Extracting method for natural/wild comb or topbar style AND frames

[GDRankin]

I'd like to get some opinions from others regarding which methods of extraction work best for anyone that has a combination of styles to work with. Meaning, anyone that has experience with extracting from frames as well as from the natural comb structures, i.e. a topbar hive or feral hives from removals as well as from frames from the Langs hives.

I should preface this saying I do removals and we're growing our apiary as we progress and do more and more. I use Rob's BeeVac and relocate the colonies into Langs style boxes with standard frames. Typically I use the deeps for the brood nest and then add a medium full of frames with foundation on top. So I'm considering a small extractor for the wild comb (we get from removals) and maybe a motorized radial next season for the frames. I'm not wanting to throw a couple hundred at a small extractor if it's not going to help with the wild comb, but don't mind spending a little to speed up the process if in fact a small system will actually help.

I'm not sure where I'll top off yet overall, but I'm expecting to have around 25 hives by season/year end. So with any luck and a little help from mother nature, we could be looking at potentially doubling that number by first harvest time next season.

However, the reason I was even considering a small hand crank (2 or 4 frame) extractor at this time is because I sometimes end up with a lot of excess honey doing the removals and need an economical way to extract it from the wild/natural comb. I was considering building or modifying a frame with a cage of some sort to put the comb into for extracting. However, with the irregularities of wild/natural comb structures, I'm not sure how well this will work. How balanced does a 2 / 4 frame extractor need to be to preform vs a larger system?

One concern is . . . Will the natural comb "blow out" of the cage in an extractor?

If so, a small extractor may be a waste of money for this purpose (extracting from wild/natural comb.)  Maybe the crush & strain method (which is what I've been doing) is the best way to go for the comb obtained during a removal? Often times a portion gets crushed from handling it and cutting it out of the cavity where it was built, especially when the temperature is rather warm - which is almost always here in south Texas. So any damaged comb will obviously have to crushed and strained anyway, so the tools and gear needed for that will have to be pulled out, used, cleaned etc. So while it's out . . . do it all?

Of course it all varies from job to job. Sometimes I get 5 lbs and sometimes 50 lbs or more, depending on the size and age of the colony. Sometimes the comb is nice and straight and not too hard to uncap, but other times it is very wavy and non-uniform at all, making the uncapping process a bit more time consuming. (crush & strain makes more sense here seemingly)

The other option I'm exploring for the wild comb is a commercial grade lettuce / salad spinner. I tried a small home version (1.5 gal size), but it was not heavy enough to handle the weight of the honeycomb. Plus the outer walls of the cage were too close to the inner walls of the housing, so the spun honey acted as a brake after only a few spins. I'm going to see a commercial grade 5 gal size ($100 range) next week to see how it is constructed. If the walls are not too close together, this may be a viable solution.

I'm just curious what others are doing with this type of comb when it comes time to extract.
Thanks in advance for the input,
GD

[iddee]

This is the best I have found, in 38 years of doing removals.

http://beekeeperlinda.blogspot.com/2007/06/honey-harvest-crush-and-strain.html

[GDRankin]

Hey Iddee and thanks for the feedback.

We (the wife and I) have been using our own crude version of a crush and strain method, but we were hoping to find something a little more efficient in terms of less honey left on/in the comb. I guess that part is dependent upon just how one goes about the "crushing" part and the tools one comes up with the do the job.

I did find that setting a closed tub out in the heat to warm things up helps a good deal, but obviously gravity only works when the honey has a way to escape and drain well. We ended up with a good bit of honey left in the wax, so evidently we were not "crushing" it flat enough to be considered efficient.

Notes on my Plan B.
I went by a local restaurant supply yesterday to have a look at the commercial grade, 5 gal size, lettuce spinner to see how it was constructed in hopes that may be a good tool for the job. However, even though the store said they had some in stock when I called last week to see if they had one I could look at in person, they just happened to be "out of stock" at that location. So I'll try again and report back with the results.


Thanks again for the reply,
GD

[bud1]

crush and strain as idee says, but if you wanna sling a sweeny would bee yo only bet as it was origionally made fo top bar hives

[GDRankin]

crush and strain as idee says, but if you wanna sling a sweeny would bee yo only bet as it was origionally made fo top bar hives

Ahh okay, bud1. I'll look into that one. I don't think I've heard that name around before. But if it's made for top bars it is worth looking into for wild comb.

