Snow Mageddon 2 Killed Them All

[Donovan J]

We got 8 inches of snow. 8 inches!! With 16 inches in a few drifts. Yes I said drifts. It was snowing sideways Wednsday with 40 mph winds. Today it was warm enough for the snow to start melting and I checked the hives when I got home. Both are dead. They were looking fine and vibrant going into the storm and now they arent. Super sad. We never get this much snow if we get any at all. The past two years have been really bad. I've learned my lesson and will try to winterize better next year.

[BeeMaster2]

Sorry about your loss.
Did you open up the hives or just listen to them?
Jim Altmiller

[beesonhay465]

when its really cold here my bees are silent. however we  had a 60 degree day and there they are, big bunch doing an orentation flight

[Bob Wilson]

Sure hope they are still alive, Xerox.

[Kathyp]

Super sad. We never get this much snow if we get any at all. The past two years have been really bad. I've learned my lesson and will try to winterize better next year.

We got lucky and most of it missed us.

I don't know how you checked the hives, but as a rule they should not be opened until the weather warms some other than to maybe pop the top and check the winter food you put there.  They will seal the hive with propolis for winter and if they are opened the seal is broken. 

I usually dump a bunch of dry sugar on the top on newspaper or on the inner cover in October and then don't open again until February if it warms unless we have a lot of warm weather early and I need to check the sugar supply.  Then I will just crack it enough to make sure there is still sugar in there.

Dry sugar works well in our area because it absorbs moisture and becomes kind of solid.  If it warms enough they will go up and get it and if it doesn't they are clustered anyway. 

Sorry about your loss.  It sucks, but it happens to all of us.  I don't have any hives right now because the yellowjackets took them down so bad a couple of years ago and I have not had much luck with the swarm calls. 

[Acebird]

I've learned my lesson and will try to winterize better next year.

Sorry about your bees but I am not sure what you learned.  It is virtually unheard of for a snow storm (any amount) to kill bees.  You should be looking for another cause.  The top of the list is mites, check that first.  Other diseases are possible but not common.  Condensation dripping on the cluster is very possible.  Next would be starvation.  Finally, it might be a new beekeeper opening the hive checking on their bees through the winter.

[van from Arkansas]

Washington state, sideways blowing snow, snow drifts?  I believe you Xerox, but that is just weird.  That is typical weather for say 400 miles east of you.  Not talking about your Mountain.  Usually the pacific keeps you blanket with warmth.  I hope this thread does not turn into that,,, not gonna say.

Don?t give up Xerox, we all experience loss for one reason or another.  Indeed sad.

Ace provided someone excellent information to consider.  The man, Ace has seen a snow storm or two hammer his bees in New York.

[Kathyp]

Usually the pacific keeps you blanket with warmth.

We aren't North Dacota, but we are not San Diego either.  Away from the ocean we get some nasty weather and 9 months of rain, snow, and/or ice. 
Moisture is the biggest problem for me.  Constant cold rain.  I'd rather have snow for the bees than the rain.   

[Donovan J]

I checked them by knocking on the side and listening for a buzz but I didnt hear any. I will crack the top when the snow melts and see if theres anyone in there but it's not looking good. It is very unseasonable to be getting blizzard like conditions here. Hopefully the package I'm getting shipped in from Georgia does good.

[TheHoneyPump]

A great way to kill a hive during winter period is to disturb it.  The winter cluster is intricate where minor disruptions can have major impact.

Do nothing. Do not check anything. Other than walk by looking at entrance area for bee activity or evidence of such from debris tossed out.  Just wait patiently.  When the sun shines and temperature is 5 to 10 degrees above freezing, then you will know. The bees will be appearing at the entrances when conditions improve.

-36 degC here for past week and a good foot of snow on the lids.  Very quiet.  Are the hives dead?  Doubtful.  They are just very tightly clustered. 

[cao]

I would wait for a sunny 50 degree day before I would even think about opening them up.  And that would only be if there was definite signs of death.  A pile of dead bees blocking the entrance would be one.  When I walk past my hives on a warm day I just take note of the ones that are not flying.  I will eventually check them if they are not flying for several days.  Cold bees do not necessarily mean dead bees.  You don't know for sure until they are warm.

[Donovan J]

I would wait for a sunny 50 degree day before I would even think about opening them up.  And that would only be if there was definite signs of death.  A pile of dead bees blocking the entrance would be one.  When I walk past my hives on a warm day I just take note of the ones that are not flying.  I will eventually check them if they are not flying for several days.  Cold bees do not necessarily mean dead bees.  You don't know for sure until they are warm.

Ok. In a few days it's going to be in the 50s so I'll check then.

[yes2matt]

I checked them by knocking on the side and listening for a buzz but I didnt hear any. I will crack the top when the snow melts and see if theres anyone in there but it's not looking good. It is very unseasonable to be getting blizzard like conditions here. Hopefully the package I'm getting shipped in from Georgia does good.

