Author Topic: Tree Trapout in Sanderson FL. (Read 9352 times)

iddee · « **Reply #20 on:** June 11, 2018, 07:04:02 pm »

Ace and Bill, average temp for my trapouts, 40 to 60 F. Average for Jim's, 80 to 100 F. Now take that into consideration and you will see the difference.

eltalia · « **Reply #21 on:** June 11, 2018, 07:21:46 pm »

Yep Wally, it's a nonstarter for me under 70F and the higher it gets the faster
the job gets done. So I prefer to go in around August September where
the day climbs from a 75F dawn.

Bill

Acebird · « **Reply #22 on:** June 11, 2018, 09:17:04 pm »

Wally, brood nest is 92 so what is hot to us is heaven to them. My wife was down in FL last week. She actually admitted it was hot. We had miserable 50's and rain. Garden is growing. Grass is ridiculous.

iddee · « **Reply #23 on:** June 11, 2018, 09:40:58 pm »

Ace, cut the ventilation off in a hive when the outside temp is 90 and it will melt the wax. 145 F. plus. It takes much less ventilation at 60 than at 90. Remember the heat produced by the bees that has to be dispersed.

Acebird · « **Reply #24 on:** June 12, 2018, 08:49:20 am »

Any beekeeper I have ever known says that bees will leave the hive and beard if the external temperature gets in the 90's. I could be wrong but I don't think it is any different in FL. If it is, it will be something new to learn. Ventilation should be for oxygen and a 2 in opening on a hive is more then adequate for that. Now if they cover the cone then yes that is a problem. If that happens I would abandon this attempt and do a Hogan Trap out. Trapping the queen first. Once that is done the trapping box can be a little farther away from the parent entrance. It could grow to 2,3,4 boxes.

iddee · « **Reply #25 on:** June 12, 2018, 09:23:34 am »

""Any beekeeper I have ever known says that bees will leave the hive and beard if the external temperature gets in the 90's. ""

I don't think any beek has ever told you that.

""Any beekeeper I have ever known says that FORAGERS will leave the hive and beard if the external temperature gets in the 90's.

Maybe this, but not the first. They will not abandon brood.

As I said above, Ace, the more you post about trapping, the more you show how little you know. Ventilation is for heat control, not oxygen.

eltalia · « **Reply #26 on:** June 12, 2018, 06:49:33 pm »

"Any beekeeper I have ever known says..."

Brian even if you were on major speaking circuits the largest number of beekeepers
in the loosest of associations ("I have ever known") would be at least four digits
removed behind the decimal point in terms of those beekeepers actively practicing
at any point in time. n short.. south of 0.0001%.
In contrast?
I have travelled the breast (edit...breadth) of this Land in my Life thusfar, allowing
myself to actively meet hundreds of beekeepers and in what time I have left there
is no way I could possibly get across the 10, 000 or so in Queensland alone, as a
cumlative number in a whole Life.
I'll be very lucky if I can even get to meet 1% of the growing numbers arising from
a new trend in adopting native bee (Tetragonula) colonies in our gardens.!
Again in short... it is not possible nor wise to hinge/anchor an oracle on the numbers
of beekeepers one 'knows'.

Here is the common thought you can read of in modern studies or indeed in those
works of olde Authors.
External to the hive body clumping (bearding) is the outcome of maintaining
unproductive bees. The cause of which there can be more than a single element at
the same time, clumping requires addressing if the behaviour persists as a daily
display.

Bill

(edited to supplement deviate sex driven schpelt shagger)

Acebird · « **Reply #27 on:** June 12, 2018, 08:33:30 pm »

Quote from: iddee on June 12, 2018, 09:23:34 am

Ventilation is for heat control, not oxygen.

Can't you just picture Wally shimming up a 3 or 4 ft diamerter maple to drill holes in feral bee hives to cool them off.

iddee · « **Reply #28 on:** June 12, 2018, 10:15:56 pm »

Check the temp of any hollow, living maple on a hot summer day. It will be cool to the touch. I have ran my hand in too many of them as a youngster looking for baby squirrels and snakes. The hollow areas never heat up significantly.

