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Author Topic: Apiguard situation help please  (Read 2004 times)

Offline wittonwoods

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Apiguard situation help please
« on: September 26, 2017, 07:54:17 pm »
I am complete novice and inherited a nuc at short notice from a few months ago. Bought a hive and not done much with it but bees seem to be doing ok.

I have 2 brood supers covered by a Queen Excluder covered by a board with a hole in it and the crown on top.

I want to treat the hive for Varroa. I was going to situate in under the Crown as the bees can get up there. The instructions on the Apiguard suggest that it should be place directly on the brood box and then create some space above by installing another empty super.

Would I be ok to do as I intended anyway?

Thanks


Offline Psparr

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Re: Apiguard situation help please
« Reply #1 on: September 26, 2017, 09:08:56 pm »
I would first figure out wether you need to treat, then if it is indicated, treat as directed.

Offline wittonwoods

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Re: Apiguard situation help please
« Reply #2 on: September 27, 2017, 04:28:22 am »
Ok thanks.
I was only planning to treat because someone I know who keeps bees received a text alert for Varroa from the County bee association and I was just going to treat as a belt and braces approach. I would know evidence of varroa if I saw it at the moment.

Offline little john

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Re: Apiguard situation help please
« Reply #3 on: September 27, 2017, 02:08:51 pm »
I have 2 brood supers covered by a Queen Excluder covered by a board with a hole in it and the crown on top. I want to treat the hive for Varroa. I was going to situate in under the Crown as the bees can get up there.

Something doesn't quite 'compute' about this set-up.  I'm assuming you're using standard National kit ? (please correct me if not)

"2 brood supers" ... are you then using 2 x 150mm Shallow National boxes (often called 'Supers') instead of a standard 225mm Deep National box (which are often simply called 'Brood Boxes') ?

You say these are covered by a Queen Excluder. Why ?  A Queen Excluder has no place on any UK beehive at this time of the year.

Next you say over the QX you have a board with a hole in it.  From a distance that suggests it's a standard Crown Board - but then you say you have a Crown Board on top of that board.  Unless the first board has some depth to it (i.e. is an eke) I can't quite see what it's function is.

But - that QX really needs to come off. If, as you say, the bees can enter a space above the QX, that means that the queen could be left behind in the process.  Which may not be a problem right now in September, but later on when the weather turns cold, that could well result in a dead Queen.

My apologises if I appear to have 'taken your post apart' but I'm just keen to understand your setup and try to ensure that a fellow countryman has the best possible chance of a successful first over-wintering.
LJ
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Offline wittonwoods

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Re: Apiguard situation help please
« Reply #4 on: September 27, 2017, 04:56:11 pm »
Thanks for your reply. No problem in taking the post apart. I will provide the measurements after I have got my tape measure out tomorrow morning.

I may have misled you. Sounds like the timber panel is what you have called a standard crown board. On top of that is the hood (lid) which I mistakenly called the Crown. I will attach a photo of my set up tomorrow and would be very grateful for further comment.

Many thanks

Offline wittonwoods

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Re: Apiguard situation help please
« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2017, 06:55:21 am »
Hi again little john. First of all thank you for showing an interest as I clearly have not got a clue.

To explain my ignorance briefly:
At the end of a convivial evening I agreed to take on a Nuc from a friend who desperately needed to find a home for them before going on holiday (I have always been interested in the concept anyway). My friend ordered me the hive and equipment, bees were installed and I have got on with it.
Due to various reasons I have not been able to do any proper research, reading youtube and the like and have merely checked the bees occasionally to ensure all appears well. There are loads more bees in there now with everything appearing to be happening so all seems well.

I was getting my terminology wrong. I am attaching a picture of the set up. The 2 boxes are 225mm boxes. I do have a couple of the shallow ones in the shed that I have not used yet.

You say I should take the QX out. I can easily do that. Presumably to re-install in springtime when the honey supers are placed on top.

Someone told me that they had received a Varroa text alert from the Norfolk Beekeeping Association (which I intend to join); they suggested that I treat the hive for Varroa as a precaution. I have had a look at the bottom tray and I could not see any evidence of them but I am not sure that I would spot that at this stage.
I was told to place the Apiguard sachet under the cover on top of the Crown Board. The instructions state to place immediately on top of the Brood Box and create a space above by placing a Super on top (empty of trays presumably). It would be easier to do as I intended but no point if it will not be effective. If I do as the instructions state would I remove the additional super at the end of the treatment?
Your comments are welcome.

