My never wet beetle barrier trial

[derekNGA]

Last year a guy posted about using never wet product on aluminum strips that beetles can not navigate on, thus keeping them out of the hive.  The concept intetested me,  having tons of beetles and not wanting to go oil pan method, I tried the never wet strips.  Installed last fall/end of summer best I remember.  Upon examining my hives this spring I found same amount of beetles.  Upon examining the strips I found the bees had chewed the never wet coating off the aluminum strips as well as placing propolis over the strips.  This was done in all 6 of my hives. 

[Van, Arkansas, USA]

Good to know, thanks for sharing.  BTW I use freeze spray for the beetles.
Blessings

[eltalia]

Yeh Derek, thanks for that comprehensive update.
I took a shine to the concept thinking it an innovative
solution, your info tells me the strip design requires
a revist. IF I can get hold of the guy again I will pass
on your findings. Cheers :)

Bill

[BeeMaster2]

Derrik,
The  Never Wet strips should be in the oil tray below the screen bottom board. This keeps the beetles in the oil tray and out of the hive. The bees should not bee able to mess with the strips.
Jim

[eltalia]

Derrik,
The  Never Wet strips should be in the oil tray below the screen bottom board. This keeps the beetles
 in the oil tray and out of the hive. The bees should not bee able to mess with the strips.
Jim

Now that *is* news to me Jim. The demo I saw the guy do, and later discussed
"en groupe", used a solid bottomboard. I was not aware of this change to SBB
nor Derek testing NWS so.. thanks :)

Bill

--
(edited)
..hadta put the terminolgy right. Noob error...grrrrr :-D

[derekNGA]

Hmmm, I comprehend what your saying Mr. Jim.  Seems like a good idea to do.  But no, I did not use in conjunction with an oil tray.  The poster/inventor last year and the many videos YouTube describing, showing the function and operation only showed tacking to bottom board or bottom hive box.  I chose to use a top inner cover frame only to attach my strips then placing it between my bottom board and hive box.

[Acebird]

the many videos YouTube describing, showing the function and operation only showed tacking to bottom board or bottom hive box.

And no screen on top of the box?  People make this same mistake with varroa when using SBB.  It does no good if the bees can get below the screen and into the tray catching the varroa.  They just jump back on the bees.

[eltalia]

Hmmm, I comprehend what your saying Mr. Jim.  Seems like a good idea to do.  But no, I did
not use in conjunction with an oil tray.  The poster/inventor last year and the many videos
YouTube describing, showing the function and operation only showed tacking to bottom
board or bottom hive box.  I chose to use a top inner cover frame only to attach my strips
then placing it between my bottom board and hive box.

Thinking out loud here Derek, maybe there is a clue there in changng the
depth between BB and lower bar (frames)... the bees saw the strips as
a foreign body, cleaned them and buried them???
Any sort of timeframe you might know the rejection/destruction occured
in?

Bill

[derekNGA]

Mr. Bill,
Ah, I see what you mean by making a larger gap.  Whatever the reason, my bees did not like it at all.  As far as time frame before they chewed off and covered....I cant really say for positive, but Id guess pretty quick.  After installing for about a week I would see "distraught" beetles along the entrace trying to figure out how to get in.  On a few occassions I would shine a flashlight in and take a peep and see beetles huddled up in corners under the strips.  That was satisfaction knowing  they were prevented from going up.  I sorta didnt keep peeping for long but before winter I did not notice "distraught" beetles and was seeing more than expected in the hive.  I peeped in the bottom again and did see propolis covering the strips on a couple hives, but not all of them.  I did not notice they had actually chewed the never wet off until recently totally removing them from the hives and able to fully inspect, and which all 6 had been chewed and propolis over.  So, I believed the bees began pretty much soon after installing. 

[eltalia]

Mr. Bill,
(edit)
  So, I believed the bees began pretty much soon after installing.

eetz just plain "Bill" Derek, I used to labour for a living so no
"airs an' graces" held here, in fact you could call me anything but
late for dinner, or "Sue"... to steal Johnny Cash's famous lyric :-)))

All good info you posted, I'll keep this result well in mind. Thanks.

Bill

[Bamboo]

Dang! Sounded like a good solution to SHB, found a few the other day and thought this could be good solution. So in your considered opinions what is the next best method of controlling/getting rid of the little so and so's?

[eltalia]

Dang! Sounded like a good solution to SHB, found a few the other day and thought
this could be good solution. So in your considered opinions what is the next best
method of controlling/getting rid of the little so and so's?

I wouldn't be so quick to write it off totally as the install
was not as per the instruction, not that I see how
Derek did it as really changing anything.

