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MEMBER & GUEST INTERACTION SECTION => THE COFFEE HOUSE ((( SOCIAL - ROOM ))) => Topic started by: jalentour on August 26, 2021, 01:48:39 pm

Title: News from our friends down under
Post by: jalentour on August 26, 2021, 01:48:39 pm
It's been tough getting reliable information from our friends in Australia.  I have heard of very restrictive lock downs and a little about protests.  I have also read that the government is censoring information in country.  Can anyone report how you are doing and how bad conditions are?
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on August 26, 2021, 02:15:28 pm
Jalentour I have heard similar reports.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Skeggley on August 27, 2021, 04:55:41 pm
Hi guys, I hope you are all well.
Here in the West we are not in lock down and have no corona cases due to our governments strict measures regarding entering the state. Yes there have been protests but they are a minority mainly consisting of QAnon conspiracists.
Over East NSW, Victoria and our capital Canberra, yes, that?s our capital alright, have areas of lock down due to the Delta strain outbreaks caused by, as usual, the minority not playing the game and slow government action. I am hearing of protests over there and see on the news Q placards and the like at these anti lockdown protests. The locals I speak to have had enough of the lockdowns and are blaming the anti vaxers more than the government and I feel for them. I?ll not be drawn into the conspiracy theory?s as I bundle them into the Flat Earth mob and you can?t argue with idiots as I don?t have the experience.😉
NT, Tasmania, QLD and South Oz are all pretty much clear and free to live life normally except, of course, to travel.
It?s being stressed to us, by the government, that vaccinations are the way forward and the rollout is finally in full swing. A quick google says 26% fully vaccinated.
I?m not sure why you?re finding it difficult to get info from here nor do I know anything about censorship but that may be just because they haven?t told us.😆
I think that pretty much covers it and I?m sure others over East will add to and correct me, as I say here in the West it?s business as usual with the economy booming propping up the rest of the country, once again as usual.😉
My local area here in the South West has had a lot of rain this winter and the trees are looking good so I?m expecting a bee busy spring.😁
And if it sounds like I?m talking up my state Western Australia, google it and you?ll see I?m not just talking the talk.😊
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on August 27, 2021, 05:58:41 pm
Skeggley glad to hear you folks in the West are faring well..  Wishing a "bee busy Spring"..
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on September 03, 2021, 09:36:05 am
jalentour Could it be your concerns  are right and folks from East Australia are particular about what they might post openly? Even here at 🐝 Beemaster?

Wishing you folks from DownUnder the best!

Phillip
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: jalentour on September 03, 2021, 02:23:04 pm
I am reading on Twitter and other sites that a 24 hour trucker strike has begun.  Truckers are protesting the lockdown, mandatory vaccines and masks by blocking highways and major intersections.  They park their rigs and walk away. 
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Skeggley on September 03, 2021, 10:42:35 pm
NSW and VIC are in lock down because of the minority that think the virus is a hoax and continue to flaunt the laws.
The truck drivers were from one company, Toll, and it was because of the lockdown toll on their livelihoods. Yes mandatory vaccines was also an issue. We had a truck driver enter our state and his company tested him and was found to have had the virus. Fortunately we did not go into lock down because the truck driver and his employer followed the rules and did the right thing and kudo?s to them.
Australia has taken the same tact as NZ and aimed for a zero policy which was successful and we were all living relatively normal lives until delta was brought into the country and hotel quarantine failed but the reality was that it could never have been a long term solution anyway.
Due to this normality we were all laid back when it came to the vaccine so the vaccination rates were low but as mentioned in my previous post, ramping up.
To think or even suggest that my countrymen and women over East are hesitant about speaking openly is preposterous, even on this forum, us Aussies aren?t like that and besides there?s no reason to be?. This is how fool conspiracy theory?s start with seeds planted, and the only reason I?m biting is to nip it in the bud.
Perhaps there?s another reason we haven?t been frequenting this forum as much lately.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on September 03, 2021, 11:01:50 pm
Do you know what the death percentage rate of the poor folks that have contacted the virus in your country?
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on September 04, 2021, 01:15:48 am
>Over East NSW, Victoria and our capital Canberra, yes, that?s our capital alright, have areas of lock down due to the Delta strain outbreaks caused by, as usual, the minority not playing the game and slow government action. I am hearing of protests over there and see on the news Q placards and the like at these anti lockdown protests. The locals I speak to have had enough of the lockdowns and are blaming the anti vaxers more than the government and I feel for them. I?ll not be drawn into the conspiracy theory?s as I bundle them into the Flat Earth mob and you can?t argue with idiots as I don?t have the experience.😉

>The truck drivers were from one company, Toll, and it was because of the lockdown toll on their livelihood.

>This is how fool conspiracy theory?s start with seeds planted, and the only reason I?m biting is to nip it in the bud.
Perhaps there?s another reason we haven?t been frequenting this forum as much lately.

Seems you are a might touchy Skeg....


Edit:
"Perhaps there?s another reason we haven?t been frequenting this forum as much lately."

I do not know who the "we" are you speak of. Since this post I am happy to see, out of the last 4 post, 3 of those post have been by some good folks and members, your fellow countrymen.. And as always, they are appreciated and welcome here. And even as I type this at this hour. 75 percent of the members which are logged in are from your Country..




Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on September 04, 2021, 09:12:06 am

The truck drivers were from one company, Toll, and it was because of the lockdown toll on their livelihoods.
There is no lockdowns in this country yet and long haul truck drivers are being replaced by computers.  So they have a different beef.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Geoff on September 07, 2021, 03:08:41 am
 
       G'day y'all,  OK here in the state of Victoria at this time we are in a pretty strict lockdown which does not allow visitors in your home, travel restricted to 5 kilometres and only for necessary goods, medications and the like. Right now we have a son in hospital following major surgery and an old school mate of mine in the same predicament and neither are allowed visitors. The wives take in fresh clothes and things to be left at the front desk for them and pick up things to take home.
      Today there were 246 new Covid cases in the state and the media and politicians are spruiking the state has this number when almost everyone of them are probably occurring within 100 K's of Central Melbourne while in the other 180,000 squ. kilometres there has not been a certified case for months. A lot of the transmission is by people not meeting the  rules of  the lockdown  and many of these could be caused by language problems. What is not helping is a war between federal and state governments over the allotment of the Covid vaccines while at the same time they are screaming out get vaccinated when there is not enough vaccine for everybody who like to get the vac "yesterday" .
       In most cases if one registered to get vaccinated today it maybe a couple of months on the waiting list to get the jab.       
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on September 07, 2021, 04:35:17 am
Quote
Geoff
Right now we have a son in hospital following major surgery and an old school mate of mine in the same predicament and neither are allowed visitors. The wives take in fresh clothes and things to be left at the front desk for them and pick up things to take home.

Geoff I hope your son makes a full and speedy recovery. Same for your old classmate. We were not locked down but we have had similar restrictions in the local hospitals in my area. One of our friends took a bad fall, (broken hip). We could not visit or drop of a much wanted milkshake.  Poor fellow really wanted that milkshake...
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on September 07, 2021, 06:20:50 pm
A couple of interesting things here and I don't know if they are the same in other places:  I live in a mask mandate state, been through the lockdown, distancing, etc.  We are doing the whole masking indoors and in public spaces again. Our cases for this August are about the same number as August last year.  That's after we had 70+% vaccination compliance. 
https://public.tableau.com/app/profile/oregon.health.authority.covid.19/viz/OregonHealthAuthorityCOVID-19DataDashboard/COVID-19EPICases

You have to dig around in that database a bit to get the info.  They didn't really make it consumer friendly.  My point is that this virus seems to follow a seasonal path.  Additionally, all the masking and distancing seems to make no difference in the overall infection rate.  This seems especially true with the more contagious varients.  The vaccine may be making a dent in the death rate when infected, but we don't really have all the data on that one. 
Here is the disease severity data.
https://public.tableau.com/app/profile/oregon.health.authority.covid.19/viz/OregonCOVID-19CaseDemographicsandDiseaseSeverityStatewide/DiseaseDeathData

Last estimate is the about 20% of cases in my state were among Vaccinated people, but that was before the August surge.

There is a caveat to the Oregon reports and that is that they do a lot of presumptive reporting.  As far as I am concerned, that makes the entire thing useless for numbers, but probably OK for trends.

Anyway, I'll go back to the point I keep making and that is that we have to live with this thing and figuring that out sooner rather than later will be better for all of us.  It's here.  It's staying.  At some point, most of us are going to be exposed. 



Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on September 08, 2021, 08:33:29 am
At some point, most of us are going to be exposed.
No doubt about it but who will die and who will have medical problems for the rest of their life due to the side effects of covid?  We are starting to get a little push back from insurance companies but in the long run who is going to pay for bad decisions?
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on September 08, 2021, 08:39:38 am
My point is that this virus seems to follow a seasonal path.
Yes it followers behavior when people let their guard down during the holidays or events.  Nothing earth shattering about the results.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on September 08, 2021, 11:26:00 am
Thought of a question for our friends in Australia.  Came up in a conversation about Japan. 

Is there pushback from the population about your government not buying the vaccine earlier?  Any thoughts on why they didn't.  Australia is not the only country that made that decision.  Just wondering if they have explained why?
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: jalentour on September 21, 2021, 07:23:00 pm
Well Skeggley and Geoff,
Looks like things are changing.
Do you guys see this on your local news?
https://citizenfreepress.com/breaking/working-class-rebellion-in-melbourne-20000-freedom-lovers-march-on-parliament/
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Geoff on September 21, 2021, 09:53:11 pm

    We,ve just had a 6.0 earthquake to remind us that Mother Nature is still with us  !  1`  Also Kathy we've copped the Portland Virus, thugs are taking on the police in Melbourne's CBD.  Very ugly.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on September 21, 2021, 10:09:10 pm
It seems there are troubles all over the world in one shape form or fashion. Geoff I hope things are better for your Son and your classmate.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: jalentour on September 22, 2021, 12:36:38 am
I think you will be ok.
https://apnews.com/article/new-zealand-earthquake-tsunami-warning-215ef80cf3eb9b2638d12bc81ed3e254

So without BF commentary, what is going on ?

