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Author Topic: Cyber Ransom  (Read 725 times)

Offline Ben Framed

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Cyber Ransom
« on: June 10, 2021, 02:29:04 pm »
I just read an article saying 11 million was paid in ransom from a major meat producer to cyber attackers; (Pirates) Maybe it is about time to call in Texas Rangers Cordell Walker & Jimmy Trivette!!!! ??
For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Offline iddee

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #1 on: June 10, 2021, 03:30:09 pm »
NAH. The A team would be better.
"Listen to the mustn'ts, child. Listen to the don'ts. Listen to the shouldn'ts, the impossibles, the won'ts. Listen to the never haves, then listen close to me . . . Anything can happen, child. Anything can be"

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Offline Ben Framed

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #2 on: June 10, 2021, 04:02:35 pm »
Yes a team would be fast and efficient. In the old days pirates got ropes when convenient.  :shocked: :cheesy:
For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Offline Acebird

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #3 on: June 10, 2021, 05:45:42 pm »
I do not understand why we don't go on the offensive.  We don't seem to have trouble finding out where it is coming from so why don't we just blow up their networks.  Back send a worm, virus anything that will make their equipment useless.  Being on the defense we encourage them to do more. When someone shoots a missile at us we retaliate.
Brian Cardinal
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Offline Kathyp

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #4 on: June 10, 2021, 10:02:48 pm »
Quote
I do not understand why we don't go on the offensive.

You assume we are not.

The problem is that private companies don't always have the best security.  These bad actors probe 100s of places a day looking for a weakness.  When they find one, they enter.  It's like forgetting to close the ground floor window on a hot night and waking up to an intruder.

We have people who are hired to white hat and try to find those vulnerabilities before the bad guys do.  Someone has to hire them and put them to work and they are not cheap...and neither is constantly upgrading security.  Even when the best are working on it, it only takes one soft spot and that's it.



They are so divorced from their own interests that even when their own security and that of their children is finally compromised, they do not seek to avert the danger themselves but cross their arms and wait for the nation as a whole to come to their aid. Yet as utterly as they sacrifice their own free will, they are no fonder of obedience than anyone else. They submit, it is true, to the whims of a clerk, but no sooner is force removed than they are glad to defy the law as a defeated enemy. Thus one finds them ever wavering between servitude and license.
Alexis de Tocqueville

Offline Bob Wilson

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #5 on: June 10, 2021, 10:15:57 pm »
While internal hacking out to be diligently prosecuted, it is the international hacking that concerns me. I read somewhere, a suggestion to treat it as terrorism. What's the difference between an armed invasion vs infrastructure hacking from afar, in the sense that both are meant to cripple our nation.

Offline The15thMember

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #6 on: June 10, 2021, 11:02:54 pm »
(Pirates) Maybe it is about time to call in Texas Rangers Cordell Walker & Jimmy Trivette!!!! ??
NAH. The A team would be better.
Yes a team would be fast and efficient. In the old days pirates got ropes when convenient.  :shocked: :cheesy:
it is the international hacking that concerns me.
We need the Men from U.N.C.L.E.. :cool: :wink: :cheesy: 
I come from under the hill, and under the hills and over the hills my paths led.  And through the air, I am she that walks unseen.

Offline Ben Framed

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #7 on: June 10, 2021, 11:35:18 pm »
(Pirates) Maybe it is about time to call in Texas Rangers Cordell Walker & Jimmy Trivette!!!! ??
NAH. The A team would be better.
Yes a team would be fast and efficient. In the old days pirates got ropes when convenient.  :shocked: :cheesy:
it is the international hacking that concerns me.
We need the Men from U.N.C.L.E.. :cool: :wink: :cheesy: 


Yep agreed; With the leadership of Captain Woodrow F Call, and Captain Augustus McCrae along with Joshua Deets as well!  :cheesy:  They knew exactly how to handle outlaws;  :shocked: I suppose they could also easily handle Cyber Pirates !!
"Newt, PI, get your rope, tie up their hands.  Deets; Put them on their horse"; "You boys got anything to say before"  :shocked:  :shocked: :wink: J/K

But seriously, what needs to be done? Should we stop using computers in sophisticated business matters, and go back to the time tested way of handling business before all this "convenient" computer handling of business on levels of the most highest degree?? Our sensitive, vital infrastructure needs something better than this cyber stuff which is proving failure? Pacific Pipeline, now this and other things we might not have yet heard about. Needs which are vital for our Nations harmonious goings on of everyday life.
 
