Spring time plan (splitting)

[omnimirage]

Last spring, it was difficult to manage some of my hives and a number of them ended up swarming. I ignorantly thought that I could just show up a week before spring, and do a simple honey extraction, give them room to expand and they won't want to swarm. From what I've gathered, they decide whether they want to swarm before such a time, and when they've decided that's what they want to do, then they are very persistent to work towards such an end and the only real reliable way to stop such is to split them.

If I didn't want to split a hive for whatever reason, what should I be doing, prior to spring, to encourage them to stay? Should I just be making sure the queen has space to lay eggs as I'm coming out of winter, maybe I should be checking up on them one month before winter leaves? I should mention that, in my part of Australia, only on the coldest of winter nights does it get below the freezing point and even that is rare. I suspect that for the most of winter the bees are to some extent out foraging.

I am interested in splitting some hives. Most of my hives come from feral Australian bee swarms. My research suggests that, these bees are predominately The European dark bee (Apis mellifera mellifera). I found this interesting chart comparing the different honeybee subspecies, and it seems to have a credible source:

https://content.ces.ncsu.edu/the-different-types-of-honey-bees

It seems that, for me having Ligurian bees rather than German bees (another word for European dark bee and apis mellifera mellifera) would be better, as they produce higher amounts of honey, have a stronger spring build up (spring time is lucrative in honey flow in Australia) and heavy robbing doesn't matter so much. Ligurians also have the disadvantage of eating too much, and creating too much brood (which is particularly bothersome in countries where it snows during winter), again not too relevant or bad.

I have to decide where to get queens from, if I wish to split hives. I can create queens from my best producing hives, but I'm left to wonder if I used a different subspecies, whether I'd get a better quality honeybee. There's this list I've found of queen bee breeders in Australia:

http://www.aussieapiaristsonline.net/queen-bees-for-sale.html

There's quite a number of them. I'm not sure if I should just stick with the Ligurians. The other species don't seem as good, but some of the research I read suggested that the hybrids can offer unique advantages, Ligurian and Carniolan hybrids seem to possess such. I figure if I did invest in queens, that I'd just buy one or two from a breeder, and then give them a trial run, see how they compete with the other imported genetics, and possibly in a later year I could graft or split from the best stock and select which bees work best for me.

Or maybe it'd be best to just split from my strongest hive. I found this quote from Michael Bush, as a good means of splitting beehives:

"Honestly, here's what I would do.  First, one hive isn't likely to make 21 splits, but if you have several hives you can take the queen, two frames of rbrood and two frames of honey and put them in an eight frame box (or ten frame box) with whatever you have, drawn comb is nice, foundation is ok, foundationless is ok if you have comb guides.  Then in nine days make several more of these splits from your other strong hives, and maybe one or two more from that hive each with a frame that has a queen cell, a frame that does not (if there are any) and a couple of frames of honey).  Now you've only made ONE hive queenless to get several queens instead of several hives queenless to get that same number..."

Since spring time is a strong heavy flow for me, I am concerned about weakening my strongest hives during a lucrative time. Doing it this way will result in just one weak hive.

When would be the best time to split the hives? I'd imagine a week or so prior to before the spring warmth comes on?

[beepro]

Usually you would make a split just before the end of the Spring flow.  This way your lucrative time will not be interrupted.  It doesn't matter what bee specie you use as long as they are adaptable to your local environment and make decent honey for you.  Over here the old timer will make new queens and splits before the main flow.  This way they will have a new queen heading the production hive.  I find it works both ways.  I can either make a split before or after the Spring flow.  Frankly, I like keep some hives for splits and some for honey production.  Requeen all your production hives yearly.  Let's see if this will help with the swarming issue.  Some bee species are likely to swarm than others so choose your breeders wisely no matter who you get them from.  Evaluate their potential before devoting many hives to either one. Hopefully you will find what you're looking for!

[cao]

When would be the best time to split the hives? I'd imagine a week or so prior to before the spring warmth comes on?

The earliest I can think of splitting is when I see capped drones or newly hatched drones.  Which I suspect will be within a few weeks around here.  Do your hives kick the drones out during winter or is the weather mild enough so the bees keep drones all year? 
I usually make splits similar to what you have mentioned.  I find the queen in the hive that I want to split.  Put her in a nuc with a few frames containing brood and honey.  Check that hive the next week for queen cells.  Make up nucs with each frame that contains at least one capped queen cell.  Leaving at least one for the original hive.  I have turned one hive into ten nucs with eight of them having laying queens after their mating flights. 