Unfortunately it is something I cannot test myself as
no SHB in my yard or the outyards. Those I talked it
over with are set in using pads, with not much care
for the bees they trap. The day they go queenless
followed by laying worker their collective brains might
figure it out and try it.

Bill

[Bamboo]

Well I reckon I will do a test and see what happens. Don't like the idea of trapping bees with pads, too much risk of losing queen.

[BeeMaster2]

During BeeFest, Dave, the president of the Clay County Bee Club mentioned that he is using a new SHB Grease to get rid of all SHBs in their hives. You mix it up and smear it acros the top of one of the top frames. He says in 3 weeks you will not have a single hive beetle in your hive.
Here is a photo of the formula:
(That did not work, is says JPEG is the wrong typ of file) I will talk to Robo today and see what I need to do.
I have not tried it yet but I will Bee.

Jim

[Florida Bee Rancher]

Hello Everybody,

  I am the person who invented the Beetle Barrier coated with Neverwet and there are somethings that I discovered in my 60 hives that surprised me. Three years ago the coated barriers were installed in my hives and sealed, the very few SHB that I saw in some hives was because the bees chewed a hole in the polyethylene foam seal on the inner screened top cover giving SHB access into the hive. Usually the only SHB I would see were crawling around on the window screen of the inner cover trying to get in. What I discovered was that the Neverwet in the spray can kits was being chewed off the aluminum strips by the bees and letting some SHB crawl over the barrier and into the hives. I called Rustoluem and they stated that the "Industrial Neverwet" in the gallon cans was 20 times stronger than the spray can kits (I wish I knew that in the beginning), so now I am in the process of retro-fitting my hives with a new barrier design we'll call it the "2.0 Beetle Barrier". I will do one last You-Tube video on this to show you the ideas I have come up with to improve on the original beetle barrier idea. As some of you know, once the barriers are installed and the hives are sealed this system works 99.9% to keep the SHB out of the hives.   

Florida Bee Rancher

[eltalia]

Hello Everybody,
 I am the person who invented the Beetle Barrier coated with Neverwet and there
are somethings that I discovered in my 60 hives that surprised me.
(edit)
What I discovered was that the Neverwet in the spray can kits was being chewed
off the aluminum strips by the bees and letting some SHB crawl over the barrier
and into the hives. I called Rustoluem and they stated that the "Industrial Neverwet"
in the gallon cans was 20 times stronger than the spray can kits (I wish I knew that
in the beginning), so now I am in the process of retro-fitting my hives with a new
barrier design we'll call it the "2.0 Beetle Barrier".
(edit)
Florida Bee Rancher

G'day, and thanks for dropping by, welcome :-)

Right... so, now what do you believe "20 times stronger" actually
means as a message?
"whoops fella, but here try this one" ??
"nah buddy, that aerosol version is for the mug punters, here
is the product our name is built on" ??

Did you ask what the actual difference was?
Like is the industrial product thicker and so takes longer to chew off
or is the compound in it at a scale of 'toxicity' where bees may find it
most unpalatable and leave it alone, not chew it.

Six years is a good chunk of realtime to be running a trial, three gone
and "fail" the outcome I reckon the next three I would spend on just a
few colonies, and in a very controlled documented way. Like if the
entrance zone gets to 38+C where the product might "gas off" killing
bees you need to know that on one colony, not 60.

Bill

[eltalia]

During BeeFest, Dave, the president of the Clay County Bee Club mentioned that he is using a new
SHB Grease to get rid of all SHBs in their hives. You mix it up and smear it acros the top of one of
the top frames. He says in 3 weeks you will not have a single hive beetle in your hive.
Here is a photo of the formula:
(That did not work, is says JPEG is the wrong typ of file) I will talk to Robo today and see what I
need to do.
I have not tried it yet but I will Bee.

Jim

I found this also Jim, and my device will not allow changing the extension
to *.jpg - the 'normal' format. In the end I got a pix resizing app to work it
up, it uses *.png, I think. Robo would  know.

Bill

[Bamboo]

During BeeFest, Dave, the president of the Clay County Bee Club mentioned that he is using a new
SHB Grease to get rid of all SHBs in their hives. You mix it up and smear it acros the top of one of
the top frames. He says in 3 weeks you will not have a single hive beetle in your hive.
Here is a photo of the formula:
(That did not work, is says JPEG is the wrong typ of file) I will talk to Robo today and see what I
need to do.
I have not tried it yet but I will Bee.