BF  can you just shut up and listen?  Every comment you need to respond?   JSUAGA
I'm out
J
God bless you all.

Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on September 22, 2021, 05:05:38 am
I think you will be ok.
https://apnews.com/article/new-zealand-earthquake-tsunami-warning-215ef80cf3eb9b2638d12bc81ed3e254

So without BF commentary, what is going on ?

BF  can you just shut up and listen?  Every comment you need to respond?   JSUAGA
I'm out
J
God bless you all.

You seem a little stressed Joe. My reply 18 was my first reply under this heading since I placed my post number (11) September 7th, which was 14 days ago on 'this particular' topic. That is not replying to every comment as you state, there were 7 post since... And, I did not reply to your comment 16, but to Geoffs' post 17.

Adding: Looking back, I have posted 3 times in the past 34 post here. This includes 'every' topic on the forum......
What part of my last reply do you object too? The part about problems all over the world; Or expressing to Geoff, my hope that things are better concerning his Son and Classmate?




 
 
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on September 22, 2021, 11:13:40 am
Quote
Also Kathy we've copped the Portland Virus, thugs are taking on the police in Melbourne's CBD.  Very ugly.

I am not in favor of thuggery, but I do understand the protesting.  We have a very few people doing some actual reporting in this country.  If some of these numbers hold up, we are overcounting deaths from this virus by as much as 50%.  Here is one report.
https://fullmeasure.news/news/cover-story/counting-covid

IF we are being misled, it is legitimate to ask why.  At some point, it is legitimate to demand that they answer the question.  The question of when we force our governments to be what they are supposed to be...protectors of our freedoms and not directors of our lives, is always a sticky one. 
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: salvo on September 22, 2021, 06:56:59 pm
Hi Folks,

The Aussies sure know how to handle protestors.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10005641/Policemen-douse-elderly-woman-pepper-spray-Melbournes-anti-lockdown-protests.html

Dang protestors.

Sal
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Skeggley on September 23, 2021, 08:38:15 pm
Well Skeggley and Geoff,
Looks like things are changing.
Do you guys see this on your local news?
https://citizenfreepress.com/breaking/working-class-rebellion-in-melbourne-20000-freedom-lovers-march-on-parliament/
Hi mate, if you?re still with us, yes, it does seem to be getting ugly over there unfortunately.
We have been getting told there are professional protesters creating the poisonous atmosphere at many of these protests.
Yes our federal government is being accused of an incompetent vaccine roll out and certain state premiers of acting too slow. Hindsight is a wonderful thing isn?t it.
Many businesses will soon refuse access to unvaccinated tradesmen and women. The Casino here is only going to allow vaccinated patrons. To me none of this seems logical as only the unvaccinated are at risk and I can see no benefit to the business itself as the virus will continue to be in society once the restrictions are lifted when the numbers are met.
Interesting though I haven?t seen the lady?s pepper spraying and mistreatment in the regular news reports.🤔
Still no restrictions here and the greatest game on earth, the AFL Grand Final, is to be played here in Perth for the first, and likely only, time this weekend. If anyone gets a chance to watch it, watch it, you won?t regret it, and let us know what you reckon. Yes the rules can be a bit fluid and hard to follow but action and hits, check it out.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: jalentour on September 24, 2021, 02:37:22 am
Skeggley,
Australian protests are making world wide news.
Protesters are not being portreyed as paid, more like the common man and woman.
We see scenes of police shooting unarmed demonstrators in the back with rubber bullets.  Beating men and women.
Very aggressive anti-terrorist police action. 
Closed state borders.
Business closed.
What is going on?
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on September 24, 2021, 08:46:09 am
To me none of this seems logical as only the unvaccinated are at risk and I can see no benefit to the business itself as the virus will continue to be in society once the restrictions are lifted when the numbers are met.
Sadly this is not the case with a virus.  As infections spike the virus will mutate eventually requiring new vaccines to combat.  This virus could be defeated but we are in such a mis-information world these days it looks like it is going to happen the hard way.  The country, group, or location that works together will have a booming economy while those that don't will have a great recession.  It actually is a prime opportunity to get back at China because their vaccines is junk.  Another benefit to us is as the virtual walls go up every time there is outbreak.  We will be forced to make things here again giving the survivors jobs.  This could make immigration even more of a problem then it is right now.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on September 24, 2021, 03:11:03 pm
Well look on the bright side Brian. How many folks do you know that contracted the flu virus in the past two years? I do not know of one.....  Have you read any flu reports tallying the year totals flu cases in 2020? I have not looked....  Has the dreaded and deadly flu finally been defeated?
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Skeggley on September 24, 2021, 09:48:52 pm
Sadly this is not the case with a virus.  As infections spike the virus will mutate eventually requiring new vaccines to combat.  This virus could be defeated but we are in such a mis-information world these days it looks like it is going to happen the hard way.  The country, group, or location that works together will have a booming economy while those that don't will have a great recession.  It actually is a prime opportunity to get back at China because their vaccines is junk.  Another benefit to us is as the virtual walls go up every time there is outbreak.  We will be forced to make things here again giving the survivors jobs.  This could make immigration even more of a problem then it is right now.
Hi Ace, to be clear I?m not an antivaxer, I?m not trying to derail this thread nor am I a scientist but my understanding, and I may be wrong I often am, simply put is that even if vaccinated it is still possible to carry and transmit the virus and vaccination was to minimise our bodies reaction to it and to keep the hospitals from overflowing so it will never be truely defeated and as it already is it will mutate over time so booster shots will be required like the flu shots.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on September 24, 2021, 10:14:32 pm
Quote
vaccination was to minimise our bodies reaction to it and to keep the hospitals from overflowing so it will never be truely defeated and as it already is it will mutate over time so booster shots will be required like the flu shots.

You got it.  So the states here and the countries around the world that are trying to "end the pandemic" are failing and will continue to fail.  In the meantime, the governments are taking unprecedented powers and I don't have any faith that they will want to give up those powers.  In my state, my governor seems to look for reasons to tell people what to do or not do even if it doesn't follow the science.  She doesn't have the legal right to do that and it is most concerning to me that so many happily follow illegal orders...But hey, it's for our own good, don't you know?   :wink:
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Beelab on September 25, 2021, 03:13:32 am
I live in Northern NSW, in the Queensland border bubble. We never had any cases, just people from lockdown Sydney coming up ?for an essential job?, and then visiting shops instead of isolating at their essential job. Because of one person dodging health orders, we just entered another 7 day lock down in Byron Bay Shire.
Byron Bay/Mullumbimby are called the anti vax capital of Australia. Our state NSW wants to ease restrictions once a certain vaccination rate is achieved. In about 2 weeks.
Then all the rich hot spot Sydney people will want to come up here for a holiday.
Could be disastrous, considering our limited regional ICU beds and the high number of unvaccinated.

There are plenty of vaccines available now. Even a choice of vaccines.

The riots in Melbourne were ugly, protestors seem to be led by right wing string pullers, qanon type. Only a small percentage were actual workers, according to companies who actually employ those tradies.
The protests all fell apart for lack of leadership and quarrels among protesters.
Since one protestor returned a positive covid result, it is feared this thing might turn out a super spreader.
It?s just so stupid.

Jalentour, you may want to change your source of world news. It appears your source just reports on sensationalistic snippets, a far cry from the very complex reality.

All in all we are doing pretty well in Australia and I?m proud to be Aussie.
Skeggs had said it all from the west. Hi from the east coast Skeggs!

Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on September 25, 2021, 08:57:23 am
Hi Ace, to be clear I?m not an antivaxer, I?m not trying to derail this thread nor am I a scientist but my understanding, and I may be wrong I often am, simply put is that even if vaccinated it is still possible to carry and transmit the virus and vaccination was to minimise our bodies reaction to it and to keep the hospitals from overflowing so it will never be truely defeated and as it already is it will mutate over time so booster shots will be required like the flu shots.
You are correct but the flu has never shut down any economy.  It has never limited anyone's freedoms.  A pandemic is quite different.  What is sad is that we have the technology and the where with all to stop covid dead if we had the unity that we have had in the past when fighting world wars.  There is no doubt in my mind that pharma is taking advantage of the situation to the point that they may be involved in supporting the right wingers to keep covid going.  Certainly not beyond the capability of corporate America.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: jalentour on September 25, 2021, 12:15:09 pm
Beelab,
Thank you for your comment.  I consider your view reliable input.
Same for Skeggley and Geoff.
My reading sources are far more than PBS or the BBC.  That's why a came to a beekeeper site and asked locals from Australia to comment.
My take on the situation in Australia is the vast majority are in agreement with their state governors lock downs and are pro vax.
Good luck with your bees!
j
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on September 25, 2021, 03:08:33 pm
Quote
You are correct but the flu has never shut down any economy.  It has never limited anyone's freedoms.  A pandemic is quite different.  What is sad is that we have the technology and the where with all to stop covid dead if we had the unity that we have had in the past when fighting world wars.  There is no doubt in my mind that pharma is taking advantage of the situation to the point that they may be involved in supporting the right wingers to keep covid going.  Certainly not beyond the capability of corporate America.