PS. I was told today that I insulted you. If I did, I apologize. I was just doing the normal picking and teasing and meant no real harm.

eltalia · « **Reply #29 on:** June 12, 2018, 10:16:27 pm »

Quote from: Acebird on June 12, 2018, 08:33:30 pm

Quote from: iddee on June 12, 2018, 09:23:34 am
Ventilation is for heat control, not oxygen.

Can't you just picture Wally shimming up a 3 or 4 ft diamerter maple to drill holes in feral bee hives to cool them off.

Why not... I am having a roight ol' giggle watching you do trapouts from a keyboard!!
{LMA0}

Bill

Acebird · « **Reply #30 on:** June 13, 2018, 08:10:53 am »

Quote from: iddee on June 12, 2018, 10:15:56 pm

PS. I was told today that I insulted you. If I did, I apologize.

Wally, no need to apologize. We both know we are having fun.:-)

Acebird · « **Reply #31 on:** June 13, 2018, 08:49:37 am »

Wally, take a look at this one.
http://www.beesource.com/forums/showthread.php?346895-Tree-Trap&p=1644387#post1644387

iddee · « **Reply #32 on:** June 13, 2018, 09:04:11 am »

About all I see there is, "If you aren't successful, close it up and kill the bees." Is that the point you are making?

Also, it is in northern Kentucky. I hope you aren't comparing the temps. with Florida.

Acebird · « **Reply #33 on:** June 13, 2018, 09:58:08 am »

Define success for a trap out. What is the percentage of trap outs that you get the queen?

iddee · « **Reply #34 on:** June 13, 2018, 10:08:00 am »

Percentage of trapouts I remove a queenrite hive from is probably higher than 100%, as I get 2 to 4 queenrite hives from many trapouts. Since my goal in a trapout is to REMOVE all bees and honey, without killing them, plus raising queens from my better strains, my success rate is very high.

Acebird · « **Reply #35 on:** June 13, 2018, 01:53:11 pm »

What method do you use to get the queen out? The Hogan trap out is the only method that I have heard of that gets the queen. I have heard of numbers of lower then 10% success at getting the queen with a traditional trap out.

BeeMaster2 · « **Reply #36 on:** June 13, 2018, 01:58:11 pm »

Ace,
I have not done a lot of Trapouts but the 2 I completed this year both got the old queen.
Jim

Waveeater · « **Reply #37 on:** June 13, 2018, 01:59:50 pm »

Hold on a minute men I need to pop some more popcorn and refil my glass. 😂

iddee · « **Reply #38 on:** June 13, 2018, 03:29:50 pm »

https://beemaster.com/forum/index.php/topic,20038.0.html

Acebird · « **Reply #39 on:** June 13, 2018, 04:57:47 pm »

Jim, how did that happen? What Wally keeps linking to agrees with what I said. The queen is practically the last hold out. Weeks after the trap is first set.
With a Hogan trap out you bait the queen with unrelated brood. She goes into the box because she thinks there is another queen in her hive. This should happen in hours. The queen is trapped in the new box but the nurse bees can go back and forth through a section of queen excluder. They won't start a queen cell in the tree because they still get the pheromone from their original queen. In less than a week they can't start a queen cell so at that time you can move the trap box and just like a split that stays close to the parent hive all the foragers go to the queen right box. The only purpose for the screen cone is to prevent the emerging brood from staying in the tree and becoming a laying worker hive. As Wally says in the other post when all the bees have left the tree then you pull off the cone to rob it. To be on the safe side I would move the trapped hive a couple of miles away. I wouldn't let that hive do the robbing.
Because honeybees are not motivated to rob during flows it seems to me the hive should be completely sealed and then opened up in the next dearth. No harm would come to the honey if other insects could not get in. An issue might be that they are already in. I am not sure if the lack of oxygen would kill everything.