Jim

I found this also Jim, and my device will not allow changing the extension
to *.jpg - the 'normal' format. In the end I got a pix resizing app to work it
up, it uses *.png, I think. Robo would  know.

Bill

I have converted to jpeg. Bill can you tell how to insert as a pic here. I click on pic icon but can't seem to insert?? Help??

[Bamboo]

Maybe this works.

[eltalia]

Maybe this works.

ahhh, a "Yogi Moment", like "yer smarter than the average bear" 

Bill

[Bamboo]

  Figured if I thought about it long enough I could work it out. I mean how hard can it be to insert a pic? A 12 year old could do it with their eyes shut right? 

[eltalia]

Figured if I thought about it long enough I could work it out. I mean how
hard can it be to insert a pic? A 12 year old could do it with their eyes shut right? 

... with the forum interface used, on this device (Android platform)??
Like I accept losing 5 years for every extra year over 60 I get to suck
oxygen in - waste of good 02, some comment - but when I was just a
vibrant 28yr old when I hit 60 I am fast approaching Ghost status!!

When I first signed on to BMA I thought it was just me. I soon read
of many others in the same boat. No matter, it is more efficient all
round to do links offsite anyway :-)

Bill

[Bamboo]

Can anyone tell me what the equivalent of Crisco is in Australia. I know it is a vegetable fat or shortening but unsure as to what the consistency is.  It looks to be the main ingredient or at least the "body" of the recipe. Any ideas as to what I could use as a substitute? Thanks in advance.

[Beeboy01]

Crisco is a hydrogenated vegetable oil a lot like lard but vegetable based.

[texanbelchers]

I may be remembering poorly,  but i saw a video on using that (or similar)  grease and they were applying it constantly.   Like it killed some,  but not completely.  It may be just allowing for migration.

On a related note,  I moved my hives to a new apiary on February 1.   They are in  the middle of a field with no shade within 40 feet.  Compare that to my previous locations with nearly constant shade.  The number and activity of the SHB is drastically reduced and I haven't needed to put oil trays on yet.  They seem to have less stress and are growing well with no disease signs; so much better than last year.

[BeeMaster2]

Small Hive Beetle Grease
Here is a formula for making Small hive Beetle Grease. I typed it in so that it is easier to copy and use. I have not used it yet but I will be trying it out soon. I was told to mix the Ingredients in a bowl and then make 1/2? round strips and place one them on top of a frame. I?m not sure of the size/amount so if someone from Beefest 2018 remembers, please correct me. I guess the best thing to do is to divide the resulting mixture up into 22 sections and put one in each hive.
I was told by 3 beekeepers from the Clay County Club that in three weeks you will not see any beetles in your hive.
It sounds like it is worth trying.
Full Batch (90 hives)   1/2 Batch (45 Hives)   1/4 Batch (22 hives)
4 lbs sugar   2 lbs sugar   1 lbs sugar
1.5 lbs Crisco   12 oz Crisco   6 oz Crisco
1 lb honey   8 oz honey   4 oz honey
2 1/2 oz Wintergreen Oil   1 1/4 oz Wintergreen Oil   .625 oz Wintergreen Oil
Jim

[eltalia]

Can anyone tell me what the equivalent of Crisco is in Australia. I know it is a vegetable fat or shortening but unsure as to what the consistency is.  It looks to be the main ingredient or at least the "body" of the recipe. Any ideas as to what I could use as a substitute? Thanks in advance.

Dunno meself Paul, an' no matter how much Shiraz  I plied
ol' Pauline with she never gave up the secret between the
sheets, like.
I reckon it's this stuff, in pails here at wholesale outlets.
The link does not mention brandnames for canola but safe bet
it is the prime base used.

http://fishandchipsawards.com.au/Information/Oils-aint-Oils

Bill

[Bamboo]

Thanks Bill
Done a bit of research and as far as I can ascertain the closest thing we have here is a product called Copha. It is solidish like Crisco so will make a reasonable medium for the grease part of the equation.
Will mix some up and give it a go!
Cheers
Mark

[Robo]

(That did not work, is says JPEG is the wrong typ of file) I will talk to Robo today and see what I need to do.

Jim

JPEG should also be acceptable now.

[Acebird]

Small Hive Beetle Grease

Jim I only saw one beetle in all your hives.  When do they become a problem?

