Welcome, Guest

Author Topic: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS  (Read 2968 times)

Offline iddee

  • Universal Bee
  • *******
  • Posts: 10853
  • Gender: Male
"Listen to the mustn'ts, child. Listen to the don'ts. Listen to the shouldn'ts, the impossibles, the won'ts. Listen to the never haves, then listen close to me . . . Anything can happen, child. Anything can be"

*Shel Silverstein*

Offline Acebird

  • Galactic Bee
  • ******
  • Posts: 8112
  • Gender: Male
  • Just do it
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #1 on: June 20, 2019, 08:28:14 am »
Ha, socialism for beekeepers.  LOL
Brian Cardinal
Just do it

Offline CoolBees

  • Queen Bee
  • ****
  • Posts: 1397
  • Gender: Male
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #2 on: June 20, 2019, 12:22:03 pm »
Ha, socialism for beekeepers.  LOL

Haha! Now that's funny!

I wonder if the Virginia State Legislature has a line on quality "Treatment Free" bees - or, like most government agencies, are they going to buy (the crappiest bees) from the lowest bidder (the governors 2nd cousins failing apiary) and create $125k of new problems in the state ... hmmm. ... I wonder ...
You cannot permanently help men by doing for them, what they could and should do for themselves - Abraham Lincoln

Online Ben Framed

  • Global Moderator
  • Universal Bee
  • *******
  • Posts: 12643
  • Mississippi Zone 7
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2019, 12:42:47 pm »
Ha, socialism for beekeepers.  LOL

LOL Ace good one!
 That is interesting iddee
Farm subsidies on a small scale. 
 :cheesy:
2 Chronicles 7:14
14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

Offline van from Arkansas

  • Super Bee
  • *****
  • Posts: 1900
  • Gender: Male
  • Van from Arkansas.
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2019, 08:36:26 pm »
I think that is a wonderful idea, freebies.  I mean: the govt. supporting, recognizing the importance of honey bees.  Not saying a good investment politically, rather the subject which is the honey bee is brought to public attention.  Wish more states would follow this idea.
Van
I have been around bees a long time, since birth.  I am a hobbyist so my answers often reflect this fact.  I concentrate on genetics, raise my own queens by wet graft, nicot, with natural or II breeding.  I do not sell queens, I will give queens  for free but no shipping.

Offline BeeMaster2

  • Administrator
  • Universal Bee
  • *******
  • Posts: 13529
  • Gender: Male
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #5 on: June 20, 2019, 10:09:17 pm »
Van,
I disagree.  In order to give these bees away, they had to take the money from the taxpayers and they did that at the threat of a gun.
A lot of people that know nothing about bees and don?t care to take the time to learn will bee getting bees that will die and they will not bother to replace them. They had no investment or skin in the game. Money wasted.
Jim Altmiller
Democracy is 2 wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.
Ben Franklin

Offline ed/La.

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 262
  • Gender: Male
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #6 on: June 20, 2019, 10:35:10 pm »
It is only $125k.  That is a token amount of money for a state to encourage people to keep bees. Probably cheaper than running some educational TV commercials. What can they buy for $125k? Maybe a thousand nucs. Early nuc hopefully not after the main flow. Perhaps  they have a qualification test of some sort.

Offline CoolBees

  • Queen Bee
  • ****
  • Posts: 1397
  • Gender: Male
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #7 on: June 21, 2019, 12:52:40 am »
I think Jim's right on this. Where are the bees from? Who will get the bees? ... probably people who "want to save the bees" - but know nothing about caring for them - and this will create $125k worth of newly sick and diseased, un-cared for, bees. A complete disaster in the making, spreading disease and problems to the surrounding areas, killing more hives both feral and kept - all paid for by the taxpayer. Chant with me now - "Yeah! Go Government!"

... hollywood could never make up the level of stupidity that exists in government.

1 man's opinion here.
You cannot permanently help men by doing for them, what they could and should do for themselves - Abraham Lincoln

Offline Acebird

  • Galactic Bee
  • ******
  • Posts: 8112
  • Gender: Male
  • Just do it
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #8 on: June 21, 2019, 08:41:41 am »

 Money wasted.
Jim Altmiller

Not entirely Jim, that is not the end game.  By giving away bees and equipment some bees will swarm and survive.  For the people who don't make it as a beekeeper their equipment will be sold to other beekeepers that do succeed.  It will raise the numbers in VA.  It is not a good idea for states that don't have declining numbers.
Brian Cardinal
Just do it

Offline Acebird

  • Galactic Bee
  • ******
  • Posts: 8112
  • Gender: Male
  • Just do it
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #9 on: June 21, 2019, 08:43:46 am »
I think Jim's right on this. Where are the bees from? Who will get the bees? ... probably people who "want to save the bees" - but know nothing about caring for them - and this will create $125k worth of newly sick and diseased, un-cared for, bees. A complete disaster in the making, spreading disease and problems to the surrounding areas, killing more hives both feral and kept - all paid for by the taxpayer.

