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Author Topic: House Repealed Obamacare  (Read 1860 times)

Offline Acebird

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #60 on: May 31, 2017, 09:47:01 am »
Doctors are not experts on prescriptions anyway.  They go on the word of a salesman from the pharmaceuticals who are pushing the drug.  The best information to get is from a pharmacist but they have to be careful about not stepping on the doctors toes.  You have to keep asking questions about a drug that doesn't corner the pharmacist into a diagnosis of the illness.  Every side effect has to be listed in very fine print because usually there are a lot of side effects.  Almost all prescription drugs will kill you which is why they are prescriptions in the first place.
Opioids are addictive almost 100% even after a short time of use.  Way too many prescriptions written for opioids.
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Offline sawdstmakr

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #61 on: May 31, 2017, 01:33:37 pm »
Doctors are not experts on prescriptions anyway.  They go on the word of a salesman from the pharmaceuticals who are pushing the drug. 
Brian,
My neighbor's dad, a famous college running back, with a 4 year degree,  with no medical back ground,  used to brag that he would go into a doctors office and tell the doctors what drugs to prescribe. It was a big joke.
Jim
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Offline kathyp

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #62 on: May 31, 2017, 02:14:58 pm »
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Heck, here it is against the law to by heart worm medicine for your dog and now antibiotic for your bees  With out perscriptions.

The problem is not the doctors...union? or the pharmacists.  It is the FDA.  The FDA decides how to schedule drugs, which drugs can be over the counter or by prescription only and it is the FDA that has taken away our ability to buy antibiotics for our livestock over the counter.

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This happened before ACA and I ask you why does it have to happen at all?

It happens because people are lazy and selfish.  It is easier to walk into the ER and get something for the snotty nose than to go to the grocery store and buy something or make an appointment.  When they said ACA would keep people out of the ER I laughed.  The cheaper or more available you make something, the more it will be abused.  My husband works for a non-profit HMO.  The majority of abuse of they services comes from the Medicaid patients. 

Abuse=walkins without appointments, skipped appointments with no cancellation, late, abuse of prescriptions, failure to follow directions, appointments for minor complaints....

If I miss an appointment and have not called to cancel, I am charged.  They are not. 

?Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered. And the process is continuing day by day and minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Party is always right.?


― George Orwell, 1984

Offline Acebird

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #63 on: May 31, 2017, 02:33:15 pm »
Kathy if you can identify the problem then fix it.  Don't blame the program as a whole.
You are way off on the FDA.  The manufacturer decides on whether to develop a drug to treat an illness based on how profitable it will be.  All the research is done by the manufacturer.  All the testing is done by the manufacturer.  How the drug should be used is decided by the manufacturer based on their tests and knowledge of the subject.  The FDA reviews the procedures and tests done on the drug and makes a determination on whether the manufacturer did enough.  A certain percentage of failures are allowed especially if there is no other successful treatment.  The FDA is a government overseer not a developer of anything.

Sorry, it is the misuse of antibiotics that has resulted in stronger control of antibiotics for livestock.
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Offline kathyp

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #64 on: May 31, 2017, 08:54:08 pm »
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The manufacturer decides on whether to develop a drug to treat an illness based on how profitable it will be.  All the research is done by the manufacturer.  All the testing is done by the manufacturer.  How the drug should be used is decided by the manufacturer based on their tests and knowledge of the subject.  The FDA reviews the procedures and tests done on the drug and makes a determination on whether the manufacturer did enough.  A certain percentage of failures are allowed especially if there is no other successful treatment.  The FDA is a government overseer not a developer of anything.

Sorry, it is the misuse of antibiotics that has resulted in stronger control of antibiotics for livestock.

Yes, a company does want to make a profit.  Shock!!  Testing procedures are not set by the manufacturer, they are set by the FDA.  They are extremely expensive.  The FDA decides how to schedule a drug.  This has an impact on cost and availability.  Getting a drug through the FDA hoops can cost billions of dollars before a drug even goes to market.  If the FDA shoots it down, that's billions lost.  I am not saying there should be no standards, but the FDA is down to dictating to doctors how and when they can prescribe certain things.  That is your government getting between you and your doctor. 