We have had pandemics before.  We have had flu pandemics before.  You are correct that they did not shut us down.  Doing so this time was our choice and it was a bad one.
The case can't be made that the shutdowns did any good because we can compare to countries and states that did not shut down.  There is no statistical difference in outcomes, only in the timing of various surges and peeks.  Those who are putting their faith in vaccines are foolis on a couple of counts 1. they are not preventing the spread and mutation of the virus and 2. the people who are using this as an excuse to grab power are doing so in spite of the vaccination rate.  My state being a great example of stupid rules after telling everyone that life could go back to normal if only we'd follow instructions and get vaccinated.  We do not have the technology to stop this or any virus.

The rest of your comment is stupid so I'll skip that.




Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Geoff on September 25, 2021, 07:26:34 pm

   Like most of the media the vision and voices can form ones impression of what is actually happening but the events in Melbourne seem to be thugs or would be thugs just out to have a scrap with authorities and should not be described as protesters but Rioters.
  As for the image of the lady on the ground being pepper sprayed takes me back to the shots of one police with a knee on George Floyds neck while his  off-
siders stood by and just watch another human beings life snuffed out. The vision of the other three just standing there  watching turned my guts over and those are still as clear today as it was then. If four trained officers could not control one man it beggars belief.l
   I am  not pro George Floyds character nor anti-pro police and authority but how often do we get a true representation of so many events happening at home and around the world.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on September 25, 2021, 08:28:55 pm
Quote
Like most of the media the vision and voices can form ones impression of what is actually happening but the events in Melbourne seem to be thugs or would be thugs just out to have a scrap with authorities and should not be described as protesters but Rioters.
  As for the image of the lady on the ground being pepper sprayed takes me back to the shots of one police with a knee on George Floyds neck while his  off-
siders stood by and just watch another human beings life snuffed out. The vision of the other three just standing there  watching turned my guts over and those are still as clear today as it was then. If four trained officers could not control one man it beggars belief.l
   I am  not pro George Floyds character nor anti-pro police and authority but how often do we get a true representation of so many events happening at home and around the world.

pepper spray is not fatal even if it feels like it might be.  :grin:
 The view of the Floyd thing is less clear when you watch the entire video.  The only part of it that bothered me is that the officer should have been aware of when Floyd passed out and gotten off of him.  Wouldn't have saved Floyds life, but might have saved all the officers careers.  The drugs killed Floyd.  He chose to take the drugs. He chose to be combative.
 An entire segment of our population made him into a hero and that's not a very good model for kids coming along.  You'd think they might want to uphold as a role model someone of better character.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on September 25, 2021, 08:43:51 pm
Quote
Kathyp
We have had pandemics before.  We have had flu pandemics before.  You are correct that they did not shut us down.  Doing so this time was our choice and it was a bad one.

Kathy a member of my family died in 2012 at the age of 99. I remember her telling of the horror, as a little girl before starting school, of losing members of her family during the Spanish Flu epidemic of 1917. I have not studied this and do not have numbers and details.

Maybe some of you here from America or Australia know what went on then? Where there shutdowns etc?
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on September 25, 2021, 08:56:56 pm
Quote
I have not studied this and do not have numbers and details.

I don't think anyone has exact numbers.

There were some lockdowns and some closures.  The problem with the stats is that there were 3 waves of the Spanish flu and where one area might have avoided massive infections in one wave, they were caught in the next.

Most areas told people how to protect themselves and let people make their own decisions.  Some places forced various measures.  Those places that forced masks, like San Francisco, later found that masks were minimally effective if at all. We know this to be true now with most of the masks people are wearing.  They are either the wrong material or not worn properly, or both. 
The only thing that would work would be everyone staying at home until the virus was gone...which in theory would happen if it ran out of hosts...but the first person who was still infected would start the entire thing over.

https://unherd.com/thepost/anders-tegnell-sweden-won-the-argument-on-covid/

The Swedes had it right.  The Brits were right this time to not go back into lockdown.  The states not locking down have if right.  The rest of us are suffering from political control issues and lies.


Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on September 26, 2021, 09:19:51 am
The drugs killed Floyd. 
There appears to be forensic evidence that this is false.  The cop was found guilty.
 
Quote
An entire segment of our population made him into a hero and that's not a very good model for kids coming along.

A hero?  I don't think so.  A victim of racial bias that clearly exist in law enforcement.  This is the sad truth that kids witnessed even if they weren't of the colored race.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on September 26, 2021, 01:31:46 pm
https://abcnews.go.com/US/george-floyds-final-funeral-service-burial-place-houston/story?id=71130521
https://www.gettyimages.com/videos/george-floyd-funeral

Quote
There appears to be forensic evidence that this is false.  The cop was found guilty.

Those are two separate things.  I know what the autopsy report says.  I also watched the entire video and know that Floyd was complaining of not being able to breathe before anyone touched him.  We will never know, but if no one had ever touched him, he likely would have arrested anyway. Without immediate help he would have died.

Understand that I am not defending all that the cops did.  When Floyd was clearly subdued, the cop should have gotten off of him.  up to that point, the officer was following procedure.  What I am saying is that this was blown up for political reasons and making a career violent drug addicted criminal into some kind of standard for people to admire is wrong. 
I also am not condemning all that the cops did.  Floyd was a big guy, he was high, he was resisting arrest, he had a violent criminal history.  Taking him down as they did was the right thing to do for everyone. 

There was nothing in the trial about this being racial.  I am not surprised that you go there because you go there with everything.  It is interesting though that this is the kind of guy that many in the black community want held up for their kids to see and then you wonder why you have 100s of kids shot in places like Chicago every month. 
Maybe pick better role models?

Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on September 27, 2021, 08:38:52 am
If Floyd would have died on his own without the cops intervention then why is he proven guilty and serving a sentence in jail?
I am not sticking up for Floyd.  He was a criminal not a hero.  What he stands for is a clear indication of racism not a standard for good behavior.  If you strip away that reality then you will think as you do.  Which doesn't surprise me.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on September 27, 2021, 10:30:21 pm
Quote
What he stands for is a clear indication of racism not a standard for good behavior.

I don't disagree with you.  If the cop had been anything other than white, he would not have been convicted of murder...although the way many blacks hate Asians, an Asian might have been convicted of murder.  If we had not had all the BLM and Antifa stuff scaring the crap out of the system, the cop would not have been convicted of murder.  He would not have been charged with murder which many legal people thougt was an overcharge.
At a time the rest of us could not attend our grandparents funerals or gather in church, Floyd had a huge funeral with many dignitaries and a horse-drawn herse. 


So yes, there is racism involved.  At best, manslaughter or the usual punishment, if it was to be severe, would be dismissal from the force.  This went to the extreme in punishment because of the social climate, not the actions of the cop on Floyd or those watching. 

I am not saying anyone made the case that Floyd was a good guy.  They did all that they did when he died in spite of his past behavior and the behavior that brought him into contact with the police the last time.  They upheld a criminal as a saint without comment on what he really was..

Guess it doesn't matter now.  We have decided that we are not going to be a united nation.  We are going to have separate everything according to race.  I heard someone say today that BLM and Co. have achieved exactly what the KKK and white supremicists wanted.  God bless the progressives... or maybe YOUR god can bless them.  I don't know that we have the same god. 
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: gww on September 28, 2021, 01:59:43 am
The cop was showing the whole neighbor hood, including an 11 year old, who was boss and he got what he earned. 
Cheers
gww
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on September 28, 2021, 08:19:08 am
They upheld a criminal as a saint without comment on what he really was..
You have no clue what it takes to be declared a saint.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: jalentour on September 28, 2021, 10:25:55 am
I have no words for these scenes out of Australia.  They get worse as you scroll down.


https://citizenfreepress.com/breaking/brutal-videos-from-australia-mother-arrested-in-front-of-children/
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on September 28, 2021, 12:12:41 pm
Quote
I have no words for these scenes out of Australia.  They get worse as you scroll down.

I completely support people protesting government overreach.  If we allow our governments to do as they are doing in the name of this emergency, they will continue.  My governor has continued her emergency powers and rules outside our state constitution.  In a sane world, she'd be booted out of office.  In this world, people are going around praising her lawlessness because she's "keeping us safe". 

When you habituate a population to following illegal orders, and taking your freedom in the name of keeping you safe, you are done as a free people.

but remember, the press makes things look worse than they are, most of the time.  The exceptions are Antifa and BLM riots in which case they can stand in front of burning buildings and talk about mostly peaceful protests   :wink:
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on September 28, 2021, 03:09:46 pm
Quote
Kathyp
I completely support people protesting government overreach.  If we allow our governments to do as they are doing in the name of this emergency, they will continue.  My governor has continued her emergency powers and rules outside our state constitution.  In a sane world, she'd be booted out of office.  In this world, people are going around praising her lawlessness because she's "keeping us safe".

When you habituate a population to following illegal orders, and taking your freedom in the name of keeping you safe, you are done as a free people.

but remember, the press makes things look worse than they are, most of the time.  The exceptions are Antifa and BLM riots in which case they can stand in front of burning buildings and talk about mostly peaceful protests   :wink:

 
As an American, lawful assembly is guaranteed in our Constitution. I agree with you as per our constitutional law here in America as we are guaranteed such rights.
I for one, do not know what the law, or laws are in Australia. The happenings there in Australia may very well be within the bounds of their constitution without overreach? I would not think so but as I said, I for one do not know..

I do know, lack of law and order, which allowed rioters to commit unlawful acts and destruction as per the riots you mentioned above, a solid example of complete lack of law and order here in America during that time, along with a clear negligence of keeping law and order by the officials in charge at those places was displayed, demonstrated, and exemplified.. Law and order must be kept and balanced; 'but within the bounds of overreach' as you state Kathy.











Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on October 01, 2021, 07:13:47 pm
https://www.wsj.com/articles/australia-to-end-travel-ban-in-pivot-to-living-with-covid-19-11633071665
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Geoff on October 13, 2021, 07:31:12 pm
  This morning news, our state premier who a week or so ago presented us with the Road Map out of this mess we have scored an Australian one day record of over 2000 new Covid cases  !  !   All at the same time his party is dealing with branch stackings for protected candidates.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: jalentour on October 14, 2021, 12:20:17 am
Geoff,
I have news for you.  More to your government.
Covid will be with us forever.  Just like all the other Covid.
See your pre 2018 can of Lysol.  It kills covid.  Dead.
J
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on October 14, 2021, 03:01:33 pm
National News | Breaking National News and ... - Courier Mail
Search domain couriermail.com.auhttps://www.couriermail.com.au ? news ? national
If you are fully vaccinated against Covid the next step to improve your immunity may be to actually catch the virus.

Hum........   :shocked:
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Geoff on October 14, 2021, 07:42:17 pm

  Friday update.. Number of cases are now ten times what they were a week ago and deaths have also escalated so where is our premiers' great Road Map leading the community ?  ?
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Skeggley on October 14, 2021, 11:34:57 pm
Keep in mind Geoff is in Victoria and is not a direct reflection of our entire country.
As I have said previously my state, WA, has no restrictions within the state only people entering the state. Our unemployment figures are the lowest in the country and our economy is booming on much so that tradesmen are in high demand and training centres are booked out.
Our Premier has said that we will observe the other states opening, assess and make decisions from there and restrictions will likely be reintroduced once borders are opened.
Vaccines, although not compulsory are becoming mandatory for most industries, the mining sector will not employ unvaccinated workers from January next year, both blue and white collars. The precedence has been set??.
Hopefully NSW, ACT and Victoria can move forward safely and the new normal life can resume. Our thoughts are with them.
On the plus side, from reports, Jarrah is flowering profusely down South so am prepping for a bumper year.
:)
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on October 15, 2021, 11:32:52 am
Quote
  Friday update.. Number of cases are now ten times what they were a week ago and deaths have also escalated so where is our premiers' great Road Map leading the community

There is no road map.  :wink:
By the time any country other than China knew there was a problem, it was too late. Even if we had known earlier, I don't know that it would have made any difference.  Vaccines will help.  New anti-virals will help.  The road to the end is through the middle, and onward.  There is no stopping or controlling the thing. 
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on October 16, 2021, 08:55:20 am
Stopping would require a totalitarian state.  Controlling would require cooperation from the general public.  The economic stress we are feeling today is mostly due to the general public.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on October 16, 2021, 12:40:37 pm
Quote
Stopping would require a totalitarian state.  Controlling would require cooperation from the general public.  The economic stress we are feeling today is mostly due to the general public.

Then China should have been able to stop it, shouldn't they?
What do you think the general public ought to be doing that they are not? Things that would make a difference, not just feel good stuff?

The economic stress we are feeling is due to bad policy.  To the extent that the public is responsible for putting those in office who force bad, and often illegal policy on us, then yes, the public is responsible. 
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: NigelP on October 16, 2021, 03:16:37 pm
Hate to get drawn into topics outside beekeeping but...... this has been situation that no-one (or country) was fully prepared for.
There have been many mistakes made and many successes.
Difficult to judge all of them as situation is still currently active.
All I know is many people  KNOW what should have been done...but only with the benefit of hindsight.
If only I knew what the national lottery number were before they drew it......
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on October 17, 2021, 09:08:42 am
Quote
Stopping would require a totalitarian state.  Controlling would require cooperation from the general public.  The economic stress we are feeling today is mostly due to the general public.

Then China should have been able to stop it, shouldn't they?
They did.

Quote
The economic stress we are feeling is due to bad policy.
For sure, from republican Trump supporters and wannabes.  Biden's mandatory vaccines is working.  Too bad republicans stalled the recovery and the economy has taken the hit.  The only thing hurting China is that they are tied to our economy.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on October 17, 2021, 12:26:21 pm
Quote
All I know is many people  KNOW what should have been done...but only with the benefit of hindsight.
If only I knew what the national lottery number were before they drew it......

Lol.  As do we all.

my issue is not that we didn't know and are still trying to figure things out.  My issues are 1. In the USA we have 3 big agencies who's job it is to be prepared and disseminate info/advice as they learn stuff.  All 3 failed to be prepared.  All 3 failed to disseminate info as they learned things, or to just tell us that they didn't know stuff.  One may have even contributed to the funding of the research that caused this.

USAMRIID is military so that they are quiet is not a surprise.  CDC (centers for disease control) is self explanatory and has been a big fail.  NIH needs a house cleaning starting at the top.

My biggest complaint in this country is that we fail to adapt to new info.  My state, as an example, is back to mask mandates.  Masks don't work for the general public for a number of reasons.  We are back to shutting down classrooms if a kid tests positive for covid.  That's stupid and unnecessary. 
Stuff like that makes me crazy.  It also makes people feel like they are doing something and lets pols say that they did something.  Feelings over facts.  There is never a good outcome when you oporate like that.

Quote
Then China should have been able to stop it, shouldn't they?
They did.

They did not and they have not.  They sure tried.  They welded people into their apartment buildings and stuff like that.  Didn't work.  Do you think we would have had better luck if we'd tried welding doors shut and leaving people to die?  This is your vision of a better future?

Quote
For sure, from republican Trump supporters and wannabes.  Biden's mandatory vaccines is working.  Too bad republicans stalled the recovery and the economy has taken the hit.  The only thing hurting China is that they are tied to our economy.

Lol.  You are obviously not an economist and we already know you use bad sources of info, so...Yup, go on and keep screaming about how TRUMP DID IT!



Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Geoff on October 17, 2021, 07:44:42 pm

        Interesting times ahead. The reports in our state today is 1903 new cases and 7 deaths to be followed up by throwing a lot of doors open at midnight on Thursday which I believe will keep this thread open for a while yet.
        The contrast is that when there were 5 or 6 cases we had immediate shutdowns of 3, 7,  or 14 days duration depending on which way the figures run. My thoughts are with the hospitals and their staff as surely the numbers of cases will rise sharply and the treatment of covid cases is very demanding taking attention away from other patients with urgent medical needs.
         Probably like myself most people have been confused by the facts, figures and rules coming out of the 8 states and territories which appear to be all different to one another including border closures between states and regions within the states.
         The figures I find the most deceiving are in our state of Victoria where our aim is to have 70 or 80 % of the eligible population fully vaccinated but that does not account for the under 16?s which account for about 20 % of people in the state.
        An aside to our problems are the reports from Russia of 30,000 cases a day and hundreds of deaths.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on October 18, 2021, 08:27:46 am
        An aside to our problems are the reports from Russia of 30,000 cases a day and hundreds of deaths.
Pandemics like famine are a way of reducing the poor population in the world.
The US is at an advantage ... we can always import the poor rather quickly as our economy ramps up.  Countries like Russia and China can't do that.  China is trying to do that with birth rate.  But this is very slow.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on October 18, 2021, 08:35:12 am

Lol.  You are obviously not an economist and we already know you use bad sources of info,
Ah, so you admit I have sources!  I do not use right wing, off the wall sources because their accuracy and truthfulness has been proven wrong time and time again if they weren't out and out lies to begin with.  Credibility is an important thing.  If your leader is a pathological liar you don't have much to go on.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on October 18, 2021, 11:53:48 am
Quote
your leader

I do not know who you leader is Ace.
Some jamming News from our friends from DownUnder (The News Boys) speaking of their leader.
 :grin:

https://youtu.be/RClBXAUPwOE
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on October 18, 2021, 01:48:29 pm
Quote
Ah, so you admit I have sources!  I do not use right wing, off the wall sources because their accuracy and truthfulness has been proven wrong time and time again if they weren't out and out lies to begin with.  Credibility is an important thing.


I never thought you didn't have sources, but since I can and have proved you wrong over and over, you obviously use bad sources.  Accuracy and truthfulness are important.  I am glad you realize that.  Now act on it.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on October 19, 2021, 08:24:00 am
I can and have proved you wrong over and over, you obviously use bad sources.
Don't want to rehash all your chest thumping's but that is mostly what it has been.  All long way from proof.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on October 19, 2021, 11:24:02 pm
Oh My !!!!!!

https://youtu.be/1tBKeOmghPg
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Geoff on October 20, 2021, 05:26:56 pm

   Sorry Ben but I dont know where that video originated from but that is possibly the biggest load of tripe I have ever seen on any media. To visit any museum around the world ,you should not find any bows and arrows attributed to indigenous Australians as they just did not use them.
   As for the officials in the clip those uniforms dont belong in Australia, in fact I thought it was that far out I actually had a laugh about it !  !
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on October 20, 2021, 05:34:16 pm
Poor Phil gets sucked into anything he finds on YouTube or Fox fake.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on October 20, 2021, 06:05:57 pm
Poor Phil gets sucked into anything he finds on YouTube or Fox fake.

Well Brian you are barking up the wrong tree once again. It may be fake. I believe Geoff. Each of the following. may be misguided but here are some sources for you..
 
https://thebattlefront.com ? native-aussies-make-it-clear-they-are-strongly-against-forced-vaccination

https://www.facebook.com ? sociafyme ? posts ? 4410335892335489

https://www.gingdu.com ? native-aussies-make-it-clear-they-are-strongly-against-forced-vaccination

https://rumble.com ? vnwppe-native-aussies-make-it-clear-they-are-strongly-against-forced-v

https://www.reddit.com ? r ? inthenews ? comments ? qbtbh6 ? native_aussies_make_it_clea
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on October 20, 2021, 06:10:32 pm

   Sorry Ben but I dont know where that video originated from but that is possibly the biggest load of tripe I have ever seen on any media. To visit any museum around the world ,you should not find any bows and arrows attributed to indigenous Australians as they just did not use them.
   As for the officials in the clip those uniforms dont belong in Australia, in fact I thought it was that far out I actually had a laugh about it !  !

