Laying Workers

[.30WCF]

I see this topic come up frequently, and have seen all the common attempts to remedy it, often unsuccessfully, but...

If we go queenless, we add eggs and brood continually to keep the workers from laying. The nurses will turn some cells into queen cells and a few weeks later all is right in the world. Just don?t forget to keep adding brood until a mated queen returns and starts laying. We are introducing eggs, brood and brood pheromone.

If we get laying workers, the brood pheromone makes the hive think there is a queen and they kill any queen cells we introduce.

Why does us adding day old eggs and brood not make the bees kill the queen cells in the queenless hive?

What would happen if you had laying workers and you removed all the brood frames and replaced them with new foundation, leaving only a couple frames of stores. Then, every other day or so, go through and replace the frames that are nearing completion with new foundation again. A couple days into this, ( once the pheromones are gone ) cut and paste a small patch of eggs from a queen right hive into one of the store frames and see if they draw a queen cell. Just keep pulling drawn comb out and replacing it with foundation until the queen emerges, then let them complete the comb drawing while she goes on a mating flight.
Essentially, not giving the workers anywhere to lay until a queen is returned.
Possibly you could expedite this and introduce a queen after a week and put back some of the drawn comb at the same time.


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[iddee]

What would they eat during that time?

Also, I've never seen a laying worker hive draw comb.

[.30WCF]

It might not work. May be they don?t draw comb. But a few full frames of honey and stores were left in there for food. Sure. A few eggs would get laid in there. Just thinking out loud.
I?ve not had the issue yet, but I was thinking about it.


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[Dan D]

It was someone else's idea from a different forum, but you can suppress the laying worker in a week by adding it to the top of a queen right hive dividing them with a screen where they can't combine and with different entrances.  In a week they will think they are queen right and stop laying worker.  Then you can combine or split them giving the queenless colony some open brood and eggs, where they will make queen cells, or add a queen.  That would be quicker with less resources used up than adding brood every week or taking away all the drawn comb for a while.

[jtcmedic]

I no longer waste the resources on a laying worker, shake them out away and use the drawn comb to make more splits.

[Barhopper]

I no longer waste the resources on a laying worker, shake them out away and use the drawn comb to make more splits.

👍

[The15thMember]

I see this topic come up frequently, and have seen all the common attempts to remedy it, often unsuccessfully, but...

If we go queenless, we add eggs and brood continually to keep the workers from laying. The nurses will turn some cells into queen cells and a few weeks later all is right in the world. Just don?t forget to keep adding brood until a mated queen returns and starts laying. We are introducing eggs, brood and brood pheromone.

If we get laying workers, the brood pheromone makes the hive think there is a queen and they kill any queen cells we introduce.

Why does us adding day old eggs and brood not make the bees kill the queen cells in the queenless hive?

What would happen if you had laying workers and you removed all the brood frames and replaced them with new foundation, leaving only a couple frames of stores. Then, every other day or so, go through and replace the frames that are nearing completion with new foundation again. A couple days into this, ( once the pheromones are gone ) cut and paste a small patch of eggs from a queen right hive into one of the store frames and see if they draw a queen cell. Just keep pulling drawn comb out and replacing it with foundation until the queen emerges, then let them complete the comb drawing while she goes on a mating flight.
Essentially, not giving the workers anywhere to lay until a queen is returned.
Possibly you could expedite this and introduce a queen after a week and put back some of the drawn comb at the same time.


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So as I understand it, the idea behind this is that if you don't give the laying workers any place to lay, they won't lay, and therefore they may draw out a queen cell.  I think that concept is faulty, as laying workers don't only lay in cells, but will lay anywhere.  Also even if they weren't actively laying, I still think a laying worker hive wouldn't draw out a queen cell, since based on the pheromones the laying workers are giving off, the hive believes itself to be queenright. 

[jtcmedic]

Barhoper hows the splits coming.

[TheHoneyPump]

I no longer waste the resources on a laying worker, shake them out away and use the drawn comb to make more splits.

X2
Anything else is exercise in futility fraught with anxiety, disappointment, and ultimate failure.

Laying workers:
1a.  Shake them out near other colonies, AND completely removing the hive equipment right down to the dirt so they have no place to go back to.
OR

 1b.  Newspaper Combine above a strong queenrite colony.

2. Go back 1 to 2 weeks later with a new queen in a cage in your pocket (mated of course), and perform a split setting up a new hive.

Problem is solved effectively and quickly.

[Oldbeavo]

What causes a hive to supersede a queen?
If the laying worker is making the hive think its queen rite, then what would make the bees consider superseding the laying worker?
Can you stress the bees to the extent that if you add brood with eggs they will draw a queen cell?
Putting the drone box above another hive with newspaper does straighten things out, especially if you add a QX so that it eliminates the drones, shake the heads out later.

[Michael Bush]

http://bushfarms.com/beeslayingworkers.htm

[Bill Murray]

I no longer waste the resources on a laying worker, shake them out away and use the drawn comb to make more splits.

X3