Let's hear it Iddee, "the sky is falling"
Brian Cardinal
Just do it

Online Ben Framed

  • Global Moderator
  • Universal Bee
  • *******
  • Posts: 12643
  • Mississippi Zone 7
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #10 on: June 21, 2019, 09:45:26 am »
  When I was a boy, The Memphis Beekeepers Association had a write up in the Memphis Commercial Appeal sponsoring a beekeeper interest meeting open to the public. This event was not sponsored by the government, was not placed in the paper as a bought advertising spot, but instead was the result of a well written article by a real journalist. The guest speaker was Tim Durham, now on YouTube, known as the Walls bee man. Keep in mind this was before YouTube, Facebook, and all the other online social media platforms. I was just a young boy but tagged along with my uncle to this event. Mr Durham made an excellent and interesting presentation. There were tables set up with various types of bee equipment for sale. Along with books, leaflets, and all types of information concerning bees.  No bee equipment was given away, The attendees were there of their own choosing and curiosity of honey bees 🐝 .  The government had no involvement in this meeting or its sponsorship. No government insensitive what so ever. The meeting was a tremendous success. The place was packed. My uncle and his co-worker were two people that I know who became beekeepers as a result. Now, many years later, I have become a beekeeper because of that meeting, and no telling how many others. This cost the taxpayer a total of zero dollars and zero cents.
  There are some good views and points posted here on both points of view about this giveaway that I can understand and appreciate. But is my opinion, the private sector can always do a better job at most anything than the government can do. Now, do we want to make this a coffeehouse issue as it may be turning into one. I do not think that was or is iddees intention? Did Virginians know that their state was giving away bees? The correctness or wrongness of this would be a good discussion in the coffeehouse😊?
Phillip
« Last Edit: June 22, 2019, 12:02:15 am by Ben Framed »
2 Chronicles 7:14
14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

Offline incognito

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 321
  • Gender: Male
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #11 on: June 21, 2019, 11:18:44 am »
The government is giving away top bar hives and Langstroth hives consisting of two deeps with frames, a cover and a bottom board - no bees, no honey supers, no other equipment.

http://www.vdacs.virginia.gov/pdf/beehive_distribution_program.pdf
I believe in small government so I have mixed feelings about this program. The recipients of the furniture will be making substantial investments in other equipment themselves so they will have skin in the game. That is not a bad way to run any government program.

It also seems like a way for the government to get beekeepers registered so that the beekeepers can be better monitored and regulated. see Chapter 44 of the Code of Virginia. https://law.lis.virginia.gov/vacode/title3.2/chapter44/





? 3.2-4416. Beehive distribution program.
Any individual registered with the Department as a beekeeper may apply to the Department for no more than three basic beehive units per year. The Department shall establish guidelines setting forth the components of a basic beehive unit and the general requirements for qualifying for such unit. Applications for beehive units shall be processed in the order in which completed eligible applications are received. In the event that funds are not available in the Beehive Grant Fund established pursuant to ? 3.2-4415 (the Fund), the Department may cease accepting applications and notify applicants that the funds available for that fiscal year have been exhausted. The Department shall not be required to carry forward pending applications to the next fiscal year in which funds are available in the Fund.The Department may use funds from the Fund to pay for the costs of purchasing, building, or distributing the beehive units and for the costs of administering the beehive distribution program. The Department may work cooperatively with the Virginia Cooperative Extension Service and Agricultural Experiment Station Division, established pursuant to Article 2 (? 23.1-2608 et seq.) of Chapter 26 of Title 23.1, to carry out the provisions of this section.
Tom

Offline iddee

  • Universal Bee
  • *******
  • Posts: 10853
  • Gender: Male
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #12 on: June 21, 2019, 02:39:33 pm »
""Let's hear it Iddee, "the sky is falling""

Sorry, Ace, I don't give opinions on things I have no details of.

Are they requiring a completed beginner's course? Are they requiring a location inspection?

Do they demand a membership and attendance in a local beekeeping club?

It is something that could work well if administered well, which government isn't very well known for.
"Listen to the mustn'ts, child. Listen to the don'ts. Listen to the shouldn'ts, the impossibles, the won'ts. Listen to the never haves, then listen close to me . . . Anything can happen, child. Anything can be"

*Shel Silverstein*

Offline incognito

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 321
  • Gender: Male
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #13 on: June 21, 2019, 03:01:08 pm »
 http://www.vdacs.virginia.gov/pdf/beehive_distribution_program.pdf




Beehive units must be used to establish a new beehive with a viable colony of honey bees within one year of the date the items are received by an individual.
 