Good news, Thanks Geoff. I am laughing with you.. :cheesy:
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Skeggley on October 20, 2021, 08:07:42 pm

   Sorry Ben but I dont know where that video originated from but that is possibly the biggest load of tripe I have ever seen on any media. To visit any museum around the world ,you should not find any bows and arrows attributed to indigenous Australians as they just did not use them.
   As for the officials in the clip those uniforms dont belong in Australia, in fact I thought it was that far out I actually had a laugh about it !  !

May be fake? It is fake full stop.
The thing is Geoff is that people believe this tripe invented by conspiracists.
It does not make me laugh but sad that anyone can even take this for fact, educated or not. 
Inconceivable.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on October 20, 2021, 08:48:52 pm

   Sorry Ben but I dont know where that video originated from but that is possibly the biggest load of tripe I have ever seen on any media. To visit any museum around the world ,you should not find any bows and arrows attributed to indigenous Australians as they just did not use them.
   As for the officials in the clip those uniforms dont belong in Australia, in fact I thought it was that far out I actually had a laugh about it !  !

May be fake? It is fake full stop.
The thing is Geoff is that people believe this tripe invented by conspiracists.
It does not make me laugh but sad that anyone can even take this for fact, educated or not. 
Inconceivable.

Haa haa you might think fake if one of those arrows were to hit you in the hinnie  :shocked: :cheesy: :wink:

Lighten up Skag, Smile-a-while, it might do you good!!
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on October 21, 2021, 08:22:01 am
Poor Phil gets sucked into anything he finds on YouTube or Fox fake.

Well Brian you are barking up the wrong tree once again. It may be fake.
Phil did you ever think that the fake stories just gets parroted by the other sources?  And you join in...
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: gww on October 21, 2021, 11:25:54 am
Ace
If there was a like button I would push it for your last comment.  Ben, don't take it too bad that I would have liked aces comment but it has crossed my mind in many threads.  Not trying to be mean but just stating a honest belief.
Cheers
gww
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on October 21, 2021, 01:07:07 pm
Quote
Phil did you ever think that the fake stories just gets parroted by the other sources?


Brian that was posted for humor. The biggest source of fake news I have is you! LOL 😂 
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Geoff on October 27, 2021, 07:20:32 pm

   The Premiers' great roadmap to where  ?  Serious about turn yesterday, local acquired cases back up to close to 2000 and 25 deaths. At 6 o'clock tomorrow night Melbournes  (The Covid hotspot in Australia right now) gates get thrown open to the rest of the state.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on October 27, 2021, 10:15:16 pm
0.012 death rate?  And yes I cheated and used a calculator   :grin:

Probably lower than that when you factor in asymptomatic cases and unreported cases. 

So do you, or we, close down the country for what is a very contagious, but very survivable virus?

Of course, here we don't have any borders so I guess it would be easier for you guys :wink:
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on October 27, 2021, 10:54:01 pm
0.012 death rate?  And yes I cheated and used a calculator   :grin:

Probably lower than that when you factor in asymptomatic cases and unreported cases. 

So do you, or we, close down the country for what is a very contagious, but very survivable virus?

Of course, here we don't have any borders so I guess it would be easier for you guys :wink:

Get a load of this Kathy from Yahoo News and others. Florida, has a bit of good news... Considering   The State which rejected mask mandates, shutdowns etc .........

Florida now has America's lowest COVID rate.
Yahoo News
ANDREW ROMANO
October 27, 2021, 5:00 AM

https://www.aol.com/news/florida-now-americas-lowest-covid-090013940.html
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on October 27, 2021, 11:54:18 pm
Quote
Florida now has America's lowest COVID rate.
Yahoo News

The trajectory and infection rate for Delta seems to have been the same no matter what was done.  Same thing in England where my sister is.  They did not go back into mandatory masks and lockdowns.  My state did.  TX did not.  Outcome about the same even with the influx of unvaccinated and infected coming over the border. 

I suspect that we will see the same type of thing with each new variant and we'll need to learn to ride it out rather than freaking out.   

A bit OT, but I just spent a week in TX and it was refreshing.  Some wore masks, some didn't, no one giving the evil eye or the virtual signaling sniff under the mask.   :grin:
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on October 28, 2021, 09:01:01 am

Get a load of this Kathy from Yahoo News and others. Florida, has a bit of good news...
Finally you state the truth.  Florida also has the highest percentage of old people.  Most are vaccinated or died.  Many died because they stayed at home for fear of going to the hospital.  Many couldn't get in a hospital because they were jammed with covid.  It's all good Phil because there are plenty of old people coming into the state to replace the ones that die.
I am surprised that you didn't make a big deal about our governor handing out vaccines to out of stater's before residents when the country was restricting travel.
You must of missed the special on PBS recently on Dr Fauci.  The man is so accomplished and renown that he survived Trump.
I don't think anyone argues that pandemics, plagues, or even famine can be solved naturally over time.  The costs is simply lives.  I can't quite wrap my head around lives not mattering much unless they are unborn.  How two faced.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on October 28, 2021, 09:50:45 am
Brian by now it's a good chance many of us have lost someone we know and love to this from every state here in America. As Kathy said the cat is out of the bag and we can't put it back. I posted that bit of good news for a hint of hope for our friends Down Under. Though politics and views differ on how to handle this, Florida chose a different approach. Florida has been under a microscope for its different approach toward covid. Some say a wrong approach some say a realistic approach. Either way there is hope there. (Apparently more than anywhere else here in America) As far as new older folks steady coming to Florida, moving to Florida, why? According to your description it is a death trap in a 'compactor' compared other states? You make no sense. Are you sure your last name is not Marx instead of Cardinal? I would not be surprised.....

From 1965
https://youtu.be/S9NoQHgjM_0
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on October 28, 2021, 11:46:06 am
Quote
Though politics and views differ on how to handle this, Florida chose a different approach. Florida has been under a microscope for its different approach toward covid

They did, as did other states.  As Ace pointed out, FL has a skewed toward the old demographic and so would be expected to have a much higher than average death rate.  Much higher.  And yet, it does not.

There are studies going back to the Spanish flu comparing masking, no masking, closing, staying open, etc.  We now have lots of data on the differences here and around the world with this virus.  None of these things make a difference with a highly contagious virus.  The only thing that might, and it is temporary, is locking people inside.  Been tried.  Failed.

Quote
You must of missed the special on PBS recently on Dr Fauci.  The man is so accomplished and renown that he survived Trump.

Trump should have fired him.  He survived because idiots like those on PBS have made him a god.  He's a god to the left because he gave them control mechanisms.
 Good and consistent advice from someone else would have been far more helpful to any president than the ever-changing advice from Fauci.  Some humility from Fauci would have been equally helpful.  Saying that you don't know something but are working on it, is not a sign of weakness.  It gives people confidence that you are honest.

I think it would be challenging to find anyone, other than maybe the current CDC director, who has contradicted themselves so often, sometimes in the same days. 
Don't wear masks-wear masks.  Go on a cruise-don't go.  Have casual sex with strangers-don't.  Rioting is OK because it serves the public good-ball games are not OK. 
I get it.  We all get old and someone needs to tell us to retire.  He's well past his sell-by date.  I'll give him this, though.  He was very good at convincing our government to give him more money.  Wonder how much of that ended up in Wuhan?

Quote
I don't think anyone argues that pandemics, plagues, or even famine can be solved naturally over time.  The costs is simply lives.  I can't quite wrap my head around lives not mattering much unless they are unborn.  How two faced.

I asked you before:  What do you think should have been done differently?  How would you handle things now?

Are you saying there should have been proof of residency before anyone got a vaccine?  Maybe they needed to show ID?

Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on October 29, 2021, 08:25:49 am

I asked you before:  What do you think should have been done differently?  How would you handle things now?

Are you saying there should have been proof of residency before anyone got a vaccine?  Maybe they needed to show ID?
And I already told you but you ignore answers.  I will say it again.
None of the old people should have been vaccinated first.  They would have been safe by staying and home and not flying around the country to get a vaccine.  If you wanted to save the old people in nursing homes all that was needed was a mandatory vaccination of the workers and follow normal infectious protocols.
Now that the supply has been met there should be a mandate for vaccines for everyone because people are too stupid to do the right thing on their own.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on October 29, 2021, 12:14:56 pm
Quote
And I already told you but you ignore answers.  I will say it again.
None of the old people should have been vaccinated first.  They would have been safe by staying and home and not flying around the country to get a vaccine.  If you wanted to save the old people in nursing homes all that was needed was a mandatory vaccination of the workers and follow normal infectious protocols.
Now that the supply has been met there should be a mandate for vaccines for everyone because people are too stupid to do the right thing on their own.

So all of your 'Trump did it all wrong' stuff is just noise and your COVID history starts with the vaccine?

Starting with your abbreviated history of this virus, you are suggesting that the least vulnerable should have been vaccinated before the most vulnerable?  Let me share a quote that you might recognize. 
Quote
I don't think anyone argues that pandemics, plagues, or even famine can be solved naturally over time.  The costs is simply lives.  I can't quite wrap my head around lives not mattering much unless they are unborn.  How two faced.

Quote
If you wanted to save the old people in nursing homes all that was needed was a mandatory vaccination of the workers and follow normal infectious protocols.

Again, you ignore the over one year before the vaccine when "normal infections protocols" were not working for this virus. 

Quote
Now that the supply has been met there should be a mandate for vaccines for everyone because people are too stupid to do the right thing on their own.

