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Author Topic: Bees in the Oak trees  (Read 1251 times)

Offline NCNate

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Bees in the Oak trees
« on: June 05, 2022, 10:16:07 am »
It looks like the largest part of the nectar flow has tapered off in my area. I live in a wooded area and yesterday I heard bees up in the tops of the trees. Looks like they are working the red oaks but they dropped their tassels 2 months ago. What would the bees be after?

Offline paus

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #1 on: June 05, 2022, 10:56:44 am »
I have heard them in Blackwalnuts and I thought they after honey dew.

Online Ben Framed

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #2 on: June 08, 2022, 02:18:46 pm »
I will go with Paus reference.  Oak trees do put out honeydew. Wonder how this honey taste? Anyone know?

Phillip
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Offline Michael Bush

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #3 on: June 08, 2022, 02:22:30 pm »
Honey dew is very strong flavored.  In Europe it is sold for a premium.  In the US it's not very popular.
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Online Ben Framed

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #4 on: June 08, 2022, 02:23:37 pm »
Thanks Mr Bush, Most of the stronger honey that I have experienced has been darker honey. I am assuming Oak honeydew is a darker honey.  ?

Phillip

EDIT:
Most of the stronger honey that I have experienced has been darker honey. I am assuming Oak honeydew makes a darker honey.  ?
« Last Edit: July 03, 2022, 10:59:31 am by Ben Framed »
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #5 on: June 09, 2022, 07:50:03 am »
Honeydew is NOT honey.  It is honeydew.  It is made from the excretions of aphids, not the nectar of flowers.  It is sweet, but it doesn't taste like honey, because it's not.  But yes, honeydew is darker.
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Online Ben Framed

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #6 on: June 09, 2022, 08:00:25 am »
My mistake Mr Bush. One word can change the whole meaning of intent. Thanks for pointing this out. My intent was:

Thanks Mr Bush, Most of the stronger honey that I have experienced has been darker honey. I am assuming Oak honeydew makes a darker honey.  ?

Phillip

« Last Edit: June 09, 2022, 10:01:59 am by Ben Framed »
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV

Offline paus

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #7 on: June 09, 2022, 10:28:22 am »
Mr. Bush, in your second post you spelled "HONEYDEW" correctly, it is one word. This is FOI for our informati0on. 

Online Ben Framed

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #8 on: July 03, 2022, 11:04:25 am »
Thank you Mr Binnie.

If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #9 on: July 05, 2022, 06:45:16 am »
>Mr. Bush, in your second post you spelled "HONEYDEW" correctly, it is one word. This is FOI for our informati0on.

The spell checker probably outsmarted me on the first post... sorry.  Yes, it's one word.  The general rule in English is that it is one word or a compound word (with a hyphen) when it describes something other than the words used to describe it, e.g. butterfly which is not a fly and not butter.  Honey bee still seems to be up for discussion, but it seems to me that it is a bee, and the kind of bee is the one that makes honey.  So Honey bee seems correct where honeybee would be something that is neither honey nor a bee.  So honeydew is neither honey nor dew, therefore honeydew is the appropriate term rather than honey dew which would indicate that it is either honey or dew and the other word describes what kind of honey.  But since it ends up in a bee hive I suppose an argument could be made that it is a kind of honey.  But the general definition of honey is something made by the bees from nectar which honeydew is not.
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Offline Bob Wilson

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #10 on: July 05, 2022, 07:13:51 am »
I assumed the bees were using the honeydew as a nectar source, and converting it into honey. Is that not true?

Online Ben Framed

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #11 on: July 05, 2022, 07:45:52 am »
I assumed the bees were using the honeydew as a nectar source, and converting it into honey. Is that not true?

Bob I was totally under the 'very same' assumption and understanding as you about honeydew (honey). I also think it is safe to assume bees must have the very same assumption as well! lol   :grin:  :wink:
 
However, Mr Binnie and Mr Bush both broke the subject down to the foundation. If I understand each of these folks correctly, Honeydew can not 'officially' be considered true Honey though called such when collected, converted, and stored by bees, just as done with 'true nectar' honey.
See  2:24 to 3:12 in Mr Binnnies video....

I suppose the same can be said of bee collected and converted 'sugar water' not being real honey, just as said of honeydew not being real honey for example, though two totally different sources neither being 'real honey' collected from real nectar, and rightfully so when we consider.  Mr Binnies displayed written text in the video really helps explain Honeydew.
This has turned out to be an interesting topic!

Phillip
« Last Edit: July 05, 2022, 08:15:04 am by Ben Framed »
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #12 on: July 06, 2022, 09:27:52 am »
>I suppose the same can be said of bee collected and converted 'sugar water' not being real honey...

Correct.  Because it is not made from nectar.
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Offline Bob Wilson

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #13 on: July 06, 2022, 06:52:47 pm »
Hmmm.
1. Mr. Binnie said that honeydew (by which I assume he means "honeydew honey", as opposed to "clover honey" or "sourwood honey") is bad for digestion for bees, as are some dark honeys.
2. It just seems reasonable to me that ANY honey which bees make from ANY sugar source is still honey. The QUALITY of that honey is a vastly different matter, such as honeydew honey or sugar water honey. In other words, it is not the source that determines whether it is honey, but what the bees do with the sugar source that make it honey.
...or I could be wrong.

