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Author Topic: American Sniper  (Read 6968 times)

Offline sc-bee

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #20 on: February 09, 2015, 09:43:02 pm »
.300 Winchester Magnum

A lot of new things have happened with the 300 Win Mag over the past few years. The US Army has made a major push to adopt it for their new versions of the M24 SWS and as such a new emphasis was placed on making it an effective cartridge for 1500 meter engagements. The 300 WM is an outstanding cartridge for military sniping, but as you might imagine, it offers a lot of power and penetration, which limits its role in Law Enforcement. The Secret Service does use the .300 WM, but they?re situation is rare and unique and they do not typically have to be concerned with hostage situations. They just need to insure that the possible assassin is stopped, and the .300 WM is a good caliber to do that. The .300 WM is also a great round for going through media in order to hit the target. With the new heavier loads the .300 is very capable of extending well past 1000 meters reliably. One big criticism of the .300 WM is the amount of recoil that the round produces and how hard it is on barrels. Yes, it can punish the shooter but with heavy tactical rifles and even potentially the use of effective muzzlebrakes the recoil can be managed. Proper training can help as well.

Recommendation: The .300 WM is high recommended for military use, but not so for Law Enforcement use. If a suitable round can be found that limits over-penetration, the .300 WM could be a very flexible cartridge, even offering good armor penetration with the right ammo selection.
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Offline Dallasbeek

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #21 on: February 10, 2015, 12:26:37 am »
I thought he was using a .338 Lapua.  A .300 WM?  Good round.  i'll have to look up how they compare, but I hunted elk with a young guy shooting a .338 and when he fired a round beside me, I definitely felt it.  And the elk 200 yards away felt it way more.
"Liberty lives in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no laws, no court can save it." - Judge Learned Hand, 1944

Offline Dallasbeek

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #22 on: February 10, 2015, 06:26:59 pm »
According to Reid Schram, writing in Epoch Times, Chris Kyle used a McMillan TAC 338 on his last deployment and said he would have used it before if it had been available.  In his first three deployments, he used a heavily modified Remington in .300 WM, but his 2,100- yard shot was on the third deployment, with the .338 Lapua magnum -- the longest kill shot on record.  That rifle costs north of $5,000 before scope and modifications, so I don't think I'll be getting one anytime soon, not to mention that I can't even see 2,100 yards, much less make that kind of shot.  I hope the movie inspires our military to turn out a few more like Chris Kyle.
"Liberty lives in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no laws, no court can save it." - Judge Learned Hand, 1944

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #23 on: February 10, 2015, 08:56:00 pm »
>...not to mention that I can't even see 2,100 yards, much less make that kind of shot.

That's why they make scopes...
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Offline Maggiesdad

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #24 on: February 10, 2015, 10:00:32 pm »
I don't care who you are - 2100yds is some serious AT&T. :shocked:

Offline sc-bee

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #25 on: February 11, 2015, 02:42:22 am »
According to Reid Schram, writing in Epoch Times, Chris Kyle used a McMillan TAC 338 on his last deployment and said he would have used it before if it had been available. 

Just in the first of the book now .... no reader here. I knew it was a Remington frame. He may mention the .338 later.
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Offline Dallasbeek

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #26 on: February 11, 2015, 12:47:42 pm »
The fact that a box of 20 rounds of ammo for the .338 runs $80 to $100 limits the number of people using the .338.  The .308 or .30-06 is adequate for most any game except brown bears in America.  I took my last elk with a .270 after the scope on my 06 got banged up.  Had misgivings about using .270, but it did the job very well.
"Liberty lives in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no laws, no court can save it." - Judge Learned Hand, 1944

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #27 on: February 12, 2015, 08:46:40 am »
>The fact that a box of 20 rounds of ammo for the .338 runs $80 to $100 limits the number of people using the .338. 

I would think anyone who is interested in the .338 would be handloading.  I've never bought a factory round for my .25-06.
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Offline sc-bee

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #28 on: February 14, 2015, 11:33:30 pm »
Chris Kyle- - The Real American Sniper - The History Channel

Dallas they mention him switching to the .338 . Said it will penetrate 5 layers of body armor.
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Offline Richard M

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #29 on: February 15, 2015, 06:49:02 am »
Waiting for the crowds to die down. It is shattering box office records for a new release. One I definitely plan to see on the big screen.

American Sniper is alright I guess and exciting if you happen to be American, but I can't help feeling that they should make a movie called "Best Sniper" or something similar.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/defence/11383552/British-Royal-Marine-is-worlds-deadliest-sniper.html

Offline Richard M

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #30 on: February 15, 2015, 07:24:09 am »
......Chris Kyle used a ..... but his 2,100- yard shot was on the third deployment, with the .338 Lapua magnum -- the longest kill shot on record. 


WHAAAAT?????

The actual longest range sniper kill on record was a double by Corporal of Horse Craig Harrison of the Household Cavalry (British Army) in Helmand, Afghanistan, when he shot a Taliban machine gunner and then he killed the number 2, following which he put a round through their machine gun too, (to prove it wasn't a fluke) at a range of 2475m or 2707 yards.

http://www.ammoland.com/2014/04/british-sniper-sets-new-long-distance-kill-shot-record-8120-feet/#axzz3RoHyi3Vk

Second longest shot on record was by Corporal Rob Furlong of 3rd Battalion, Princess Patricia's Canadian Light Infantry (so sort of American) at 2430m.

Third was also a Canadian from the same regiment.

Kyles shot was 1900m - still bloody good but no cigar; it might have the longest shot on record for an American maybe but that doesn't make it a world record.

(actually it isn't, best shot by an American was Sgt. Bryan Kremer - 2300m in Iraq).