Sometimes people are stupid.  Who should be in charge of determining what is a stupid choice?  Once you develop a department of stupid choices, what else might they force?  I see people do things that I think are stupid all the time.  Maybe I should be in charge of the department of stupid choices?   :grin:

Freedom is messy.  The price of it is that people make bad choices.  We don't have to let people make bad choices.    Ask anyone from the old USSR.  They'll tell you that it was very orderly and no one was allowed to make bad choices. 
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: NigelP on October 29, 2021, 01:52:21 pm

None of the old people should have been vaccinated first.  They would have been safe by staying and home and not flying around the country to get a vaccine.  If you wanted to save the old people in nursing homes all that was needed was a mandatory vaccination of the workers and follow normal infectious protocols.


Latest UK data suggests that double vaccinated people are still capable of passing on the virus even whilst showing little or no symptoms.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/08/19/double-jabbed-people-carry-levels-covid-unvaccinated/
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-02187-1
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on October 30, 2021, 08:51:27 am
you ignore the over one year before the vaccine when "normal infections protocols" were not working for this virus. 

Here you go writing your own history again.  Normal infections protocols did work and still work otherwise every healthcare worker would be infected.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on October 30, 2021, 08:56:11 am

Latest UK data suggests that double vaccinated people are still capable of passing on the virus even whilst showing little or no symptoms.

Capable because the virus was not nipped in the bud.  Most pass through infections have occurred because of some other medical issue.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on October 30, 2021, 09:01:55 am

Freedom is messy.
When a nation is under attack freedom is taken away.  They call it the military.  Sometimes it is voluntary but mostly not.  The fact is if Trump was successful in starting another war everyone would be vaccinated including his base.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on October 30, 2021, 01:11:34 pm
Quote
Normal infections protocols did work and still work otherwise every healthcare worker would be infected.

I get that you do not have a medical background.  I also do not know how you define "normal infection protocols".  Define what you think that is  and we might have a place to start. 

Quote
Capable because the virus was not nipped in the bud.

Back to where we started.  How should this have been done?

Quote
When a nation is under attack freedom is taken away.  They call it the military.  Sometimes it is voluntary but mostly not.  The fact is if Trump was successful in starting another war everyone would be vaccinated including his base.

It is if we allow it to be.  We have a constitution, which is the law, to avoid that very thing.  Of course, we tend to ignore it, so yes, we lose freedoms for the illusion of safety.
Your comment about Trump and war implies that he tried to start wars and was unsuccessful.  Please explain.  Also, please explain the military bit? 
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: NigelP on October 30, 2021, 04:32:35 pm

Capable because the virus was not nipped in the bud.  Most pass through infections have occurred because of some other medical issue.
Nope..... pass through infections are happening with perfectly healthy people who have been double vaccinated.. Or at least in the UK they are.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on October 30, 2021, 09:37:58 pm
Quote
Nope..... pass through infections are happening with perfectly healthy people who have been double vaccinated.. Or at least in the UK they are.

Here also.  Not only infections but the ability to spread the virus in spite of having been vaccinated.  The only thing the vaccines appear to be doing is keeping people from getting as sick as they might without, but we don't even know that for sure because we have varients that may be less lethal in the first place.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on October 31, 2021, 08:20:56 am
The only thing the vaccines appear to be doing is keeping people from getting as sick as they might without,
More misinformation.  The vaccine, like all vaccines prevent the recipient from getting the disease in 90% of the cases.  For those that do have a break through case it makes the infection less severe and shortens the time of infection.  If you prevent the disease from finding other hosts the disease peters out, quickly.  That is how vaccines work.  If you don't have a vaccine the virus spreads, gets stronger and will take many, many more casualties.  This is like 5th grade science.  I am beginning to wonder how many people on beemaster have a high school diploma.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on October 31, 2021, 08:29:35 am

Capable because the virus was not nipped in the bud.  Most pass through infections have occurred because of some other medical issue.
Nope..... pass through infections are happening with perfectly healthy people who have been double vaccinated.. Or at least in the UK they are.
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthandsocialcare/conditionsanddiseases/articles/coronaviruscovid19latestinsights/vaccines
Review the data.  Try to understand what the data says.  Then answer the question, what fool would not take the vaccine?
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on October 31, 2021, 12:59:17 pm
Quote
If you prevent the disease from finding other hosts the disease peters out, quickly.  That is how vaccines work.  If you don't have a vaccine the virus spreads, gets stronger and will take many, many more casualties.  This is like 5th grade science.  I am beginning to wonder how many people on beemaster have a high school diploma.

I think you only got to 5th grade science?

Vaccines work differently according to the disease against which you are vaccinating.  I saw a lecture by a virologist and if I can find it again I'll post it.  One of the big questions people ask is why can we get rid of things like polio with a vaccine, but not the seasonal flu?  The seasonal flu, like this virus, mutates and has many variants.

His answer was that the diseases we have been able to irradicate or control have had one reservoir.  You don't find the poliovirus in birds or pigs.  The virus has not mutated, to our knowledge.  It is now, what it has always been.  It has no place to hide other than within the human population. 

The flu, on the other hand, is in pigs, birds, and who knows what else.  It can endlessly mutate in any of its hosts.  The solution might be to kill all reservoirs, but that is not practical.

This coronavirus has been found in multiple species.  It is likely to end up being the same as the flu for us.  You can't get rid of it because you can't get rid of all the animals in which it might reside.  We can mitigate the impact, but we are going to have to live with the virus and people are going to die from it, just as they die from the flu every year.

As for breakthrough cases, we don't know the %.  We don't know how many asymptomatic cases there have been.  We don't know how many people with mild disease didn't seek medical intervention.  I came home from my last trip sick.  I have been vaccinated.  I had the symptoms but not to the point of going in for care.  Was it covid?  IDK and really I don't care.

Israel has done a good job of tracking and testing.  They put their breakthrough cases at as high as 50%. 
In spite of the money we throw at our agencies, we have not done a good job of studying anything about this virus. 

People have all kinds of reasons for not doing something.  I thought the vaccine was in my best interest.  If I had young children at home, I probably would not be too hot to get them vaccinated.  I know a couple of people in high-risk categories who have chosen not to be vaccinated.  It is their business and their choice. 






Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: NigelP on October 31, 2021, 01:41:25 pm

Capable because the virus was not nipped in the bud.  Most pass through infections have occurred because of some other medical issue.
Nope..... pass through infections are happening with perfectly healthy people who have been double vaccinated.. Or at least in the UK they are.
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthandsocialcare/conditionsanddiseases/articles/coronaviruscovid19latestinsights/vaccines
Review the data.  Try to understand what the data says.  Then answer the question, what fool would not take the vaccine?
Ahhh I see the obfuscation argumenta .... from stating only break through infections  were in people with medical conditions has now illogically migrated to what fool etc......
Well this old fool is not fooled.
 :cool:
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: gww on October 31, 2021, 03:54:18 pm
Anything can be over loaded but the real question is, if exposed to smaller amounts of virus, it is true that the virus can not take hold in a portion of the vaccinated at all and is therefore stopped in its tracks from being spread by the vaccinated person.  Even if this amount that this happens in is 50% and break through cases still happen and still spread, 50% is much better odds of slowing the virus and of you not being the one that kills some one else that is not vaccinated or is susceptible to a break through.  In other words, are you helping or hurting when you could be helping. Secondly, If vaccinated keeps the infection low enough even if sick to not over load the health care system so that others are not left by the way due to not enough health care resources,  Is that not a good thing and a choice that the person can help or hurt?
Cheers
gww
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on October 31, 2021, 04:25:15 pm
Quote
Anything can be over loaded but the real question is, if exposed to smaller amounts of virus, it is true that the virus can not take hold in a portion of the vaccinated at all and is therefore stopped in its tracks from being spread by the vaccinated person.  Even if this amount that this happens in is 50% and break through cases still happen and still spread, 50% is much better odds of slowing the virus and of you not being the one that kills some one else that is not vaccinated or is susceptible to a break through.  In other words, are you helping or hurting when you could be helping. Secondly, If vaccinated keeps the infection low enough even if sick to not over load the health care system so that others are not left by the way due to not enough health care resources,  Is that not a good thing and a choice that the person can help or hurt?

Most of your logic is sound.  Some of the above we do not know yet and will have to rely on other countries for the answers because our bloated and expensive bureaucracies don't seem up to the research tasks.  My point is that this is not going to be a virus that we conquer.  It is going to be one that we learn to live with.

Where we might differ is on the greater good argument.  While the argument can be made that it is for the greater good that people get vaccinated, I draw the line at forcing things for the greater good.  I will also draw the line at forcing this on kids.  while I trust adults to make whatever decision is best for them, and I am not concerned at my age about long term effects, AND I am reasonably confident that this vaccine is OK for most adults, I do not have the same confidence in this for kids.  Kids immune systems are not developed, this vaccine type has not had rigorous testing in children.  This is a decision that parents will have to make for themselves, but risk vs reward would keep me from giving it to my young kids at this point.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Geoff on October 31, 2021, 06:41:53 pm
 
  Still amid all the facts (? ) and forecasts we now await the results of most restrictions being lifted or moderated over a long week-end. The figures still show that amongst the latest local cases and deaths the percentage of un-vaccinated is extremely high.
  To all the posters on this forum and this thread have you noticed that I dont debate with KathyP, I dont like losing  !  !
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: BeeMaster2 on October 31, 2021, 08:04:35 pm
To all the posters on this forum and this thread have you noticed that I dont debate with KathyP, I dont like losing  !  !