I have found that this is an easy method to increase your hive count and it only takes the honey production away from one hive.  I usually leave several hives alone for honey production(except for adding boxes and/or frames for extra space). 

If you can keep the brood nest open, it will help keep the bees from swarming most of the time.  Either inserting an empty frame or two in the middle of the brood nest or putting an empty box under the box that has the honey band in it(if running multiple brood boxes) gives the queen plenty of space to lay.

[eltalia]

"the only real reliable way to stop such is to split them."

Nope.
Full expansion of the brood nest (core) through your frame manipulations
and application of the QX to maintain honey stores integrity is the "reliable way".
The outcome being the colony is kept on the verge of a nexus of swarming and
buildup. This method returns the most productive honey 'crop' and keeps CM
stable in the runup to Summer with it's comparative dearths.
How?
The method is covered in journals and some published works, a variation of it
was covered in this forum just some months ago. I lack the search skills to
pinpoint the thread.

We (yourself and I) have discussed aspects of the EHB subspecies you run.
and from recall you were told these are swarmy lil buggers, so to the above I
would add a queen restrictor to the entrance for the whole of Spring, regardless.

Also... FWIW
As much as I respect the work Mr. Bush puts into the EHB community I tell you it
could not be more hazardous for your operation in following his teachings were
you to do nothing at all. Your ethos and his are poles apart in intention and desired
outcomes.
You should factor that fact in when reading his work, much of which is
adaptable in application to anyone's operation in many a set circumstance
*provided* you are listening to the bees, not simply your ticking off  paragraphs as
"done that".

Bill
.

[Oldbeavo]

When to split?
From Michael Bush, to control swarming you need to split before the bees think about swarming.
If you are splitting when they have built Q.cells you are too late.
We split late one year and the bees swarmed anyway after taking brood and bees, leaving us with weak hives going into the main flow of spring.
If you split early to reduce hive population be aware that you may need to do it again if the hives are on very good conditions.
Last year we split early only to have hives swarm in late spring.
If you are  going to select cells or queens from your own stock you need to mark your queens, if you have a good hive that has a second year Q that didn't swarm last spring, then by using her progeny you are making a selection to reduce swarming tendency.

[omnimirage]

Some great information thanks guys.

beepro:

If I split them at the end of Spring flow, then I'm concerned about my bees swarming at the beginning of Spring. Though eltalia and cao has suggested that if I simply manipulate the frames and give the queen plenty of space to lay then she shouldn't swarm anyway.

cao:

I don't believe they kick out the drones here.

eltalia:

I don't entirely follow sorry. Are you saying it'd be more hazardous to follow his teachings? His teachings has been one of my biggest influences in how I think and manage my bees.

oldbeavo:

Good idea on marking their swarming tendency and then splitting from there. I need to document more so. We live in a similar climate so I'm most curious; when in the year did you split and it was too late? When did you split and it was too early?

[beepro]

Since I don't know your bee environment, maybe I can give you a sense of how I do it.  Our 4 seasons pretty much follow the monthly cycles.  For example, Spring is from March on usually.  Then Autumn begins in October usually.  Following this cycle the bees know what to do when it is time.   Now let's say that our first honey harvest in in mid-June before the summer begin, then I can follow the split cycle.  Making the new queens before July.

From July on until the Spring of the following season, the queen is still consider a 6-7 months young queen.  This is what I want you to see.  These overwintered queens can head the production hives in the Spring time without swarming that much since they're still the 1st year queens.  You got this process down?  When there is no bee program for you to manage your hives you have to make up your own according to your bee environment.

So after the flow it is the summer time.  Last year I rear queens into mid-October because it was warmer than usual.  So from Oct. on these queens are still very young until Spring time again April.   Then the Spring hive management is in place to try to curb the swarming.  I have lots of drawn comb ready for this process.  I use a newly mated Spring queen (from Jan.) to head the production hive while consolidating the other hives' brood frames into her colony.  My bee program is pretty solid by following the 4 seasons here. The other hives are still growing while harvesting Spring honey for me.   Supers UP! 

[Acebird]

cao:

I don't believe they kick out the drones here.

You know better than I but it is likely happening if you have an extended dearth along with not raising any more.