Right with THP, do not disturb until it's flying weather (50*+) and be super gentle even then. To quote a friend (iddee): "They aren't dead unless they're warm and dead."

I had a colony last year and they went cold on me. Even the Q was curled up in a little ball. I put the hive back together and went in the house to be mad. Next day was much warmer, 70s, and there was entrance activity. Not only did they make it, they were my most productive hive. Maybe I froze the mites  :)

[van from Arkansas]

Sequin, Washington: average yearly weather, high 81F low 37 F.  Rarely reaches below 29F.  This info based on google search of; average weather sequin Washington.

I have never been to Sequin, I know nothing about, just posting some google weather data.  Consider source.

Van

[Donovan J]

Sequin, Washington: average yearly weather, high 81F low 37 F.  Rarely reaches below 29F.  This info based on google search of; average weather sequin Washington.

I have never been to Sequin, I know nothing about, just posting some google weather data.  Consider source.

Van

We usually get no snow but the past two years we have had blizzard like conditions. Very strange.

[FatherMichael]

I'd do what Ian (Honey Pump) says.

[Acebird]

I checked them by knocking on the side and listening for a buzz but I didnt hear any.

As was already said do not disturb.  Very bad practice even in summer.  All it does is needlessly stress the bees.

[Donovan J]

I checked them by knocking on the side and listening for a buzz but I didnt hear any.

As was already said do not disturb.  Very bad practice even in summer.  All it does is needlessly stress the bees.

Alright. I willtcheck them once it warms up a little.

[van from Arkansas]

I checked them by knocking on the side and listening for a buzz but I didnt hear any.

As was already said do not disturb.  Very bad practice even in summer.  All it does is needlessly stress the bees.

Inspections: very bad practice????

I can not save how many hives I have saved with inspections.  Inspections are very important, weather permitting of course.  What if Xerox is correct and his bees are dead???  The wax moths would devour the precious combs.

Van

[Kathyp]

I can not save how many hives I have saved with inspections.  Inspections are very important, weather permitting of course.  What if Xerox is correct and his bees are dead???

For those of us who have winters, yes, inspections can kill.  Wax moth won't be a problem in winter.  There's no problem with taking a quick check under the top when it's warm enough for them to break cluster and fly to check the food you have put on.  If it's too cold for them to fly, stay out of the hive. 

Here I close them up in October and don't look again until February unless we have unusually warm weather earlier and starvation is possible.

 

[van from Arkansas]

I can not save how many hives I have saved with inspections.  Inspections are very important, weather permitting of course.  What if Xerox is correct and his bees are dead???

For those of us who have winters, yes, inspections can kill.  Wax moth won't be a problem in winter.  There's no problem with taking a quick check under the top when it's warm enough for them to break cluster and fly to check the food you have put on.  If it's too cold for them to fly, stay out of the hive. 

Here I close them up in October and don't look again until February unless we have unusually warm weather earlier and starvation is possible.

Winter is relative to location.  In N Arkansas my wax moth traps were catching moths the first week of this January.  My bees fly at 43F to 47F whereas wax moths fly at lower temperatures.  I put out wax moth traps the first week in January: sugar, water, banana peel and apple cider vinegar to keep the honey bees out.  I caught moths the first night the traps were placed.
Blessings

[Nock]

Sorry that you lost them. I also lost both of mine. One I knew was struggling and expected to lose. The other was doing well I thought and in two weeks was dead.

[van from Arkansas]

Nock, so sorry for your loss. Can you post some detail.  I am not trying to determine the cause, I want to avoid the same issue, whatever the issue may be.
Blessings
Van

[Acebird]

I checked them by knocking on the side and listening for a buzz but I didnt hear any.

As was already said do not disturb.  Very bad practice even in summer.  All it does is needlessly stress the bees.

Inspections: very bad practice????

No Van not inspections.  Knocking on the hive with the intention of listening to the roar.  They go into the roar because they think the hive is under attack, like from a bear of some other animal.

[FatherMichael]

Dr. Leo Sharashkin once said that some beekeepers in Europe visit their hives once a year to collect the honey.

That means they might find dead hives or hives that died and were taken over by a swarm and produced a little or healthy hives that produced more.

Personally, it grieves me when one bee dies!  To lose a whole hive would be devastating.  It would just kill me.

[van from Arkansas]

I checked them by knocking on the side and listening for a buzz but I didnt hear any.

As was already said do not disturb.  Very bad practice even in summer.  All it does is needlessly stress the bees.

Inspections: very bad practice????

No Van not inspections.  Knocking on the hive with the intention of listening to the roar.  They go into the roar because they think the hive is under attack, like from a bear of some other animal.