And you are a very smart man.😁
Jim Altmiller
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on November 01, 2021, 11:18:04 am
No one is keeping score  :grin:  Besides, when it comes to this virus, there is more we don't know than what we do know.  The only losers under these circumstances are the pols who keep giving us orders and don't have the ability or will to adapt to new info.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on November 02, 2021, 08:37:46 am
My point is that this is not going to be a virus that we conquer.  It is going to be one that we learn to live with.
Only because forced vaccinations have not become the norm.
You don't find it ironic that school children already are subject to forced vaccinations and very few people were up in arms about the long term effects.  Most understand that the long term effects are good.
Your hesitancy was said to be "not fully approved" and now it is.  The real reason for all this hoopla is political.  It is an attempt to make Biden look bad when none of it is his fault.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on November 02, 2021, 08:42:06 am
  To all the posters on this forum and this thread have you noticed that I dont debate with KathyP, I dont like losing  !  !
Marching to Kathy's rhetoric does not make you a winner.  In most cases it makes you uninformed or just a follower.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on November 02, 2021, 12:23:09 pm
Quote
Only because forced vaccinations have not become the norm.
You don't find it ironic that school children already are subject to forced vaccinations and very few people were up in arms about the long term effects.  Most understand that the long term effects are good.
Your hesitancy was said to be "not fully approved" and now it is.  The real reason for all this hoopla is political.  It is an attempt to make Biden look bad when none of it is his fault.

You are welcome to believe whatever you wish, however, my hesitancy was non-existent.  I had no problem with taking the vaccine when it was offered to me.  Try to keep up.

Putting aside the question of whether or not we should force kids to be vaccinated, we know that there are vaccine injuries to children each year.  We also know that there are long-term consequences to many of the diseases against which we vaccinate.  We know that most of those vaccines actually stop infection in the vast majority of kids.  As with all things, the vaccines we give to kids are risk vs reward.  There are some vaccines offered today that I would skip.  There are also many ways for parents to opt out or moderate the vaccine schedule in consultation with their pediatrician.

Yes, we are getting approval to use this vaccine in kids.  If that's your qualifier, that's fine.  You take your kids and get them vaccinated.  If I had to make that decision, I would wait.  This type of vaccine has not had significant testing in kids or time to see if there are long term impacts of the vaccine in kids.  Approval does not = answers to those things.  Additionally, the risk to kids from the virus is statistically 0 unless they have underlying conditions.  The vaccine does not keep people from getting the virus or from spreading it.  It may keep people from geting as sick, at least with this mutation.  Taking all these things into consideration, the risk outweighs the reward for kids in my mind.

If you have more information than that, please share.
 
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on November 03, 2021, 08:52:25 am
The vaccine does not keep people from getting the virus or from spreading it.
You keep spewing this misinformation.  It does keep most people from getting the disease.  It doesn't guarantee that you won't get the disease because it is your own immune system that fights it off in the first place.
Many of the vaccines that are available only affect the person receiving it.  That is NOT the case with covid and many other vaccines that kids already have to have to go to school.
I just registered a boat in the state of FL.  The governor is standing in the way of mask mandates for schools but no one can enter a county building without a mask.  So no one can get a drivers license or ID without a mask.  So no new voters in FL can get registered without wearing a mask.  Is he making the state more democratic or are the newly registered republicans two faced?
No one really knows the long term effect for a young child that gets infected with covid.  I suspect the disease is much much worse then a vaccine that leaves your body in a few days.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on November 03, 2021, 12:26:31 pm

Prove the 1st sentence.  2nd and 3rd sentances are in conflict.

Quote
Many of the vaccines that are available only affect the person receiving it.  That is NOT the case with covid and many other vaccines that kids already have to have to go to school.

You begin with the premise that it is OK to force anyone to have any vaccine.  Since that horse seems to be out of the barn, we know that prior vaccines were made in basically the same way and have had years of use so we know how they work.  Even so, our prior vaccination of children has not been without disaster.  The polio vaccine would be a good example.

This vaccine was not made in the same way and has not had rigorous testing in kids.  While it seems pretty safe for adults and is a good idea for those who are most at risk, we can't say the same yet for kids.
Again, choice.  If you want your child to get it, get it.

Quote
I just registered a boat in the state of FL.  The governor is standing in the way of mask mandates for schools but no one can enter a county building without a mask.  So no one can get a drivers license or ID without a mask.

Other states are the same and there is no issue in schools.  In TX businesses have the choice, but for all that I have done there mask wearing is optional.  I come from a mask mandate state.  The attitude and mentality in TX is very different than OR.  Leftist tend to live in fear and they want everyone else to experience the same or Karen rears her ugly head.  In TX people do what is right for them.  Happier people.

I will also tell you that from a medical POV, the masks that people are wearing and the way in which they are wearing them, makes them useless.  You will never find a medical professional working with contagious patients wearing the kind of masks people on the streets are wearing.  Additionally, a virus is so small that it is not going to respect a mask.  It will hold your spit and snot, but the virus will go right through and around.  Thinking that kids will wear even ineffective masks properly for hours in school is just stupid.

Quote
No one really knows the long term effect for a young child that gets infected with covid.  I suspect the disease is much much worse then a vaccine that leaves your body in a few days.

It is likely that most kids have been exposed already.  This is especially true in mask optional states.  That's a good thing.  We do have studies showing natural infection confers longer protection.  We don't know a lot of things including the long term effects of the vaccine in kids.  Just because the fluid of the vaccine leaves the body quickly, it does not follow that the effects leave as quickly.  If they did, what would be the point?
What you suppose is irrelevant.  What we need and are not getting in this country, is research.  I do not understand how we can throw billions at these agencies, have them fail so utterly, and still pay any attention to them. 



Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on November 03, 2021, 04:09:10 pm
Quote
I just registered a boat in the state of FL.

Congratulations Ace did you get the type which motor runs on fossil fuels that causes C02 greenhouse emissions, or maybe a battery powered electric motor, or a simple efficient 'green powered' row boat?  :grin:




Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on November 04, 2021, 08:57:02 am
You begin with the premise that it is OK to force anyone to have any vaccine.
Nope. didn't say that at all. The brain sees what I said but lacks the understanding of the words.
Quote
Even so, our prior vaccination of children has not been without disaster.  The polio vaccine would be a good example.
No longer having polio outbreaks is a bad thing???
Quote
This vaccine was not made in the same way and has not had rigorous testing in kids.  While it seems pretty safe for adults and is a good idea for those who are most at risk, we can't say the same yet for kids.
We absolutely know that covid is bad for kids, the economy and life in general.

Quote
I just registered a boat in the state of FL.  The governor is standing in the way of mask mandates for schools but no one can enter a county building without a mask.  So no one can get a drivers license or ID without a mask.

Quote
In TX people do what is right for them.  Happier people.
Until a catastrophic event.  Then its "help me, help me we are suffering".

Quote
I will also tell you that from a medical POV, the masks that people are wearing and the way in which they are wearing them, makes them useless.  You will never find a medical professional working with contagious patients wearing the kind of masks people on the streets are wearing.  Additionally, a virus is so small that it is not going to respect a mask.  It will hold your spit and snot, but the virus will go right through and around.  Thinking that kids will wear even ineffective masks properly for hours in school is just stupid.
More mis information.  The mask no matter how they are made reduce the distance the virus travels which is the reason for the 6ft distance.  I have seen many people using the throw away medical masks that medical professionals use on a daily basis.  You are just flat out wrong.
 
Quote
What we need and are not getting in this country, is research.

And you know this how?  Because the results do no concur with your own beliefs?
History reveals that prior research saved our butts.  That being said we would have been better prepared for covid if we did not run aground with money hungry republicans that curtailed what was already being done.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on November 04, 2021, 09:01:53 am

Congratulations Ace did you get the type which motor runs on fossil fuels that causes C02 greenhouse emissions, or maybe a battery powered electric motor, or a simple efficient 'green powered' row boat?  :grin:
All of the above.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/bE8U34uL7aUcPU7u8
https://photos.app.goo.gl/jcidxBUYEJiYyABKA
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on November 04, 2021, 11:42:40 am
Do you folks DownUnder have celebrities who think as this fellow?

Ice Cube Loses $9 Million Film Gig After Refusing to Get ...
Search domain money.yahoo.comhttps://money.yahoo.com ? ice-cube-loses-9-million-180330466.html
Jamie Sabau/GettyActor and rapper Ice Cube is apparently so adamant about not getting the COVID vaccine that he's willing to lose $9 million. According to sourced cited by The Hollywood Reporter, he left the Sony comedy "Oh ---- No!" after he refused requests from producers to get vaccinated. The film, which is set to star Jack Black, is scheduled to start production in Hawaii in December.


Ice Cube backs out of Sony, Jack Black flick after ...
Search domain nypost.comhttps://nypost.com ? 2021 ? 10 ? 30 ? ice-cube-backs-out-of-sony-jack-black-flick-after-refusing-vaccine
1 day agoIce Cube left the cast of pending Sony comedy "Oh ---- No"  and walked away from a $9 million payday -- after refusing the COVID-19 vaccine shot. AFP via Getty Images More On: Movies
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on November 04, 2021, 11:56:07 am
Ace, because you refuse to be informed and continue to post opinions rather than the facts as we have them, none of your post is worth a detailed response.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Geoff on November 17, 2021, 06:41:04 pm


   Today 18/11/21 in the state of Victoria over 1000 cases of Covid and 12 deaths due to Covid and among the cases and deaths almost all are unvaccinated  ! 
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on November 18, 2021, 08:19:11 am


   Today 18/11/21 in the state of Victoria over 1000 cases of Covid and 12 deaths due to Covid and among the cases and deaths almost all are unvaccinated  !
Working on herd immunity.  Surely it is the reason for holding back vaccines in poor countries.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on November 18, 2021, 08:03:58 pm
Quote
Surely it is the reason for holding back vaccines in poor countries.
Are you suggesting Australia is poor? 

https://www.kff.org/global-health-policy/issue-brief/u-s-international-covid-19-vaccine-donations-tracker/

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-55795297

I don't have a problem with donations of whatever, but each country has a duty to its own first.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on November 19, 2021, 08:21:04 am
Quote
Surely it is the reason for holding back vaccines in poor countries.
Are you suggesting Australia is poor? 
No, but like this country there are sections that are very poor.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Geoff on November 19, 2021, 04:35:46 pm


      We have just had nearly all doors thrown open in a population of approx. 6,700,000 with a stated 90 % double vaccinated which means that there are 670, 000 either unvaccinated or with only a single jab loose amongst us. With most venues and events one must provide your " Double Vacced Passport " to gain entry, even at our local bowls club this afternoon the Covid police will be checking our credentials.
      Between all the new rules and all the political push and shove I think most of us were happier when in full lock-down !  !
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Skeggley on November 19, 2021, 09:59:36 pm
Here in the West we were the least affected by the virus yet we have the toughest vaccine mandates in Aus with over 75% of the workforce required to be vaccinated by 2022 or face fines. Small country businesses are closing due to the current staff refusing to get vaccinated and replacement staff unavailable. 2nd Dec group 1 mandates mean all mine workers among others not having had the first dose will lose their jobs. Unemployment will go through the roof currently at 3.9%, national 5.2%.
Our Premier has shut his office due to threats against his staff with protests continuing across our nation all fed with Q Anon disinformation.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on November 19, 2021, 11:10:16 pm
Quote
Our Premier has shut his office due to threats against his staff with protests continuing across our nation all fed with Q Anon disinformation.

