Doing away with SBB?

[RHBee]

I've read where some of y'all are getting away from SBB and going back to solid bottom boards. With the success I've had with the oil traps against SHB I'm not sure that I understand why.
Would anyone mind sharing their reason why?
Ray

[BlueBee]

My hives and nucs tend to have mid or upper entrances so if I need to do anything to the bees, I need the screened bottom board.  However I will admit it has some problems.  Thank God I don’t have small hive beetle here, but the screened bottom gives the wax moths a way to escape the bees and they can setup shop in the wax and debris under the screen.  That isn’t a problem if you always have the oil pan installed, but if you get a little lax with the maintenance, it can get a little messy down there.

If I used bottom entrances I would probably forgo the screened bottom board in Michigan.

[annette]

I know some beeks say it messes with the ventilation. Like if it is a really hot day, it allows too much heat into the hive and the bees have to work harder to keep the hive cooler. Probably same with keeping the hive warmer in the winter.

That makes sense to me, but I just keep my SBB on all year long. I don't like the idea of the mites falling off the bees and being able to crawl back up. 

[BeeMaster2]

Ray,
If I did not have to deal with SHB, I might do away with them but right now they really help with killing the beetles by the thousands when I put the oil in them. Even when they are dry the beetles like to hide in the tray. I open the trays and kill the beetles. They are also good for checking for mite drops and are a good indicator of what is going on in the hive.
Jim

[Intheswamp]

I actually like the idea of stuff falling through the mesh beneath the hive...the ants, pillbugs, spiders, etc., seem to patrol it pretty good.  I've got both solid bottom boards, screened bottom boards, and screened bottom boards with oil trays beneath them....they all seem to beard about the same (relative to hive populations, of course).  I am a little concerned about later this summer when we start hitting the 100+ degree days...it's hot in the briar patch!!!  I'll play it by ear.

People talk about the area beneath the screen being a breeding ground for moth and shb if you have a tray or board underneath...uh, regular inspections take care of that.  Matter of fact, as Jim mentioned, it's a good way to monitor things in the hive.  Sometimes between inspections I'll simply walk along behind the hives and pull trays looking to see what's going on.  If you keep oil in them, well, happy swimming beetles (and moths)!!! :)

The only thing I would say the solid bottom boards might be better at is getting the queen to lay low in the brood chamber...of course if you've got a tray or board beneath the screen bottom board then you've basically got a closed cavity.

Interesting that this thread just came up as I've been tinkering with putting my ISOT mod to three or four more screened bottom boards.  I've change the design a bit, maybe tomorrow I can get pictures up in the old thread... Simple oil tray mod for sbb's...

Interesting thing, is that the SHB numbers have been low so far this year.  I'm getting ready for them, though. ;)

I think my favorite of the bottom boards are the screened ones with oil tray inserts.

Ed

[capt44]

We have small hive beetles here in Central Arkansas and they are starting to get bad again this year.
I do keep beetle traps in my hives and do good killing beetles.
But when you've got a lot of hives it's not easy to spend Forty dollars or so for a bottom board with a screen and tray.
I have to wind up treating in the fall anyway so I eliminate some expense.
To me a hive is like a car, you can buy a car plain jane that will get you from point A to point B very good.
Or you can buy all these little accessories that you'll a lot of time never use.
I raise bees and sell them, what I've found is they lay brood further down in the bottom box with a solid bottom board.
I really believe it's either a light or temperature issue.
Don't get me wrong, I've still got some screened bottom boards but when I go to split a hive I usually change them out and give the screened bottom board away.

[GDRankin]

Interesting thread - all the way around.
I'm in the process of making a few SBBs for a few boxes that will house new hives from cutouts, two of the three had a fair amount of SHBs in their previous locations. I eliminated as many as I could find, but I'm still seeing a few here and there.

I haven't seen the SBBs with the oil trays, but that does make sense. What type of oil is being used in them and roughly how deep would it need to be? I'm guessing an eight inch should do the trick eh?

[Intheswamp]

Vegetable cooking oil is most often used in the oil trays.  Mineral oil doesn't have the "critter appeal" that cooking oils do, though.  Personally I use mineral oil.

Depth can be as thin as sprayed on PAM to ever how deep you fill the tray.  Most hives are leveled to the precision where a tray full of oil will be level so I put enough oil in each tray to insure that the bottom is covered.  All the beetles need to do is get the oil on them and they're pretty much a goner...same goes with bees so be careful the bees can't get to the oil.  The more full the trays are the more likely it is to spill the oil while moving the tray during inspections.

I use baking pans I get at the dollar store for $5....and do a few mods to my bottom boards.  The sides of the pans are about 3/4" tall.

Hope that helps some.

Best wishes,
Ed

ETA:  The pans are actually 1" tall, not 3/4" tall.

[GDRankin]

Okay, good deal.

Thanks for the info Ed.

[BeeMaster2]

GD,
Like Ed said, it does not take much, the less the better. I have a SBB that I put oil in about 2 weeks ago. I only put enough so that I could spread it all over the bottom. I checked it last night. The trash/pollen in the bottom has absorbed most of the oil but it is still wet enough to kill the beetles and it has killed lots of them.
Jim

[GDRankin]

Thanks for the info Jim,
Sounds like an effective method for getting rid of the unwanted pests. So, am I understanding correctly . . . the pan goes under the screen but is part of a SBB designed with the pan/oil tray as part of the SBB? Or are you simply placing a tray under a standard SBB?

Thanks again!

[BeeMaster2]

Thanks for the info Jim,
Sounds like an effective method for getting rid of the unwanted pests. So, am I understanding correctly . . . the pan goes under the screen but is part of a SBB designed with the pan/oil tray as part of the SBB? Or are you simply placing a tray under a standard SBB?

Thanks again!

You have to design it so that the bees cannot get into the pan. I designed my SBB with the #8 screen so that there is very little wood under the frames, just screen, so that when the beetles get knocked off of a frame, by the bees, they hit the screen. I have a 1 1/2" opening in the back of the SBB where the oil tray goes in. It is screwed to a 1 1/2" wide board that fits in the opening to keep the bees out. Under the oil tray I have window screen to keep the bees from coming in from the bottom but is allows air in, in front of the oil tray.
Jim

[GDRankin]

Okay, that makes sense. Thanks for the info Jim!

[BeeMaster2]

No problem.

[Intheswamp]

Ok, apparently I'm not doing away with screened bottom boards at the moment...ISOT II  :)

Ed

[RHBee]

Okay, So far all I'm getting for reasons is 1-The queen will lay deeper in the brood chamber wirh a solid bottom board. 2-Bottom boards with oio traps are a PITA to build and maintain. 3-The cost of SBB with oil traps if purchased is to great for some to justify.
I would like to thank those who redponded to this post. As for me I will to continue to use the SBB with the oil trap. I have experienced the effectivness of these first hand. With the concentration of SHB in my area I find it hard not to keep them installed.
Ray

[BeeMaster2]

Good choice Ray.  :-D
Jim