So there you have it, the best snipers are British. Most kills & longest shot.

And the best infantry soldiers in the world are British too - Royal Marine Commandos. (Although I think the Parachute Regiment might take issue with that.)

Offline rookie2531

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #31 on: February 15, 2015, 08:14:26 am »
I remember seeing a short on a sniper and his site man. He missed a couple times and the targets was not fully aware they were even being shot at, being so far away, they heard no shot. One was armed and the other was not. One was finally shot and the other ran. The t.v. said that this was the farthest kill shot on record. It was somewhere in the middle east, but don't remember who it was.

Offline Dallasbeek

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #32 on: February 15, 2015, 01:25:41 pm »
"......Chris Kyle used a ..... but his 2,100- yard shot was on the third deployment, with the .338 Lapua magnum -- the longest kill shot on record. 


WHAAAAT?????

The actual longest range sniper kill on record was a double by Corporal of Horse Craig Harrison of the Household Cavalry (British Army) in Helmand, Afghanistan, when he shot a Taliban machine gunner and then he killed the number 2, following which he put a round through their machine gun too, (to prove it wasn't a fluke) at a range of 2475m or 2707 yards. "

Richard,

I don't know, but maybe Harrison's shots came after Jyle's. Records are meant to be brokem, after all.  Regardless, some Soviet and Finnish snipers' kill numbers were upwards of 500, I understand, so Kyle's 150 (official) to 250 (his estimate, allegedly) kills pale in comparison.  Anyway, these guys are all just doing their jobs and it's nothing they're particularly proud of, I suspect.
"Liberty lives in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no laws, no court can save it." - Judge Learned Hand, 1944

Offline sc-bee

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #33 on: February 15, 2015, 03:30:51 pm »
Kyle himself said he did not want the number included in the book cause that is not what it is about. He stated the publicist convinced him to include a number. As said above I don't think any will brag about a number.... it was about protecting their brothers.
Kyle himself said he was not the best sniper.... in particular he said today's sniper has advantages on those of old school. Meaning computerized sniper weaponry.
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Offline Dallasbeek

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #34 on: February 15, 2015, 04:32:48 pm »
Michael Moore says snipers are cowards.  I'd like to him get the huevos to put himself out there as a sniper, since every enemy combatant wants to take out a sniper.
"Liberty lives in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no laws, no court can save it." - Judge Learned Hand, 1944

Offline Keith13

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #35 on: February 17, 2015, 07:57:30 pm »
Kyle himself said he did not want the number included in the book cause that is not what it is about. He stated the publicist convinced him to include a number. As said above I don't think any will brag about a number.... it was about protecting their brothers.
Kyle himself said he was not the best sniper.... in particular he said today's sniper has advantages on those of old school. Meaning computerized sniper weaponry.

Kyle said hands down Carlos Hathcock was the best American sniper. Yeah the canucks can shoot a great shot but it was with a .50 caliber sniper rifle. It helps to shoot a round that has a effective target range of 5,000 yards.

read Hathcock's book truly amazing what that fellow did

Keith

Offline Dallasbeek

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #36 on: February 17, 2015, 08:34:33 pm »
I'd be truly embarrassed to meet a shooter like that on the range.  I fired in one high-power match and we were all such duffers that at 700 yards the guy next to me on my left would fire and my target would drop.  Then when it came back up and I fired, the target on the other side would drop.  None of us could compensate for the wind properly.
"Liberty lives in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no laws, no court can save it." - Judge Learned Hand, 1944

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #37 on: February 18, 2015, 10:28:37 am »
>The actual longest range sniper kill on record was a double by Corporal of Horse Craig Harrison of the Household Cavalry (British Army) in Helmand, Afghanistan, when he shot a Taliban machine gunner and then he killed the number 2, following which he put a round through their machine gun too, (to prove it wasn't a fluke) at a range of 2475m or 2707 yards. "

That might be the longest shot, but the most impressive one ever was Billy Dixon's at the second battle of Adobe Walls where he shot Quanah Parker off of his horse with a borrowed .50-90 sharps  at 1,578 yards.  That's a round nose lead bullet going about 1500 fps probably about a hold over of 12 feet for the elevation.  Who knows what the windage was that day...
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Offline Dallasbeek

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #38 on: February 18, 2015, 12:41:43 pm »
>The actual longest range sniper kill on record was a double by Corporal of Horse Craig Harrison of the Household Cavalry (British Army) in Helmand, Afghanistan, when he shot a Taliban machine gunner and then he killed the number 2, following which he put a round through their machine gun too, (to prove it wasn't a fluke) at a range of 2475m or 2707 yards. "

That might be the longest shot, but the most impressive one ever was Billy Dixon's at the second battle of Adobe Walls where he shot Quanah Parker off of his horse with a borrowed .50-90 sharps  at 1,578 yards.  That's a round nose lead bullet going about 1500 fps probably about a hold over of 12 feet for the elevation.  Who knows what the windage was that day...

Not that Wikipedia should be accorded much credence as a great authority, but the article there says Quanah Parker's horse was shot from under him at a range of 500 yards and then he was hit in the shoulder by a ricocheting bullet after Parker and a group of Comanches attacked buffalo hide merchants at or near Adobe Walls.  Michael, can you give a source for the 1,578-yard claim?  I know the Sharps was a powerful weapon, but that shot sounds like a buffalo hunter's saloon story, maybe.
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Offline Michael Bush

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Re: American Sniper
« Reply #39 on: February 18, 2015, 01:56:36 pm »
Try a search on google on:
billie dixon  1,578

and you'll get 5 million results... I won't bother listing them here... the distance was not only paced off at the time, but they marked the spot at the time and a surveyor measured it shortly after.  It was verified and documented by many witnesses.
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