Formic Pro Mortality and Bee behavior - Insanity

[2Sox]

This is the second season I?ve used Formic Pro and it?s hard to put into words how I feel about it. Disappointed, furious, disgusted? Probably all of these.

I used Mite Away Quick Strips for years and never had the extreme results I?ll describe here with Formic Pro. ( I?ll attach photos if I can.)

Every time I use FP, the bee mortality is over the top. Since I have my hives in a concrete back yard, it?s easy to see. Dead bees all over the yard - even into the yard of my neighbor.

Also, the bees behavior is a little nuts.  Any light at night - even a flashlight - they will fly to it like lemmings.  My neighbor?s back door light was on last year and trouble ensued. He and his wife both got stung. Now I leave on my back door light on first few nights of treatment to decoy them away. MORE dead bees.

To my thinking, the mortality rate and crazy behavior is not worth it and I?m thinking about another mode of treatment.

I?d be interested in knowing about your experiences and suggestions. Thanks.

[JR4AL]

2Sox, I have had the same experience with Formic Pro. Softball size casualties from the treated hives. This is especially true after the initial treatment and prior to the second round.

It seemed almost reckless for me to put the second dose on after seeing the carnage of the first round. My temps were well below the 85 degree mark and the instructions noted that casualties were eminent. I was not anticipating the sheer volume of loss. (Heck, I have caught swarms with decent results the size of softballs).

As far as the porch lights during treatment, I have not had that issue because my hives are well away from human traffic. I can only imagine the bees and your neighbors irritability!

I will say that Formic Pro did resolve the mite issue in those hives that were treated last year and those hives flourished this year. I have also had very good results with Thymol (ApiGuard) with far less casualties and significant mite drop.

As a final note, I began an Oxalic Acid Vapor treatment Sunday on some other hives and have seen just a handful of dead bees in 6 hives in what I believe was likely due to the bees getting burned/injured by the heat of the vaporizer.

I hope this information helps...you may consider options other than Formic Pro simply to reduce the obvious stress that it appears to be causing you, your neighbors and your bees!


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[2Sox]

JR4

Thanks for your reply and for your understanding.  I missed my OAV treatment in Spring so I just waited until now to apply FP. This time I probably lost the equivalent of a small after swarm.

I?ll do the second FP treatment in a month as per my usual schedule. Then wait and see.

I did this last year to all six of my colonies. All six came out of winter and within several weeks all six expired. Haven?t a clue why.  So all 7 of my present hives came from swarm catches and cutouts. We?ll see....

[FloridaGardener]

Wow, I'm so sorry.

Have you ever thought of the alternate treatment method, like thermal? "Mighty Mite" and so on? Having fewer than 10 hives, and being close to an electric plug, maybe that could kill mites without bee mortality.

I don't treat and haven't needed to, and have never lost to mites. I did have to use powdered sugar a couple of times and it's time-consuming... I let them fight the mites off like the flu. But then I rarely see mites on the the bees or in the oil pans. 

[JR4AL]

All 6 hives were lost after coming out of winter! Man! That is awful. If I had to guess, I would suspect starvation as the cause of such a tragedy. On the other hand, that is so disturbing I can?t help but wonder if possibly the colonies were exposed to some type of poison. That is just an awful loss for someone who was at least vigilant and proactive in mite control the previous summer/fall. So glad to hear that you did not let the losses take you out of the craft!

I admire anyone who has the ability and courage to only use powdered sugar to keep their mites in check. I have not figured out how to do that yet! I do believe that mite control is the single greatest challenge us BKPR?s face. If we can help the bees navigate the mites they can help us navigate most everything else!


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[2Sox]

My plan for the future:  Only use one strip at a time as per the instructions.  With two strips - as I just used - I just can't see the sense in putting up with this kind of mortality - AND disruption.

I don?t know if one strip for 10 days and repeat one strip for 10 days will be any better, but I?ll give I a go.

[Bushman]

As a new bee keeper I have read up on MAQS and Formic Pro.  There are so many great reviews and a lot of bad ones too.  I'm torn.
I have a pretty low mite count last I checked which was a few weeks ago but I also know that this is the time of year when they hit hard and also the time of year (in Michigan) that we need to get ready to have our winter bees born. 

I plan on treating with Formic pro next week after i do another mite check.

I only have one hive (first year) and if I lose the queen then I'm screwed this close to winter.  I'm probably screwed if i don't treat and the hive collapses due to mite load over winter.

Roll the dice I guess.  My hive started in mid-june as a 5 frame deep NUC.  I have added another medium brood box and 2 medium supers to that.  The Goldenrod is on right now.  I can smell it when I get close to the hive.
I have been feeding since June.
All of my frames were bare foundation when I added the new boxes and they have done well drawing them out.

Currently using in round style feeder in an empty super up top. 

The frames are loaded with bees so much that inspections have been tough lately.  It's hard not to aggravate that many bees when you're new at this.  LOL

I am still undecided as to which treatment plan to use.  2 strips for 14 days or 1&1 for 10 days each.

[Ben Framed]

I am not meaning to butt in Bushman. I have also studied formic. I highly recommend against you treating with any type formic this time of year. It?s to risky in my opinion as the temperatures are not stable enough in a low range to chance it. At least in my area.

[2Sox]

Bushman,
I would agree with Ben regarding stable temperatures but at your location this time of year it wouldn?t be an issue.

I commented in a previous post that I will be altering my treatment protocol to 1 for 10 days and repeat - to reduce bee mortality and for less risk regarding queen loss. That would be my recommendation for you.

By the way I love goldenrod honey mixed with aster. Dark like molasses and rich tasting. Used to get lots of it when I had my operation in upstate NY in the watershed. Always looked forward to the fall flow.  I miss it now that I?m back in the city.

[Bushman]

Our temps are pretty stable right now.  Lows in the high 50s at night and our highs have been right around the 80 mark but only for roughly 1-2 hours and then drops back down.  Obviously a weather check would be in order before treatment.

[Robo]

I had good success with Formic for a few years but it seemed that the dosage had to keep being increased year to year.   I saw that the commercial guys where constantly upping their dosages as well.  Mortality and queen loss became an issue so now I only use it for an occasional spot test/treatment to validate that my OA treatments are effective.   Formic seems to be much harder on the bees than OA and they really hate it too.

[Mamm7215]

I have good results with Formic Pro but I only use the 1 pad for 10 day, then the 2nd pad for 10 days treatment.  Putting 2 pads in for 14 days knocks the heck out of the bees initially in my experience and increases the likelihood of queen death.

[2Sox]

I have good results with Formic Pro but I only use the 1 pad for 10 day, then the 2nd pad for 10 days treatment.  Putting 2 pads in for 14 days knocks the heck out of the bees initially in my experience and increases the likelihood of queen death.

Thanks for this.  I learned this the hard way.