And no, it is not the misuse of antibiotics that caused the FDA to control them for livestock any more than it's the misuse of cow ponds that caused the EPA to claim dominion over all water.  They did it because they are the government and the government will control anything it can.
?Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered. And the process is continuing day by day and minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Party is always right.?


― George Orwell, 1984

Offline Acebird

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #65 on: June 01, 2017, 09:29:26 am »
Kathy, please read this.  Your concept of the FDA is way off based.
Medical doctors are give the sole authority for prescribing drugs and most have had no prior knowledge of how the drug was developed.  Do you want them to use you as a guinea pig?  I don't.  I want some other governing body to watch over what they do and that goes the same for the manufacturer.  The FDA is actually protecting the profits of the pharmaceuticals because if left unchecked 25% of the population would die and that would kill their profits.  Might even drive them out of business by the time the lawyers are done with them.

I am pretty sure that the EPA has expanded because of Homeland security.  And both are driven in this direction because of the war mongers who have increased the number of enemies we have today.
Brian Cardinal
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Offline Acebird

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #66 on: June 01, 2017, 09:32:36 am »
And no, it is not the misuse of antibiotics that caused the FDA to control them for livestock

Unfortunately the data proves otherwise.
Brian Cardinal
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Offline kathyp

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #67 on: June 01, 2017, 12:06:24 pm »
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Medical doctors are give the sole authority for prescribing drugs and most have had no prior knowledge of how the drug was developed.

Nice if you include your source.  I can tell you that this is not true.  It is especially untrue when it comes to narcotics.  Medical doctors have been dictated to on how and how much they can prescribe and if they fall outside those mandates, they are investigated.  Guess who is suffering?

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I am pretty sure that the EPA has expanded because of Homeland security.

Please explain 1. how you came to this conclusion?  2. how cow ponds are a national security issue? and 3.  why the EPA would be involved in national security in the first place?
?Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered. And the process is continuing day by day and minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Party is always right.?


― George Orwell, 1984

Offline kathyp

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #68 on: June 01, 2017, 12:07:08 pm »
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Unfortunately the data proves otherwise.

Data from who?  The FDA?
?Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered. And the process is continuing day by day and minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Party is always right.?


― George Orwell, 1984

Offline Acebird

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #69 on: June 01, 2017, 02:15:42 pm »
Guess who is suffering?
The ones who are suffering are the ones that become addicts due to over prescribing.  Yes, then the FDA steps in based on data to curb the problem.  That is what I want them to do.  Prevent a patient from becoming an addict when they had no intention of becoming one.
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I am pretty sure that the EPA has expanded because of Homeland security.

Please explain 1. how you came to this conclusion?  2. how cow ponds are a national security issue? and 3.  why the EPA would be involved in national security in the first place?

The EPA already has the staff to check into environment issues.  Homeland security has no way of doing this.  Our water supply is vulnerable to terrorist attack or industrial polution.  The EPA is most likely the one to find it first.
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Offline Acebird

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #70 on: June 01, 2017, 02:19:29 pm »
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Unfortunately the data proves otherwise.

Data from who?  The FDA?

From the medical and pharmaceutical industries.  Both are required to keep documents and answer any complaints.  The FDA steps in when a trend indicates a problem.  I want them to do that.
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Offline kathyp

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #71 on: June 01, 2017, 07:22:46 pm »
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Our water supply is vulnerable to terrorist attack or industrial polution.  The EPA is most likely the one to find it first.

Well, I will be mightily impressed if the bad guys tromp out to the middle of nowhere and poison my cow pond!

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The ones who are suffering are the ones that become addicts due to over prescribing.  Yes, then the FDA steps in based on data to curb the problem.  That is what I want them to do.  Prevent a patient from becoming an addict when they had no intention of becoming one.

So you are happy to have the government dictate how and what to prescribe to patients?  Wouldn't it be better to go after those who are proved to over prescrib rather than make all docs afraid to use the tools they have?
?Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered. And the process is continuing day by day and minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Party is always right.?


― George Orwell, 1984

Offline Acebird

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #72 on: June 02, 2017, 05:45:24 pm »
Well, I will be mightily impressed if the bad guys tromp out to the middle of nowhere and poison my cow pond!
Kathy where does the water in the pond come from?  It can be poisoned from the air or from a small charge in a well that reaches an aquifer that is common to ponds, lakes and streams.  It can also be poisoned from run off.
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So you are happy to have the government dictate how and what to prescribe to patients?  Wouldn't it be better to go after those who are proved to over prescrib rather than make all docs afraid to use the tools they have?