INSPECTION
The Department reserves the right to inquire into the legitimacy of any application, as well as the right to inspect any bee colony established in a distributed beehive unit. A colony shall consist of a laying queen, brood, and at least 10 frames of adult bees. The hive must contain honey and pollen in amounts sufficient to sustain the colony into the following year.
 
STATE AND LOCAL REQUIREMENTS RELATED TO BEEKEEPING ACTIVITY
Applicants must comply with all state and local requirements related to beehive management and other beekeeping activity.  A copy of the Virginia Bee Law (Va Code ? 3.2-44400 et seq.) may be found athttps://law.lis.virginia.gov/vacode/title3.2/chapter44/. Applicants should contact the locality or localities in which the beehive(s) will be located to ensure compliance with all applicable ordinances.
 
Tom

Offline beesnweeds

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 243
  • Gender: Male
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #14 on: June 21, 2019, 05:27:18 pm »
The money would be far better spent by holding field days and seminars on hive management and identifying pests/diseases.  Buying packages doesn't save bees or encourage successful beekeeping, education does.  Its wasted taxpayer money on doomed bees.
Everyone loves a worker.... until its laying.

Offline Acebird

  • Galactic Bee
  • ******
  • Posts: 8112
  • Gender: Male
  • Just do it
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #15 on: June 22, 2019, 07:58:04 am »

It is something that could work well if administered well, which government isn't very well known for.
Define "government".  A beekeeping club runs like a government.  They take your money and spend it as they please with all the politics of the US congress.
Brian Cardinal
Just do it

Offline Kathyp

  • Global Moderator
  • Universal Bee
  • *******
  • Posts: 20449
  • Gender: Female
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #16 on: June 22, 2019, 12:25:48 pm »
Quote
A beekeeping club runs like a government.  They take your money and spend it as they please with all the politics of the US congress.

But you have the choice to give them money or not.  Let me know when the government gives me a choice on paying taxes and what they do with them. 
Someone really ought to tell them that the world of Ayn Rand?s novel was not meant to be aspirational.

Offline BeeMaster2

  • Administrator
  • Universal Bee
  • *******
  • Posts: 13529
  • Gender: Male
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #17 on: June 22, 2019, 12:32:57 pm »

It is something that could work well if administered well, which government isn't very well known for.
Define "government".  A beekeeping club runs like a government.  They take your money and spend it as they please with all the politics of the US congress.

Ace,
That?s for sure. I have seen it and it can bee just as corrupt.
Jim Altmiller
Democracy is 2 wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.
Ben Franklin

Offline iddee

  • Universal Bee
  • *******
  • Posts: 10853
  • Gender: Male
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #18 on: June 22, 2019, 01:11:34 pm »
Jim and Ace, have you both gone off the deep end? Tell me when you tell the gov. you quit and won't be renewing your membership and won't be paying in anymore. I want to see what happens then.
"Listen to the mustn'ts, child. Listen to the don'ts. Listen to the shouldn'ts, the impossibles, the won'ts. Listen to the never haves, then listen close to me . . . Anything can happen, child. Anything can be"

*Shel Silverstein*

Offline CoolBees

  • Queen Bee
  • ****
  • Posts: 1397
  • Gender: Male
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #19 on: June 22, 2019, 03:31:20 pm »

Define "government".  A beekeeping club runs like a government.  They take your money and spend it as they please with all the politics of the US congress.

Really Ace - I can quit my local bee club. I can get some members together and vote myself into control of my local bee club  (in many cases). I can start my own bee club, make it better than theirs and squeeze them out of business. Also ...

... I can meet the people running my local bee club - decide I don't care much for them - and NOT join and NOT pay them anything (which is what I actually did).

And no police show up at my door with guns telling me I've violated some law, and haul my sorry [tail-bone] off to never-land.

Its called Free Choice in a Free Market.

Politics in a local club? ... of course. - but there's a big difference between a Bee club and the goobernment.
You cannot permanently help men by doing for them, what they could and should do for themselves - Abraham Lincoln

Offline van from Arkansas

  • Super Bee
  • *****
  • Posts: 1900
  • Gender: Male
  • Van from Arkansas.
Re: ATTENTION VIRGINIANS
« Reply #20 on: June 22, 2019, 07:40:24 pm »
Van,
I disagree.  In order to give these bees away, they had to take the money from the taxpayers and they did that at the threat of a gun.
A lot of people that know nothing about bees and don?t care to take the time to learn will bee getting bees that will die and they will not bother to replace them. They had no investment or skin in the game. Money wasted.
Jim Altmiller[/color]

Van: Not saying a good investment politically...  my quote,
I have been around bees a long time, since birth.  I am a hobbyist so my answers often reflect this fact.  I concentrate on genetics, raise my own queens by wet graft, nicot, with natural or II breeding.  I do not sell queens, I will give queens  for free but no shipping.

 

anything