Offline Kathyp

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Re: Apiguard situation help please
« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2017, 01:55:08 pm »
I use a 2 inch spacer frame that I made.  I put the Apiguard on, then the spacer, then the top lid.  The reason it says put it over the brood is that you would not use it if you had honey supers on. 

Also, be aware of the temp recommendations with Apiguard.  It requires warm weather to work well.  If your temps are to low, you still get some effect, but it will not work as well.

Apiguard is well tolerated by the bees and if you are not sure what you are looking at, and want to treat, it's a good choice.  Since you are not sure what you are looking at, this might be a good idea. 

Do not worry about not knowing.  You can post pics when you have questions and it makes it easier for people to help you out.
Someone really ought to tell them that the world of Ayn Rand?s novel was not meant to be aspirational.

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Re: Apiguard situation help please
« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2017, 02:08:29 pm »
Nice looking hive, clean entrance, elevated hive on a concrete pad with the brush/grass cleared.  Very well maintained, good job, fella.
Blessings

Offline little john

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Re: Apiguard situation help please
« Reply #8 on: September 28, 2017, 02:09:58 pm »
Hi again

Don't worry at all about the ignorance stuff - we ALL start beekeeping exactly the same

Seems you've gone from a Nuc to TWO brood boxes in one season. Strewth - that either means one of those boxes is full of fresh air (i.e. empty - which is not good) - or - you've got yourself one helluva colony (which would be fantastic).

You say that you've been checking them occasionally - by that do you mean you've been pulling frames out and so forth ?  If so, and if you're comfortable doing that - can I suggest you check both boxes while the weather is reasonably kind, and assess whether both of those boxes are really necessary.  The less excess space they have over winter, the better.  One other thing to be checking for at this time of the year is whether the colony has enough stores (i.e. capped honey).  If not, then you'll need to feed 'em.

A suggestion:  bearing in mind that you've been 'chucked in at the deep end of the pool' so to speak, might it be possible for you to make contact with a local beekeeping association and explain your situation, and maybe somebody could visit and watch over your shoulder once or twice ?  People here (including myself) will be all too willing to help - but at a distance of course - and nothing beats the on-site presence of an experienced pair of hands and eyes when it comes to inspections.

If you're anywhere within West Norfolk - near King's Lynn/Dereham etc - can I suggest you contact Pete Davies at: http://www.wnklba.co.uk/.  He lives a mile or so from the Sutton Swing Bridge, and is a very approachable guy. I'm sure he'll help out if you're based in that area.  Don't know about further into Norfolk, but I'm sure there are plenty of beekeepers around - as it's such a good county for beekeeping.
 
I won't comment on the use of Apiguard, as I've never used it.  I'm very much a 'Vapourised Oxalic Acid and nothing else' person, and very much look forward to the day when I can even stop using that.

BTW - welcome to the forum - a good choice, this being the BEST beekeeping forum on the Internet. Bar none.
LJ
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Offline wittonwoods

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Re: Apiguard situation help please
« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2017, 03:57:33 pm »
Well I received a nuc and some other bees in another box, not a nuc I don't think and can't remember what it was called. I put the nuc in the bottom box and the others in the top box separated by newspaper........just doing what I was told. Seems to have worked out as there seems plenty of bees in both boxes now.

I am on the other side of Norfolk just the other side of Cromer from where you are looking. I will have a scout round more locally and carry on posing questions on here.

Many thanks to you all for your comments.

Offline little john

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Re: Apiguard situation help please
« Reply #10 on: September 29, 2017, 05:08:27 am »
Ok - that sounds good. 

My concern was that in Britain a nuc is normally a 5-frame mini-colony ('nuc' being a fairly loose term: can be anything from 3-6 frames), with typically just 3 or 4 of those frames being 'wall to wall' bees.  So to go from that size to filling even one 11-frame DN brood box in a season would be viewed by many as being pretty good going.(*)

But - you've added more bees (a technique known as 'combining') - so that explains the size of the colony you currently have.  Sounds like you're off to a very good start.
LJ

(*) In Scotland - and in other places where the British/German Black Bees are popular - one DN Brood box is as big as their colonies ever get !
A Heretics Guide to Beekeeping - http://heretics-guide.atwebpages.com

 

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