???

« Last Edit: June 13, 2021, 12:54:42 am by Ben Framed »
For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Offline BeeMaster2

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #8 on: June 11, 2021, 08:28:43 am »
(Pirates) Maybe it is about time to call in Texas Rangers Cordell Walker & Jimmy Trivette!!!! ??
NAH. The A team would be better.
Yes a team would be fast and efficient. In the old days pirates got ropes when convenient.  :shocked: :cheesy:
it is the international hacking that concerns me.
We need the Men from U.N.C.L.E.. :cool: :wink: :cheesy: 

Nah, NCIS. Ducky changed jobs. 😆

Offline Acebird

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #9 on: June 11, 2021, 08:34:30 am »
Quote
I do not understand why we don't go on the offensive.

You assume we are not.
If we blew up a network in Russia, Iran or China we would hear about it.  I feel the same about drug lords.  They know where they live so why don't we just wipe them out?
Quote
We have people who are hired to white hat and try to find those vulnerabilities before the bad guys do.  Someone has to hire them and put them to work and they are not cheap...and neither is constantly upgrading security.  Even when the best are working on it, it only takes one soft spot and that's it.
Yes plenty of people and companies making money off the offensive.  Makes me wonder if these attacks are generated from within.  Feels like a mafia.  You pay for protection to the ones that are extorting you.
Brian Cardinal
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Offline BeeMaster2

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #10 on: June 11, 2021, 08:35:40 am »
Computer systems that run gas lines and power should not bee connected to the internet. Yes the internet is a lot cheaper but internet providers have private fiber services that would keep the hackers out. They would have to bee inside one of the companies buildings in order to hack.
Jim Altmiller

Offline Acebird

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #11 on: June 11, 2021, 08:49:42 am »
Computer systems that run gas lines and power should not bee connected to the internet. Yes the internet is a lot cheaper but internet providers have private fiber services that would keep the hackers out. They would have to bee inside one of the companies buildings in order to hack.
Jim Altmiller
I think anything can be hacked.  I am sure that the oil companies have software security.  When the rewards are so great the effort to succeed will be matched.  It is not until the consequences become real that the efforts get curtailed.
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Offline BeeMaster2

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #12 on: June 11, 2021, 10:16:37 am »
A lot of the big companies have their own fiber networks that the Bells maintain. I designed a system for Blue Cross/Blue Shield that connected 3 different locations that were in 3 different counties and they required four different routes to make sure they their connection stayed up if a fiber was cut. If you were not inside locked doors of their buildings, you could not get in their system.
Jim Altmiller

Offline Kathyp

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #13 on: June 11, 2021, 10:40:56 am »
Quote
A lot of the big companies have their own fiber networks that the Bells maintain. I designed a system for Blue Cross/Blue Shield that connected 3 different locations that were in 3 different counties and they required four different routes to make sure they their connection stayed up if a fiber was cut. If you were not inside locked doors of their buildings, you could not get in their system.


I know someone (not me) who works for a government (not ours) and their entire job is to break programs and hack into stuff in-house.  Despite the best security that money can buy, they routinely find ways to break stuff and get in.  And unfortunately, a whole lot of our infrastructure is interconnected and has to have outside access.  People write programs and people make mistakes.
How we undo that and secure against bad actors is beyond me.  What we should be able to do is dog the doors so that stuff is more compartmentalize and one break-in does not allow access to entire systems.  Better and more frequent firewalls?  Don't know.