The over prescribing wasn't on purpose.  It happened not knowing what would happen over time.  It also happens when you give a group of people (farmers, beekeepers for example) drugs and chemicals for treatments with no way to control what they do.  I am happy that there is a government overseer that has the power to stop something that is harmful.  I am happy that they have more power than corporate america.  Do I think the FDA is perfect?  Not on your life it is government but I am sure glad we got them.
Brian Cardinal
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Offline kathyp

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #73 on: June 02, 2017, 06:31:45 pm »
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It also happens when you give a group of people (farmers, beekeepers for example) drugs and chemicals for treatments with no way to control what they do.

That's the heart of it, isn't it?  controlling what they do.  I don't eat my horses, but I can no longer buy what I need to treat them.  I have to call the vet and spend several 100 dollars to do what used to cost me 10. 
?Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered. And the process is continuing day by day and minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Party is always right.?


― George Orwell, 1984

Offline beecanbee

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #74 on: June 02, 2017, 06:41:45 pm »
  ...  I don't eat my horses, but I can no longer buy what I need to treat them.

You might not eat them, but if they are sold, they might still be eaten - while you don`t, many do.  (BTW, I know nothing of the drugs for livestock issue, and I do commiserate on your financial drain due to this.)
"I come from a state that raises corn and cotton and cockleburs and Democrats, and frothy eloquence neither convinces nor satisfies me. I am from Missouri. You have got to show me."  Duncan Vandiver

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Offline Acebird

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #75 on: June 02, 2017, 08:55:17 pm »
I have to call the vet and spend several 100 dollars to do what used to cost me 10.

I am sorry for you Kathy but many cannot afford horses and  I don't think their lives are worth your 90 dollar increase.  So my attitude is suck it up.
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Offline kathyp

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #76 on: June 02, 2017, 10:31:53 pm »
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I am sorry for you Kathy but many cannot afford horses and  I don't think their lives are worth your 90 dollar increase.  So my attitude is suck it up.

Of course, that is your answer.  typically liberal.  I should suck it up AND pay for what others want as well. 
?Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered. And the process is continuing day by day and minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Party is always right.?


― George Orwell, 1984

Offline gww

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #77 on: June 03, 2017, 01:46:53 pm »
I think it is idiotic to have to go to a vet for animal care that you could handle on you own.  The same with heart worm on a dog.  You have to get a perscription for something you are going to give to a dog for life once a month.  It is stupid to take something like farming small scale where the profit margins are very small and make animal care so expensive that the only ones who can do any good are the ones that get big enough to own enough animals to keep a full time vet on the payroll and take smaller margines of profit for each animal it raises.  It is nothing but a scam that is for big buisness and to drive small guys out of the game.  These are animals and not people.  It is ok for the dog catcher to kill all the dogs that no one comes and gets but not ok for a layman to try and keep his dog (or other animal) heathy.  There are reasons that these laws are made but I doubt very seriously if it is for good will but more because there is money involved somewhere.

Kathy,  It is a horse and you should be allowed to take care of it with out having to pay some one to tell you what you already know.
Cheers
gww

Offline Dallasbeek

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #78 on: June 03, 2017, 06:07:18 pm »
I've known people who got veterinary medicines to use on themselves.  They are, after all, the same drugs, are they not?   Somebody got wise to this and changed yhe rules so as to force these people to go to docs that practice human medicine or really have a sick dog or horse seen by a vet.
"Liberty lives in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no laws, no court can save it." - Judge Learned Hand, 1944

Offline kathyp

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Re: House Repealed Obamacare
« Reply #79 on: June 03, 2017, 06:19:57 pm »
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Somebody got wise to this and changed yhe rules so as to force these people to go to docs that practice human medicine or really have a sick dog or horse seen by a vet.

Maybe, but that's been going on for many, many, years.  Is it the job of the government to make sure we are looked after in the way they think appropriate?  If you want that to be the job of the government, what are the limits, if any?
?Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered. And the process is continuing day by day and minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Party is always right.?


― George Orwell, 1984