Ace, I understand, thanks for the correction.
Blessings

[rgennaro]

Xerox did you check? I could not hear mine either but today I had a brief peak and they are there

[TheHoneyPump]

As the outdoor temperature goes down, colder, the bee cluster gets more compact.  The outer layer of bees, the mantle, are barely above their chill coma temperature.  Those bees are still - quiet - lethargic.  There will be no buzzing or fuzzing if you go knocking on a hive in cold temperatures.  The hive will be quiet.  Do not disturb, as doing so disrupts the intricate insulation layer being provided by the mantle bees.  Which throws their heat/energy off balance and will kill a bunch of mantle bees.
Wait. Go bang on the hive when temperatures are well above 42 deg F, 6 deg C.  Below that temperature, leave them alone.

Inspections during the BEE SEASON are essential to good management of the hive.  Disruptions or Inspections during winter -- will kill your bees.  Do your winter beekeeping during the bee season.  Meaning do all your work in spring, summer, fall; making sure that the bees are healthy, low parasite level, and have an adequate supply of winter stores.  Once the temperature drops there is nothing you can or should be doing. Other than walking by and clearing snow/ice from the entrance. 

Come spring, when temperatures return to being steady above that 42 deg F range, THEN you will know if the hive is alive or not by the amount of bees coming/going at the entrance.

Chinook here currently.  -37 deg C to +3 deg C in 36 hours.  The super quiet hives figured dead from over a week of bitter bitter cold were quick to blow my coffee breathe back at me this afternoon ... they are fine. :)

[CoolBees]

@TheHoneyPump - you always seem to "hit a home run" with your writing. Thank you for the excellent advice.

I hope your bees come out of winter in great shape, Sir.

[Bob Wilson]

HoneyPump. Thanks for the advice. Valuable to us new beeks. It helps me to stop second guessing myself, and heed earlier advice from Michael. Often the best thing to do when you don't know what to do... is nothing.

[Donovan J]

As the outdoor temperature goes down, colder, the bee cluster gets more compact.  The outer layer of bees, the mantle, are barely above their chill coma temperature.  Those bees are still - quiet - lethargic.  There will be no buzzing or fuzzing if you go knocking on a hive in cold temperatures.  The hive will be quiet.  Do not disturb, as doing so disrupts the intricate insulation layer being provided by the mantle bees.  Which throws their heat/energy off balance and will kill a bunch of mantle bees.
Wait. Go bang on the hive when temperatures are well above 42 deg F, 6 deg C.  Below that temperature, leave them alone.

Inspections during the BEE SEASON are essential to good management of the hive.  Disruptions or Inspections during winter -- will kill your bees.  Do your winter beekeeping during the bee season.  Meaning do all your work in spring, summer, fall; making sure that the bees are healthy, low parasite level, and have an adequate supply of winter stores.  Once the temperature drops there is nothing you can or should be doing. Other than walking by and clearing snow/ice from the entrance. 

Come spring, when temperatures return to being steady above that 42 deg F range, THEN you will know if the hive is alive or not by the amount of bees coming/going at the entrance.

Chinook here currently.  -37 deg C to +3 deg C in 36 hours.  The super quiet hives figured dead from over a week of bitter bitter cold were quick to blow my coffee breathe back at me this afternoon ... they are fine. :)

Thanks for the info. It is quite warmer now and all the snow is gone.

[FatherMichael]

Thanks, Ian.

[incognito]

Come spring, when temperatures return to being steady above that 42 deg F range, THEN you will know if the hive is alive or not by the amount of bees coming/going at the entrance.

Please elaborate a bit.Above 42 degrees for how many hours a day? One, three, five, twelve?

[TheHoneyPump]

It says - steady above, meaning always.

[incognito]

Thanks for the clarification.

[van from Arkansas]

I'd do what Ian (Honey Pump) says.

The HoneyPump is NOT, Ian.  Two different beeks, yes both of Canada, yes both commercial beeks, but different fellas.

Van

[Donovan J]

Update: It was 55 degrees yesterday so I decided to check on them and it is confirmed that they are dead. I have two packages coming this spring so hopefully their work doesn't go to waste.

[incognito]

Update: It was 55 degrees yesterday so I decided to check on them and it is confirmed that they are dead. I have two packages coming this spring so hopefully their work doesn't go to waste.

It is sad to hear that.

[van from Arkansas]

Xerox, sorry for your loss but very glad that you ordered packages.
Van

[Bob Wilson]

Xerox. Sorry for the loss
However, you gotta change your profile picture to upright. You are killing me here. 

[Ben Framed]

Xerox. Sorry for the loss
However, you gotta change your profile picture to upright. You are killing me here. 

me too lol

[Donovan J]

Xerox. Sorry for the loss
However, you gotta change your profile picture to upright. You are killing me here. 

Sorry for some reason it wont put it upright