Online Ben Framed

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #14 on: July 06, 2022, 07:46:23 pm »
Bob Wilson
Hmmm.
1. Mr. Binnie said that honeydew (by which I assume he means "honeydew honey", as opposed to "clover honey" or "sourwood honey") is bad for digestion for bees, as are some dark honeys.
2. It just seems reasonable to me that ANY honey which bees make from ANY sugar source is still honey. The QUALITY of that honey is a vastly different matter, such as honeydew honey or sugar water honey. In other words, it is not the source that determines whether it is honey, but what the bees do with the sugar source that make it honey.
...or I could be wrong.


Ben Framed
Reply 11
Quote
Bob I was totally under the 'very same' assumption and understanding as you about honeydew (honey). I also think it is safe to assume bees must have the very same assumption as well! lol  :grin:  :wink

I agree with you reasoning Bob, although it is my understanding that sugar water honey is considered adulterated honey since it is not from a true nectar source.. (Not recognized an official real honey if you will).... Apparently honeydew is in the same class?




« Last Edit: July 06, 2022, 07:57:47 pm by Ben Framed »
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV

Online The15thMember

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #15 on: July 06, 2022, 07:49:56 pm »
2. It just seems reasonable to me that ANY honey which bees make from ANY sugar source is still honey. The QUALITY of that honey is a vastly different matter, such as honeydew honey or sugar water honey. In other words, it is not the source that determines whether it is honey, but what the bees do with the sugar source that make it honey.
...or I could be wrong.
It's reasonable, but it's neither useful for marketing or legal.  And while the FDA's definition of honey being from a plant secretion makes honeydew honey technically illegal, it's an outlier in the conversation.  Here's an explanation from Rusty Burlew of HoneyBeeSuite.com.

Quote
I firmly believe that syrup made from refined sugar cannot be changed into honey, but not everyone agrees. Bees do indeed break down sugar (sucrose) into its component parts (fructose and glucose). But that enzymatic process does not make honey, just as adding invertase to sugar syrup does not make honey.

Although honey is mostly fructose and glucose, it is all the other stuff that gives honey its flavor, aroma, color and nutritional benefits. Honey bees thrive on honey in part because of the nutrients, antioxidants, amino acids, protein, flavonoids, minerals, and pollen that it contains. Yes, these are small in quantity, but they are vital, just as the vitamins and minerals in human food is vital to us.

The thing that makes honey amazing, that makes it honey, is contained in the nectar of the plants, all the flavor and variety and uniqueness about honey is destroyed if inverted sugar syrup is allowed to be considered honey.  I don't mind honeydew honey being labeled as such because honeydew is naturally occurring, but it would bother me if someone markets snow cone honey, or some such honey made from anything not available in the wild or at least in agriculture.  The nectar is half of the equation, and the bees are the other.  Without one of those two pieces, it's not honey.  That's my opinion anyway. 
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Online Ben Framed

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #16 on: July 06, 2022, 08:02:52 pm »
Lets consider Cotton Honey... It blooms for a short time but is considered to be a honey producing crop for a long amount of time because of honeydew. I once had a chart of my states plants which produce honey. Cotton was in the charts for producing honey for an extended amount of time in my State.

Phillip
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #17 on: July 06, 2022, 08:11:23 pm »
Lets consider Cotton Honey... It blooms for a short time but is considered to be a honey producing crop for a long amount of time because of honeydew. I once had a chart of my states plants which produce honey. Cotton was in the charts for producing honey for an extended amount of time in my State.

Phillip
I guess I just view honeydew honey as a loophole in the regulations.  But if it was me, I wouldn't label such a product "Cotton Honey", I'd label it "Cotton Honeydew Honey", because to call it honey is somewhat misleading. 
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Online Ben Framed

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #18 on: July 06, 2022, 08:26:34 pm »
Lets consider Cotton Honey... It blooms for a short time but is considered to be a honey producing crop for a long amount of time because of honeydew. I once had a chart of my states plants which produce honey. Cotton was in the charts for producing honey for an extended amount of time in my State.

Phillip
I guess I just view honeydew honey as a loophole in the regulations.  But if it was me, I wouldn't label such a product "Cotton Honey", I'd label it "Cotton Honeydew Honey", because to call it honey is somewhat misleading.

I agree. So far I have stayed away from cotton honey simply for the fear of pesticides..
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV

Online Ben Framed

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Re: Bees in the Oak trees
« Reply #19 on: July 06, 2022, 08:37:11 pm »
Honeydew may bring a premium price?
Here are even more bizarre twist concerning honeydew and honey. There are several articles similar....

Oak Honeydew honey vs floral honey - Nuraxi Life Shophttps://nuraxilife.com ? blogs ? news ? what-is-honeyde...
Apr 29, 2020 ? Honeydew honey contains health promoting antioxidants ; Honeydew honey is higher in the ; antioxidant, ; polyphenol, than traditional honey. The ...

What is Honeydew Honey? - Carolina Honeybeeshttps://carolinahoneybees.com ? ... ? Beekeeping
Health Benefits of Honeydew Honey ? Is honeydew honey better for you? Perhaps. It is generally higher in minerals and amino acids that floral honey. And ...

Health Benefits of Honeydew - WebMDhttps://www.webmd.com ? ... ? Reference
Sep 17, 2020 ? Eating honeydew may help strengthen your bones and prevent the development of certain conditions, including osteoporosis. That's because ...
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV