Beemaster's International Beekeeping Forum

BEEKEEPING LEARNING CENTER => HONEYBEE REMOVAL => Topic started by: KeyLargoBees on May 12, 2016, 08:59:58 am

Title: Hold Harmless agreement...anyone ever actually "need" it?
Post by: KeyLargoBees on May 12, 2016, 08:59:58 am
I have seen a few posts on this forum and even one with a link to an online form....question is has anyone ever had to "use" one of these documents in any sort of legal proceeding? I ran a dive/snorkel charter business for years and had a standard liability form that the clients signed before they went out on the boat....12 years in business thousands of customers and nary a law suit.....but have had numerous lawyers tell me the liability release agreement (not mine but in general)  isn't worth the paper its written on....so why would the hold harmless be any different. If someone is going to sue they are going to sue whether they signed an agreement or not ...and the legal system will ignore any sort of signed agreement that was entered into prior to the job going south.

Just curious if anyone has real experience with a bad situation and either an actual lawsuit or a threatened one.
Title: Re: Hold Harmless agreement...anyone ever actually "need" it?
Post by: crmauch on May 13, 2016, 10:51:13 am
Can't comment on having any experience.

My thought on the utility of the paper --

I would classify people in 3 basic categories (though this is more of a continuum than categories):

1)  People who would never sue

2) Those who would be reluctant to sue, but might if the problem is egregious enough

3) Those who would sue at any problem.

Category (1) you wouldn't have to worry about.  Category (3) will sue you anyways (unless a document is iron-clad, and very few are).  But the paper might stop category (2) from even bothering to talk to a lawyer, so they wouldn't necessarily know that that the paper is basically worthless.

My 2 cents.
Title: Re: Hold Harmless agreement...anyone ever actually "need" it?
Post by: sawdstmakr on May 13, 2016, 05:40:24 pm
That sounds about right Chris.
Jim
Title: Re: Hold Harmless agreement...anyone ever actually "need" it?
Post by: Captain776 on June 08, 2017, 12:35:17 am
Just like on the ticket for amusement park that indemnities them of any injury...........not even worth them putting it on the ticket, they are still responsible
Title: Re: Hold Harmless agreement...anyone ever actually "need" it?
Post by: Acebird on June 08, 2017, 09:45:36 am
I have never witnessed this but if one customer gets angry off at another customer and throws him out of the boat the hold harmless agreement may protect the boat owner.  Lawyers sue everybody looking for the money.  The boat owner would be the first to get sued but getting sued doesn't mean you have to pay the accuser.
Now if are laws were such that if the lawyer lost the case against you that he would have to pay for your defense the sue happy crap would stop.  That is what is wrong with our system.  The accuser doesn't have to pay so just sue everyone.
Title: Re: Hold Harmless agreement...anyone ever actually "need" it?
Post by: sawdstmakr on June 08, 2017, 06:28:28 pm
Ace,
Now you know why lawyers give huge amounts of money to politicians. They do not want the laws changed, they would lose millions of dollars.
Jim
Title: Re: Hold Harmless agreement...anyone ever actually "need" it?
Post by: Acebird on June 09, 2017, 10:02:03 am
Politicians are usually lawyers.  The laws are not going to change.  Our whole judicial system is based on feeding the bottom feeders.  Very little justice in our judicial system.  I would very much like to go back to a tribal system with a chief and a group of elders.