Newbee Observation Hive Questions

[iddee]

""You will kill some hives as a beginner beekeeper.  You may as well learn as much as possible in the process."""

Ace MB, more or less, recommends killing the first OH hive just to learn.

Myself, I say go with the lang and maybe take 2 years to learn as much, but have a better chance of keeping the hive alive.

Just the difference in beekeepers. That's what makes it so interesting

[BeeMaster2]

OK Mike Jim and I recommend starting with the Lang first and you recommend starting with the OH first.
Starting means knowing practically nothing about bees when you get your first hive.  So the beginner is going to start with an OH and learn enough to keep it alive for one season or maybe 1/2 season.  Jim suggest the hive will swarm if it is not split the first half season, maybe more then once.  At what point should the newbie place the hive (or a split) into a standard Lang and attempt to go the full season (overwinter).

Second question:
What precautions should I in my area take due to a cool spring with an OH?  My concern would be if the queen lays in the single top frame can the bees keep the brood warm enough overnight.

My skepticism for a newbie starting with a OH is because our club has had one at our local cooperative extension for as long as I have been in the club, 6 years.  Every year the hive dies of calk brood even though the people who have taken care of the hive have many years experience as beekeepers.  I am wondering what they are doing wrong.  Hive is very active during the summer but doesn't make it to the next spring.

Where did I say to start with a OH? I would recommend that you start with a Langstroth and then start your OH.

Do to the size of the hive, most OH hives will swarm especially if they are established before the flow. I always split the hive putting the new queen in a Nuc or if strong enough in a 10 frame hive. And yes, sometimes the bees ball up out side the OH and make a strong split. Doing this allows you learn about new queen development.
If your OH is continually getting chalk brood, I recommend you add some vents to the side of the hive. I only have vents on top of my OH but I will be adding side vents.
Jim

[Acebird]

Where did I say to start with a OH? I would recommend that you start with a Langstroth and then start your OH.

Jim, read my post again, that is what I said.
 

If your OH is continually getting chalk brood, I recommend you add some vents to the side of the hive. I only have vents on top of my OH but I will be adding side vents.

There are vents and I was wondering it this is the issue.  They would be working backwards due to the extreme cold outside with the hive being warm inside.  The inside air would be drafting out the entrance tube.  Typically the entrance frost up where as with a normal vent on a hive outside it is the vent that frost up.  This hive is a stack of four nuc boxes with glass panes on the outside of each box.  Each box may contain 4-5 frames.  Viewing is not that great because all you see is the outside not the center frames.  But when packed full of live bees it is impressive to those that don't raise bees.  I don't see it as much of a learning tool.

[Acebird]

Myself, I say go with the lang and maybe take 2 years to learn as much, but have a better chance of keeping the hive alive.

These are my thoughts also because I feel you need a better understanding of bees just to get them through a summer season in an OH hive.  Someone who knows what they are looking at will see so much more than someone who has no idea what they are looking at.

[Michael Bush]

>OK Mike Jim and I recommend starting with the Lang first and you recommend starting with the OH first.
Starting means knowing practically nothing about bees when you get your first hive.  So the beginner is going to start with an OH and learn enough to keep it alive for one season or maybe 1/2 season.  Jim suggest the hive will swarm if it is not split the first half season, maybe more then once.  At what point should the newbie place the hive (or a split) into a standard Lang and attempt to go the full season (overwinter).

You can't really run an observation hive by itself.  You need a support hive.  I recommend two full hives, a nuc and a observation hive really.  But some people aren't prepared for all that.  Minimum a hive and an observation hive.  Everything that happens in the full size hive is exaggerated in the observation hive.  If the observation hive is about to swarm the other hive is growing.  You can SEE they preparing to swarm in the observation hive.  A new bee keeper is most likely to find out the other hive is going to swarm when it does swarm...  You get to watch it all happen in the observation hive.

>What precautions should I in my area take due to a cool spring with an OH?  My concern would be if the queen lays in the single top frame can the bees keep the brood warm enough overnight.

My observation hive is always in the living room.  I keep bees in it all winter.  I don't worry about how cold it is outside.

>My skepticism for a newbie starting with a OH is because our club has had one at our local cooperative extension for as long as I have been in the club, 6 years.  Every year the hive dies of calk brood even though the people who have taken care of the hive have many years experience as beekeepers.

Is it outside?  Chilled brood is the primary cause of chalkbrood.

> I am wondering what they are doing wrong.  Hive is very active during the summer but doesn't make it to the next spring.

It needs to be protected indoors.  It needs to go into winter strong and well stocked.  You need to be able to feed syrup and pollen in winter to the observation hive to keep them raising small patches of brood from January on.  Otherwise they tend to dwindle too small to make it.

[Acebird]

The hive is inside a government building so I assume the room is maintained at 68-72 degrees.  I don't know if they set back the temperatures at night.
Interesting comment about feed.  I don't think the hive was ever fed other than providing it with honey frames in the fall.

With your living room hive does the entrance frost up or is there not an entrance to the outside during the winter?

[Michael Bush]

Mine is open to the outside at all times except when I'm taking it outside to work it.  I've never had an entrance frost over, no.  I have had the tube clogged with dead bees though.  The undertakers get lazy when there is a tube going outside and sometimes just dump them in the tube instead of getting them all the way outside.

[BeeMaster2]

Brian,
I used to have my OH in my closed in patio. I never had the entrance frost up. I did have the same problem of dead bees clogging up the tube and if I did not clear it right away lots of bees would die.
Jim