Q Anon?  I thought that was a US thing and about Trump?   :cheesy:

A lot of people have refused here too and I think it is more because of mandates than fear of the vaccine.  People don't like being ordered to do a thing and they get their backs up about it.

Quote
Between all the new rules and all the political push and shove I think most of us were happier when in full lock-down !  !

Governments keep moving the goalposts and people are getting angry off.  Most of us did it all wrong.  Only a couple of western countries got it right and it appears that much of Africa may have gotten it right because they had no other options.

Those of us who locked down or are still doing the stupid mask mandates and distancing will continue to suffer.  None of what we are doing follows the science.  We have 100 years of study to know that masks don't work and enough experience with virus to know that it runs its course no matter what we do...unless we get a vaccine that stops it and we don't have that. 

Additional comment:  Do we have auto correct on here   :cheesy:

Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on November 21, 2021, 09:25:42 am
People don't like being ordered to do a thing and they get their backs up about it.
Must be what is wrong with our military.
Quote
We have 100 years of study to know that masks don't work and enough experience with virus to know that it runs its course no matter what we do...unless we get a vaccine that stops it and we don't have that. 
We do have multiple vaccines that will stop it.  What we are lacking is intelligence in the general population to understand how it works.
Stop the mis-information.  Join the intelligent sector of the general population.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: iddee on November 21, 2021, 10:10:27 am
""Stop the mis-information.  Join the intelligent sector of the general population."""

AMEN..... Dang, I sure wish you would.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on November 21, 2021, 10:58:27 pm
Quote
We do have multiple vaccines that will stop it.  What we are lacking is intelligence in the general population to understand how it works.
Stop the mis-information.

we have 0 vaccines that will stop it.  IDK where you get your info, but you might try another source...like maybe the CDC or NIH or even some reputable nightly news?

I'm not a fan of many of our government agencies, but you seem to worship them.  Use them to prove your statements. 
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on November 22, 2021, 08:18:24 am
I know that your statements come from mis-information and personal beliefs.  It does not come from medical science or past history.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on November 22, 2021, 02:13:30 pm
Quote
I know that your statements come from mis-information and personal beliefs.  It does not come from medical science or past history.

Fine, but if your goal is a conversation then show me where I am wrong.  I get a lot of opinions from you, but not much in the way of facts. 

What personal beliefs do you think would be influencing my statements?
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Acebird on November 24, 2021, 08:39:17 am
You believe all democrats are from the far left.  You believe socialism is no good unless it favors a republican but they you try to claim it isn't socialism.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on November 24, 2021, 11:36:39 am
Quote
You believe all democrats are from the far left.  You believe socialism is no good unless it favors a republican but they you try to claim it isn't socialism.

This is what someone told you to think about conservatives.  You could not have gotten this opinion about me from any of our conversations.  Hope springs eternal that one day you will think for yourself. 
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: cidersabuzzin on November 25, 2021, 05:47:49 am
You believe all democrats are from the far left.  You believe socialism is no good unless it favors a republican but they you try to claim it isn't socialism.
Ace
Head and brick wall spring to mind as regards KP. Maybe time to stop hurting yourself :wink: 
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: salvo on November 25, 2021, 09:53:26 am
Hi Folks,

Looks like me boomerang won't come back:

https://tottnews.com/2021/11/23/army-deployed-to-indigenous-region-nt/

Sal
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on November 25, 2021, 11:24:08 am
Quote
Head and brick wall spring to mind as regards KP. Maybe time to stop hurting yourself

I am happy to have a back and forth with him, but he never backs up what he says.  He tosses bombs and runs. 
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Geoff on November 26, 2021, 04:06:06 pm

     Salvo do you know what a boomerang that wont come back is called ?   It's a stick !  !
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on November 26, 2021, 10:03:27 pm
Geoff you are a hoot even away from the humor section!  :grin: Good one! I?ll never forget the post by you. >Only in Oz< I rank that as one of the funniest jokes I have ever heard.  :grin:
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: salvo on November 29, 2021, 11:14:59 pm
Hi Folks,

https://www.msn.com/en-us/movies/celebrity/indigenous-australian-actor-david-gulpilil-dies-at-68/ar-AARgI8e?ocid=msedgntp

Sal
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Skeggley on November 30, 2021, 05:30:31 am
He is an absolute legend, definately my favourite Australian. Top bloke.
I remember going to the town hall and watching him in Storm Boy many moons ago.
RIP David Dalaithngu.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: jalentour on December 03, 2021, 02:38:13 pm
I really did not expect this in Australia. 
This video is taken in an internment camp for the unvaxxed.

https://citizenfreepress.com/breaking/woman-threatened-with-5000-fine-for-stepping-over-yellow-line/

Comical to see paper gown and mask.  We all know they are nothing more than virtue signaling.

For me, what tops this off is the willingness of the public to let it happen.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: salvo on December 06, 2021, 12:36:37 am
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Geoff on December 27, 2021, 06:37:19 pm
   Two illegal border jumpers just released after three months jail simply to attend a football grand-final. In the mean time the Omricon virus is going like wildfire because the pollies loosened all the restrictions.
   We had our booster vaccs last week, moderna and hopefully it helps as it was not pleasant for a couple of days and that it will be easier to take than a bout of Covid.
   Seasons greetings to all,   Geoff.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Geoff on December 27, 2021, 07:11:07 pm

   Referring back to my comment on  September 07 when we were concerned by about 246 cases in the state the news has just presented as today we have 2738 cases in our state alone. The figures currently in NSW have been running at about three times that number. All the while the deaths  follow up as well.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Skeggley on December 27, 2021, 10:04:15 pm
   Two illegal border jumpers just released after three months jail simply to attend a football grand-final.
You?d be hard pushed to find a West Aussie feeling sorry for those guys Geoff, do the crime do the time. We?ve enjoyed all the freedoms here during the pandemic and now the virus is in the state again due to an unvaccinated traveller from over east, restrictions are back. NYE festivals cancelled.
Borders here allegedly opening 2nd Feb and to be honest, as a sole trader, not looking forward to the inevitable influx.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on December 31, 2021, 03:31:24 am
Accurate?

https://youtube.com/shorts/OEmUg9wTc4I?feature=share
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Geoff on January 19, 2022, 07:05:53 am

                 Following up my report on the number of cases in December which were about 2000 a day the numbers today are 20,000 in Victoria and 30,000 in NSW.
                Probably the downside of today has been the news that our eldest son has gone down with the virus but as he works with the public it is not surprising and possibly that he had not become eligible for his booster shot yet. Ironic also that at work he has been used as a Covid marshall checking for double vaccination records and taking the abuse when he has had to turn customers away.
                My hardest recent experience with the virus was suffering virus symptoms and having to get the PCR test which meant sitting in the car for 5 hours till I got tested. Didn't cater for it but was lucky the wife left bottle of water on the back seat, however no food. Waited 2 days to get the good news.

                                  By the way on the lighter did you know the anagram of omricon is Moronic  !  !
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on January 19, 2022, 10:44:32 am
Sorry to hear about your son Geoff, but if it's Omicron his risks are small.  Most people are getting no more than the symptoms of a cold.  The vaccine does not seem to be doing much for this variant and there is some evidence from other countries that multiple vaccines make it worse.  Might be a good thing he didn't get the booster   :wink:

Hope all is well with you guys otherwise!
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Geoff on January 19, 2022, 11:14:28 pm

    Spoke to him this morning Kathy and is a lot better today. Otherwise the rest of us are OK and probably lucky that there has only been one known family member who has contacted the virus. Will get back on messenger for another chat one day Kathy but I just dont seem to sync with US  west coast times.
  Cheers to y'all,  Geoff.
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Kathyp on January 19, 2022, 11:27:20 pm
Quote
Will get back on messenger for another chat one day Kathy but I just dont seem to sync with US  west coast times.
  Cheers to y'all,  Geoff.

That's OK but feel free to call any time.  I don't sync well with my own time!   :cheesy:

One of the big COVID docs in Israel said that Omicron and prior infections gave better immunity than vaccines and boosters so tell your son that to make him feel better  :wink:
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: cidersabuzzin on January 20, 2022, 07:29:40 pm
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Isn't this a camp for illeagl imigrants?
Title: Re: News from our friends down under
Post by: Ben Framed on April 24, 2022, 01:56:24 am
China and The Solomon Islands are mentioned here in this News Clip by our friends from Down Under...


https://youtu.be/tHWQ7EIcS4M