Meanwhile, I picked up that 5 gal industrial strength salad spinner today, just to see if it will handle the weight. According to the info that came in the box, it will handle up to 8 lbs at a time. So after looking at the construction of the internal parts, I decided it would be worth a trial. They have a 30 return policy, as long as I don't mess anything up. So we'll soon find out.

It has a nice little built in drain system that seems a tad small, but it looks like it will get the job done.

Here's the website link in case anyone is interested. The pics here are mainly the outside which don't really show the important parts as far as I was concerned, but you'll get the idea. I'll add some pics of the internal works if it turns into something useable for the task at hand . . . I'll let ya'll know how she does with some comb.

http://www.acemart.com/prod112112011.html

PS. Here's an image that shows a birds-eye view of the inside parts.

[hjon71]

This might be what bud was referring to-
http://www.swienty.com/shop/vare.asp?side=0&vareid=108770

I do crush and strain. It is simple and cheap. I dump the wax on a large plastic sheet so any trapped honey can get cleaned up by the bees.

[GDRankin]

Ahh okay, that swienty press looks pretty effecient. Basically like a fruit press with a nice size basket.
I'm not sure what the shipping to the States would be, but 555.40 USD for the unit alone is a little more than I had in mind for extracting the raw comb.

I with you hjon about the crush and strain being cheap. I suppose the simple part is a matter of how you are set up & the tools you use and also how much you do at a time.

I'll keep ya'll posted on how this salad spinner works out.
Thanks for the feedback,
GD

[bud1]

naa hjon, the one I refered looks like a 3ft diameter donut with a spinner handle in the top, it is a honey slinger, I had one but think I gave it to scott

[hjon71]

Sorry bud, I'll keep looking around....after a nap of course  ;)

[Hops Brewster]

That sort of sounds like a cider press or a fruit press.  Now it has me wondering if anyone has tried using a cider press to crush and strain comb.  ???  They sure cost a lot less than a Swienty machine!

[GDRankin]

Okay, as promised  . . . The $125 - 5 gal. size salad spinner results are in.

My initial run was a little less than great, but with some slight modifications . . . this commercial grade salad spinner can be made into a very nice extractor for wild/natural style (frameless) comb.

I had to make a little wire basket to keep the comb off the inner walls of the inside basket because the design of the plastic basket has vertical slats that are about 3/4 an inch wide with 1/8 inch slits. The honeycomb would have been pressed against a solid slat with very little space for the honey to sling through.

So I took a piece of 1/8 hardware cloth and made basically a screen wire liner to go down inside the plastic basket (see pics) and it did the trick . . . Well, kind of anyway. For a test run, I used a couple of scrap pieces of wire I had laying around. (image 1) The basket was a bit too small, so I cut a piece of fresh wire to fit better and offer a wider opening to work with. (used the factory looped edge at the top to prevent any pokey things from pointing up and snagging hands and comb)

The first test run was okay, but with the correction to the wire liner size and a few more ties in a "4 corners" shape, it did it rather well. I extracted several lbs of comb pretty efficiently. I still have some comb that will have to be extracted with the crush and strain method, but I can't imagine being without this device now that I've used it.

The hardest part now becomes uncapping this type of comb. Due to the irregular shapes of the comb and the dis-configuring that takes place during the removal and transport process, that part is still a mess. But I think with a little practice, and maybe a helper, this could be the way to go if you have a lot of this type comb to extract.

I've added a few photos to show how I made the liner and then improved upon it, but I thought I should show how well this thing is built also. Pretty tough and sturdy all and all.

The only issue I ran into was that the drain system (being made for water) is a bit too small and takes a while with cool to room temp honey. So when I didn't want to wait for it to drain, I simply removed the spinner drum, comb and all, and poured the honey out.

I picked this one up at a local restaurant supply store for less than $140, sack & all. I give it a strong 8 on a scale of 10 in terms of usefulness as a tool to have for this specific process.

I'll still be using the crush and strain method some I'm sure, just not on those nice big fat pieces of comb that can be easily uncapped and dropped into this spinner.

I'm not sure how many pics I should post or am allowed, so I'll just add as many as I think will work and hope this helps someone that may need something like this for their comb.