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Author Topic: How do honey bees survive without water?  (Read 3886 times)

Offline The15thMember

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Re: How do honey bees survive without water?
« Reply #20 on: October 23, 2021, 06:38:43 pm »
The air is far too dry to get condensation in the winter.  In a lot of areas up north snow actually dries out without melting.

In some climates perhaps. Here in the UK our winters are mainly cool and damp as opposed to very cold and dry.
Condensation within a hive can be a real problem in winter over here. Open mesh floors were designed to alleviate the problem for many beekeepers. Mine and others experience suggests its the size of the colony and the space it occupies that is one the main factors.E.G a small colony sat in 11 frames will have damp moist sides and end frames, however put that colony inside a nuc and the condensation disappears..or the bees use it up before it's noticeable  :tongue:
My climate sounds similar to yours, Nigel.  I battle with condensation and mold year round.  I use moisture quilts on my hives in the winter to keep water from dripping onto the cluster. 
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Offline Acebird

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Re: How do honey bees survive without water?
« Reply #21 on: October 24, 2021, 08:56:43 am »
The air is far too dry to get condensation in the winter.  In a lot of areas up north snow actually dries out without melting.

In some climates perhaps. Here in the UK our winters are mainly cool and damp as opposed to very cold and dry.

If the climate is not very cold the bees are much more active and consume more honey.  A cool climate will also hit the dew point for longer periods of time.  You won't get much condensation in a stack of boxes without any bees in it.  Yes, climate makes a difference but the majority of the moisture is coming from the bees.
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Offline Acebird

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Re: How do honey bees survive without water?
« Reply #22 on: October 24, 2021, 08:59:06 am »
I use moisture quilts on my hives in the winter to keep water from dripping onto the cluster.
Understand that this could rob the bees of water they need.  It is better to direct the moisture down the walls.  If they don't need it it goes out the bottom.
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Offline Oldbeavo

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Re: How do honey bees survive without water?
« Reply #23 on: October 24, 2021, 05:52:48 pm »
Is the moisture/ condensation related to the population in the hive?
What is a full box of bees is a varied opinion.
If our hives are very full and packed down to no more space, then condensation is not an issue. We do use insulated lids which tends to help if the bee numbers are down a bit. Over half our hives winter as 8 frame, full depth singles packed down in late Autumn.

Offline The15thMember

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Re: How do honey bees survive without water?
« Reply #24 on: October 24, 2021, 06:06:04 pm »
Understand that this could rob the bees of water they need.  It is better to direct the moisture down the walls.  If they don't need it it goes out the bottom.
How do you be sure the water is going down the walls and not dripping on the bees?   
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Offline LawyerRick

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Re: How do honey bees survive without water?
« Reply #25 on: October 24, 2021, 06:54:10 pm »
I use poly hives all winter.  Here in SE Michigan, I don't use top entrances in my condensing hives, the bees get all the water from the sides of the supers.  I've actually pulled a colony apart in Mid February out of curiosity a while ago during a warm snap & saw water on the walls of the super but the cluster was dry as can be. I assumed that they were collecting water from the sides of the hive.  From what I can tell, when you put bees in an insulated hive for the winter & only use a bottom entrance, more heat is retained in the colony & the bees don't eat very much over winter.  With wooden hives, I had to put 2 medium supers full of honey in order for them to get thru the winter.  With poly hives, my colonies only consume about 30-40 lbs from October thru April.

Offline The15thMember

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Re: How do honey bees survive without water?
« Reply #26 on: October 24, 2021, 07:15:14 pm »
I use poly hives all winter.  Here in SE Michigan, I don't use top entrances in my condensing hives, the bees get all the water from the sides of the supers.  I've actually pulled a colony apart in Mid February out of curiosity a while ago during a warm snap & saw water on the walls of the super but the cluster was dry as can be. I assumed that they were collecting water from the sides of the hive.  From what I can tell, when you put bees in an insulated hive for the winter & only use a bottom entrance, more heat is retained in the colony & the bees don't eat very much over winter.  With wooden hives, I had to put 2 medium supers full of honey in order for them to get thru the winter.  With poly hives, my colonies only consume about 30-40 lbs from October thru April.
That's interesting, LawyerRick.  I've been toying around with trying out a poly hive or two.  In my moist climate, I'm already seeing signs of rot on my woodenware after only 4 years, and I'm wondering if the polystyrene would hold up better.   
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Offline NigelP

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Re: How do honey bees survive without water?
« Reply #27 on: October 25, 2021, 04:49:39 am »
That's all I use these days. Better heat retention, lower store usage and little condensation.  Also, in the UK, they are about 1/2 the price of their wooden counterparts.

