Author Topic: Homemade silicone vax cell mold (Read 27624 times)

edward · « **Reply #20 on:** February 06, 2014, 04:31:42 pm »

Quote from: capt44 on February 06, 2014, 11:55:40 am

Oh I might add that I bought 7 tubes of silicone.It only took 2 tubes to form the mold on all pieces.I ordered some Wax foundation from Mann Lake ltd but they won't ship it until the temperatures warm up.They said sometime in March.

How big are your silicone tubes, What size was the mold you made?

Maybee a beekeeping friend or neighbor has a wax frame?

mvh Edward :-P

capt44 · « **Reply #21 on:** February 06, 2014, 09:41:31 pm »

Alright, the silicone tubes I bought are 10.1 fl. oz or 299 mL
I've ask around and some have wax foundation that has wire in it.
Don't know how the wire would do.
I ordered plain wax foundation.
I've got a meeting Monday night I'll see if I can get a sheet of wax foundation from one of the members.
It's so cold right now I'm afraid of a sheet of wax foundation breaking.
It's 16 degrees F out there now and had a high today of 20 degrees F.
It's unusually cold here, our normal temps average 53 degrees F but not this year.

flyboy · « **Reply #22 on:** February 06, 2014, 10:02:47 pm »

Quote from: capt44 on February 06, 2014, 09:41:31 pm

Alright, the silicone tubes I bought are 10.1 fl. oz or 299 mL
I've ask around and some have wax foundation that has wire in it.
Don't know how the wire would do.
I ordered plain wax foundation.
I've got a meeting Monday night I'll see if I can get a sheet of wax foundation from one of the members.
It's so cold right now I'm afraid of a sheet of wax foundation breaking.
It's 16 degrees F out there now and had a high today of 20 degrees F.
It's unusually cold here, our normal temps average 53 degrees F but not this year.

I would guess that the wire would have no effect, provided it is completely buried in the wax. In fact I was theorizing that I would bury wire in the foundation when I was making it. Use a fairly light gauge wire, maybe even fishing line. I was theorizing that on the side of the mold putting a nail or whatever that you could hook the line around as you went back and forth. Then on the frame you could have a way to grab the wire/line to attach it to the side. Maybe a pin?

my-smokepole · « **Reply #23 on:** February 10, 2014, 10:22:32 am »

If you use plain #1 silicone it is moisture cured. I have made some casting molds this way. Normally I put the silicone under water and work moisture in to it and then use it to mold up. It will cure in 5 minutes or so.

capt44 · « **Reply #24 on:** February 16, 2014, 09:13:13 am »

Alright I made another attempt at using Rite-Cell foundation to make the mold since I didn't have any wax foundation on hand at this time.
I had over 3/4 of the cells release good but the other 1/4 were still in the plastic foundation.
It also failed, my conclusion on this is the cells are too deep in the foundation for the silicone to release properly.
I used a spray canola oil which worked a lot better.
I also let the mold dry undisturbed for 3 days.
I now have some wax foundation and am going to try it.
The cells on the wax foundation are only a fraction as deep as the plastic foundation.
I am determined to build this mold.
It only takes 2 tubes of silicone to cover all the parts.

BeeMaster2 · « **Reply #25 on:** February 19, 2014, 12:32:27 pm »

I am thinking about making this mold, not for foundation but for making rolled candles. Now I just have to buy a unwired wax foundation.
Jim

edward · « **Reply #26 on:** February 19, 2014, 02:15:32 pm »

Quote from: sawdstmakr on February 19, 2014, 12:32:27 pm

I am thinking about making this mold, not for foundation but for making rolled candles. Now I just have to buy a unwired wax foundation.Jim

From what I understand the wax Foundation that is handmade in Silicon molds is a Little bit brittle and does not bend like the stuff from the suppliers. So you will have a hard time Rolling candles.

This is probably due to the home made stuff is a bit thicker

mvh Edward :-P

BeeMaster2 · « **Reply #27 on:** February 20, 2014, 12:15:58 pm »

Quote from: edward on February 19, 2014, 02:15:32 pm

Quote from: sawdstmakr on February 19, 2014, 12:32:27 pm
I am thinking about making this mold, not for foundation but for making rolled candles. Now I just have to buy a unwired wax foundation.Jim

From what I understand the wax Foundation that is handmade in Silicon molds is a Little bit brittle and does not bend like the stuff from the suppliers. So you will have a hard time Rolling candles.

This is probably due to the home made stuff is a bit thicker

mvh Edward :-P

Thanks Edward,
Maybe I won't make one. :-D
Jim

capt44 · « **Reply #28 on:** February 20, 2014, 10:32:22 pm »

Alright I'm trying #3 at building the mold.
I got some wax foundation and sprayed it down with canola oil and applied the silicone.
I've got it sandwiched between to 3/4 inch Birch plywood boards with the piano hinge installed.
I'm going to let it cure until Saturday afternoon before I open it.
The foundation cells aren't as deep as the Plastic Rite Cell foundation.
Anyhow Saturday is the day of reckoning.

