition in the 1920s.  I agree that the murder should be against the law.  It might still be the profit margine of illicit drugs causing more murders of other poeple then people hurting themselves with drug use.

Try not to miss my point of agreement of people needing punishment when their actions adversly affect other people. 

The guy that owns the stinky pig farm affects his neibor and sometimes it is hard to draw the line of what is fair and what is not.  I am pretty sure it was not my bees that stung my neibor or I am pretty sure they can't prove it was mine. 

I still say that the guy who had a job even though taking drugs untill they put him in jail (for drugs and not murder) was cheeper for me then he is while in jail and that wide spred testing of people for anything with out probable cause gotten through a court of law is also wrong.  I believe cost of testing is a ligitamate gripe but needing probable cause is also a just position.

As for as having a say where our tax dollars are spent, I guess we can just pretend that your tax dollar is not the dollar that was spent on welfare and my dollar was not the one spent on drug testing. Yet we can all get what we want.  Plus we still have money left over to study the plight of the monarch butterfly.
Cheers
gww

Offline GSF

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #15 on: October 07, 2016, 04:14:57 pm »
a side note... it takes only about 30 days in China to get a liver, kidney, heart, or what ever. death row inmates.
When the law no longer protects you from the corrupt, but protects the corrupt from you - then you know your nation is doomed.

Online Dallasbeek

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #16 on: October 08, 2016, 11:00:53 am »
a side note... it takes only about 30 days in China to get a liver, kidney, heart, or what ever. death row inmates.

Yeah, and if there are not enough livers, kidneys, hearts or whatever to meet the needs, they put more guys on death row.  That works, but I think there's a better way.  Not sure what, but there has to be.
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Offline kathyp

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #17 on: October 08, 2016, 05:26:00 pm »
I am a constitutional conservative.  If the constitution is followed as intended, all else falls into line.
They are so divorced from their own interests that even when their own security and that of their children is finally compromised, they do not seek to avert the danger themselves but cross their arms and wait for the nation as a whole to come to their aid. Yet as utterly as they sacrifice their own free will, they are no fonder of obedience than anyone else. They submit, it is true, to the whims of a clerk, but no sooner is force removed than they are glad to defy the law as a defeated enemy. Thus one finds them ever wavering between servitude and license.
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Offline Hops Brewster

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #18 on: October 09, 2016, 10:29:03 am »
libertarian.  Personal liberty and personal responsibility.  Your actions are your own business, not the government's.  If your actions harm another, you are to be held accountable.
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Offline Michael Bush

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Re: State your political leanings.
« Reply #19 on: October 11, 2016, 06:10:12 pm »
Liberterian.  I believe in liberty and in the 10th amendment to the US Constitution.  A lot of things may be worth doing, but the Federal government is not the entity to be doing it. 

"That government is best which governs least..."--Henry David Thoreu
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