Once again, my primary concern is the grid.  We are most vulnerable there and that's where our "infrastructure"  money should be spent.  It is a national security issue. 


They are so divorced from their own interests that even when their own security and that of their children is finally compromised, they do not seek to avert the danger themselves but cross their arms and wait for the nation as a whole to come to their aid. Yet as utterly as they sacrifice their own free will, they are no fonder of obedience than anyone else. They submit, it is true, to the whims of a clerk, but no sooner is force removed than they are glad to defy the law as a defeated enemy. Thus one finds them ever wavering between servitude and license.
Alexis de Tocqueville

Offline Acebird

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #14 on: June 11, 2021, 11:00:59 am »

Once again, my primary concern is the grid.  We are most vulnerable there and that's where our "infrastructure"  money should be spent.  It is a national security issue.
The grid, our food, water supply, fuel supply and general communications that affect everything, hospitals, first responders.  The list goes on and on.  I have concerns about any hack anywhere against American property and our way of life.  Yeah, how about Homeland security, and our military might.  Lets focus those billions of dollars on people that are actually attacking us instead of stirring the pot around the world where we don't belong.
There is no such thing as being secure unless there are repercussions for doing the deeds.  Why do we have a military?  History has proven that the most underdeveloped groups can attack us and do.
Brian Cardinal
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Offline Ben Framed

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #15 on: June 11, 2021, 11:04:46 am »
Quoting Ace

> Yes plenty of people and companies making money off the offensive.  Makes me wonder if these attacks are generated from within.  Feels like a mafia.  You pay for protection to the ones that are extorting you.

I have wondered and thought about the same thing.
Some interesting comments made by all.
For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Offline Acebird

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #16 on: June 11, 2021, 11:06:47 am »
If you were not inside locked doors of their buildings, you could not get in their system.
If you connect multiple locations by any means there is a way in.  These systems are just electronic machines and they are as vulnerable as a mechanical machine is to a monkey wrench.
Brian Cardinal
Just do it

Offline Kathyp

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #17 on: June 11, 2021, 01:01:10 pm »
Quote
Yeah, how about Homeland security, and our military might.  Lets focus those billions of dollars on people that are actually attacking us instead of stirring the pot around the world where we don't belong.
There is no such thing as being secure unless there are repercussions for doing the deeds.  Why do we have a military?  History has proven that the most underdeveloped groups can attack us and do.

I believe you are echoing Trumps point  :wink:  Again, you assume we do nothing.  What we don't know is how many attacks are thwarted. 

All of your points about vulnerabilities are valid, but all of those things fail if the grid goes down.  It is the single greatest weak spot we have. 
They are so divorced from their own interests that even when their own security and that of their children is finally compromised, they do not seek to avert the danger themselves but cross their arms and wait for the nation as a whole to come to their aid. Yet as utterly as they sacrifice their own free will, they are no fonder of obedience than anyone else. They submit, it is true, to the whims of a clerk, but no sooner is force removed than they are glad to defy the law as a defeated enemy. Thus one finds them ever wavering between servitude and license.
Alexis de Tocqueville

Offline Ben Framed

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #18 on: June 11, 2021, 01:05:06 pm »
> It is the single greatest weak spot we have.

I agree but what to do about that? Can we go back before the days of computers controlling our grids? How did this work before computers? Are we too far gone over the hill of computer technology to go back to a proven way?
For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Offline BeeMaster2

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Re: Cyber Ransom
« Reply #19 on: June 11, 2021, 01:57:16 pm »
If you were not inside locked doors of their buildings, you could not get in their system.
If you connect multiple locations by any means there is a way in.  These systems are just electronic machines and they are as vulnerable as a mechanical machine is to a monkey wrench.
Brian,
In order to connect into a closed system the way you are saying would take people from about 4 different groups to open up the system. It has to bee designed, reprogrammed, fibers reconnected, and the new system turned up. To do this requires coordination because the minute you disconnect a fiber, alarms go off to alert the customer and phone company.
Jim Altmiller