BeeMaster2 · « **Reply #29 on:** February 20, 2014, 10:53:28 pm »

Good luck Capt. I have my fingers crossed. Waiting to find out the results. Did you use #1 silicone?
Jim

capt44 · « **Reply #30 on:** February 22, 2014, 01:40:57 am »

Nupe I sure didn't.
I didn't read the post about silicone #1 until after I finished again.
If this doesn't work I'm going to try something else.
I did some research and found some silicone called OO MOO 300.
It comes in 2 parts and you have to mix it.
They even sell a release agent.
I've got my fingers crossed for the mold I've got curing out in the shop.

edward · « **Reply #31 on:** February 22, 2014, 01:46:39 am »

When some people make wax sheets they use pressured air to separate the wax from the mold , insted of waiting for it to cool.

Could help in separating the mold.

mvh Edward :-P

BeeMaster2 · « **Reply #32 on:** February 22, 2014, 07:01:13 am »

Edward,
By pressured air, do you mean using an air nozzle, like you use to blow dust away, to blow air under the wax to lift it?
Jim

edward · « **Reply #33 on:** February 22, 2014, 11:09:08 am »

Yes a nozzle, a short well oriented blast helps speed up the process without breakage when trying to loosen the foundation. The wax pops up.

This is from talking to ecological beekeepers that have bought the expensive factory made molds.

mvh Edward :-P

BeeMaster2 · « **Reply #34 on:** February 22, 2014, 04:38:59 pm »

Quote from: edward on February 22, 2014, 11:09:08 am

Yes a nozzle, a short well oriented blast helps speed up the process without breakage when trying to loosen the foundation. The wax pops up.

This is from talking to ecological beekeepers that have bought the expensive factory made molds.

mvh Edward :-P

That is good to know. Thanks.
Jim

capt44 · « **Reply #35 on:** February 23, 2014, 01:09:49 am »

Alright I opened the mold today.
The foundation turned loose, or I'll say over 3/4 of it did.
The release agent I used didn't work like I thought it would.
The canola oil and silicone don't work good together.
Sooooooooooo I'm making another attempt at it.
I've done quite abit of research and went to a site called http://www.Smooth-On.com
They make supplies for all types of molds and I talked to a technician about the mold I am making.
He said to use a silicone rubber that you mix and pour it into the mold.
He said it will work better and less trouble than the way I was trying to do it.
They have a release agent you paint on with a brush, 2 coats.
You let one coat dry for 20 minutes and apply the other coat and let it completely dry.
You then mix the silicone liquid and pour it into the mold and it will cure in 6 hours at room temperature.
The name of the Silicone liquid is OO MOO 300
The release agent is One Step Release Agent and Sealer
I have ordered enough to do this mold which will take 7.28 pounds of silicone total.
I should have it in a few days.
I'm determined to make a mold that will be good and affordable to the average beekeeper.
If this works I'll then build one using small cell foundation.

flyboy · « **Reply #36 on:** February 23, 2014, 04:27:33 pm »

Capt44,

Thanks! You are a trooper!!!

What size silicone did you order? The trial size @25.47?

capt44 · « **Reply #37 on:** February 24, 2014, 11:11:44 pm »

Yep I ordered 2 trial sizes and 1 bottle of the release agent.
The tech even told me how to set up a mold to pour the liquid silicone in.
I will have 2 molds, one for each side.
I will then put them on boards and install the piano hinge and sides.

capt44 · « **Reply #38 on:** March 09, 2014, 12:05:08 pm »

Alright I got the liquid silicone rubber in and am building the mold.
Make 2 frames.
I cut a piece of 3/8 in plywood about 1 inch wider and longer than the foundation.
I then cut 3/4 X 3 1/2 inch board into strips 1 inch wide and brad nailed them to the plywood.
I put the strips on all four sides.
I then used wood glue and glued all joints where the strips met the plywood to seal off any openings.
Once dried I placed the foundation in the frame and painted the Release agent on the wood and foundation.
I used an air hose set at 40psi to blow out any access release agent to stop any puddle'n of the agent.
I let it dry for 15 minutes and applied another coat and blew it off and let it dry for 45 minutes.
Be sure to notice how the foundation is put in the mold, each side is different, the cells are offset approx. 1/2 cell.
I then mixed the liquid Silicone as per the instructions, it is 2 parts that mixes in equal proportions.
I poured the liquid into the mold and let it set 6 hours, I waited 12 hours.
I took my pocket knife and cut along the boards of the silicone which has cured.
I took a screw driver and removed the outside wooden strips.
I then lifted the corner of the silicone off the foundation and pulled it off slowly.
Both molds turned out Perfect!
I am going to make the wooden press as previously made with 3/4 inch Birch and piano hinges and such.
I haven't washed the molds yet, the lighter color is wax that was in the plastic foundation.
This attempt with liquid silicone and a release agent was a success.
I used OOH MOO 30 and One Step release agent from http://www.smooth-on.com
When I get the rest of it made I'll show pictures of the final product.
Here are a couple of pictures of the finished mold.

edward · « **Reply #39 on:** March 09, 2014, 01:29:48 pm »

X:X