Offline Acebird

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Re: How do honey bees survive without water?
« Reply #28 on: October 25, 2021, 08:24:05 am »
Understand that this could rob the bees of water they need.  It is better to direct the moisture down the walls.  If they don't need it it goes out the bottom.
How do you be sure the water is going down the walls and not dripping on the bees?   
Simple method is to tip the hive.  You could put a top screen on and make a sloped top but tipping the hive usually works.
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Offline LawyerRick

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Re: How do honey bees survive without water?
« Reply #29 on: October 25, 2021, 04:35:13 pm »
I use poly hives all winter.  Here in SE Michigan, I don't use top entrances in my condensing hives, the bees get all the water from the sides of the supers.  I've actually pulled a colony apart in Mid February out of curiosity a while ago during a warm snap & saw water on the walls of the super but the cluster was dry as can be. I assumed that they were collecting water from the sides of the hive.  From what I can tell, when you put bees in an insulated hive for the winter & only use a bottom entrance, more heat is retained in the colony & the bees don't eat very much over winter.  With wooden hives, I had to put 2 medium supers full of honey in order for them to get thru the winter.  With poly hives, my colonies only consume about 30-40 lbs from October thru April.
That's interesting, LawyerRick.  I've been toying around with trying out a poly hive or two.  In my moist climate, I'm already seeing signs of rot on my woodenware after only 4 years, and I'm wondering if the polystyrene would hold up better.   
Go for it.  I have used Apimaye, Technosetbee, Anel & Lyson poly hives.  Although the Apimaye is expensive, it's worth the money as it includes QE, feeders, frame spacers & pollen collector.  I overwinter in singles & deep/medium, depending on the size of the colony in August. I've overwintered Lyson 6 frame nucs with just 2 supers or 12 frames.  The Lyson doesn't hold up to punishment as well as the others but makes up for it with results.  I don't know why but every colony I put in the Lyson 6 frame nucs explodes with population.  They seem to really like a 6 over 6 configuration.  With my Technosetbee & Anel hives, they are less expensive initially but you have to use your own QEs, feeders etc.  I still have a lot of woodenware in the garage & still use woodenware for queen rearing etc during the season but they all go into poly for the winter, if I have enough poly hives in inventory.

Offline The15thMember

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Re: How do honey bees survive without water?
« Reply #30 on: October 25, 2021, 07:02:53 pm »
Go for it.  I have used Apimaye, Technosetbee, Anel & Lyson poly hives.  Although the Apimaye is expensive, it's worth the money as it includes QE, feeders, frame spacers & pollen collector.  I overwinter in singles & deep/medium, depending on the size of the colony in August. I've overwintered Lyson 6 frame nucs with just 2 supers or 12 frames.  The Lyson doesn't hold up to punishment as well as the others but makes up for it with results.  I don't know why but every colony I put in the Lyson 6 frame nucs explodes with population.  They seem to really like a 6 over 6 configuration.  With my Technosetbee & Anel hives, they are less expensive initially but you have to use your own QEs, feeders etc.  I still have a lot of woodenware in the garage & still use woodenware for queen rearing etc during the season but they all go into poly for the winter, if I have enough poly hives in inventory.
Thanks for the info!  I'll take a look at those brands. 
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Offline Oldbeavo

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Re: How do honey bees survive without water?
« Reply #31 on: October 26, 2021, 06:04:15 am »
We have run about 120 Paradise poly hives for 6-7 years. Bees do winter well in them and also the are very good in the heat.
Due to my poor compass ability we had 50 in full sun for about 3 months, 100+ degrees F.
I don't like the plastic QX supplied with them and use steel. In fact we use steel in all our hives.
PS at 60 mph poly or wooden end up in the same state when the fall off the trailer.
Only plus is if you can gather up the bits and solve the jigsaw, poly hives go back together better with PVA glue and 3 " screws.

Online Michael Bush

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Re: How do honey bees survive without water?
« Reply #32 on: October 27, 2021, 01:47:08 pm »
Bees don't survive without water.  But there are many places they can get water.  Dew.  Rain. Creeks.  Catchpools.  Condensation in the hive.  But if there isn't water available within about 1/4 mile they don't do very well.
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