[BeeMaster2]

Brian,
In Jacksonville, all the time. They were in full shade and I have lots of hives all around me there.
Hopefully I will not have as bad of a problem here at the farm. The problem is that my bees will start to starve by the end of June so I will have to move them back to Jacksonville by then. Luckily I have a friend who has a 22 acre lot that has authorized me to keep them there.
Jim

[Ben Framed]

Hello Everybody,

  I am the person who invented the Beetle Barrier coated with Neverwet and there are somethings that I discovered in my 60 hives that surprised me. Three years ago the coated barriers were installed in my hives and sealed, the very few SHB that I saw in some hives was because the bees chewed a hole in the polyethylene foam seal on the inner screened top cover giving SHB access into the hive. Usually the only SHB I would see were crawling around on the window screen of the inner cover trying to get in. What I discovered was that the Neverwet in the spray can kits was being chewed off the aluminum strips by the bees and letting some SHB crawl over the barrier and into the hives. I called Rustoluem and they stated that the "Industrial Neverwet" in the gallon cans was 20 times stronger than the spray can kits (I wish I knew that in the beginning), so now I am in the process of retro-fitting my hives with a new barrier design we'll call it the "2.0 Beetle Barrier". I will do one last You-Tube video on this to show you the ideas I have come up with to improve on the original beetle barrier idea. As some of you know, once the barriers are installed and the hives are sealed this system works 99.9% to keep the SHB out of the hives.   

Florida Bee Rancher

Hello Florida bee rancher. I just want to say to you, that I also watched your video with the never wet treated Alunium strips. Although some could be discouraged by some comments made here, I would like to encourage you to Press on with your idea. The company that makes this product  surely knows it's ingredients and what its limitations are along with what your expectations are as I am sure you made this clear to them upon communication. There is no doubt that you were on to something good. Even if the non spray product doesn't work, (and it might),  at least you did your best to help every beekeeper who experiences problems with small have beetle and this is to be commended. At least from a humble point of view. And I am  confident that I am not the only one who looks at it in this way! Good luck and God bless!  Sincerely Phillip Hall

[Ben Framed]

During BeeFest, Dave, the president of the Clay County Bee Club mentioned that he is using a new SHB Grease to get rid of all SHBs in their hives. You mix it up and smear it acros the top of one of the top frames. He says in 3 weeks you will not have a single hive beetle in your hive.
Here is a photo of the formula:
(That did not work, is says JPEG is the wrong typ of file) I will talk to Robo today and see what I need to do.
I have not tried it yet but I will Bee.

Jim

Jim this does sound promising. I am interested and would like to ask you if Dave mentioned how thick to apply the to apply this grease, or how long it will last, or how it is accepted by the bees and there reaction to it? Will it get hot and run down onto the wax ares of the frames?  Will  you be kind enough to give your personal experiences once you have tried this on your hives?  Is Dave a member of your forum? Or any others that was telling you about this new formula a member of your forum?  It would be nice to hear from them also.   Thanks, Phillip Hall
 

[eltalia]

I am  confident that I am not the only one
who looks at it in this way! Good luck and God bless!  Sincerely Phillip Hall

I do... so that is one confirmed.
Thing is it took 3 years to get a picture to announce the fail?
Any idea of how much Ewetube revenue that raises in Clicks?
And now we are told there is some vague reference to 20%
stronger or whatever... thinking cap on, I reckon.

Bill

[Ben Framed]

[quote author=Ben Framed  Hello Florida bee rancher. I just want to say to you, that I also watched your video with the never wet treated Alunium strips. Although some could be discouraged by some comments made here, I would like to encourage you to Press on with your idea. The company that makes this product  surely knows it's ingredients and what its limitations are along with what your expectations are as I am sure you made this clear to them upon communication. There is no doubt that you were on to something good. Even if the non spray product doesn't work, (and it might),  at least you did your best to help every beekeeper who experiences problems with small have beetle and this is to be commended. At least from a humble point of view. And I am  confident that I am not the only one who looks at it in this way! Good luck and God bless!  Sincerely Phillip Hall

I do... so that is one confirmed.
Thing is it took 3 years to get a picture to announce the fail?
Any idea of how much Ewetube revenue that raises in Clicks?
And now we are told there is some vague reference to 20%
stronger or whatever... thinking cap on, I reckon.

Bill

Thanks for your reply Bill. Thinking caps are always a good thing to have on. 😊 There are up sides and down sides to every equation, in this case (experiment). You and I are in agreement that we hope this does work out in the long run. True , it would be nice if it had worked out the first time three years ago. And true this fellow, Florida bee rancher is willing to share his findings. There is always going to be different  perspectives and outlooks on any given subject. That's why I don't discount his experiment. Especially with all the effort, time, and what expense he has gone through and will go through to see this experiment done. And at the same time, I respect  your opinion as much as anyone else's on this matter. I would think the more interest, and the more  outlooks for different beekeepers, can only be good for the betterment of all beekeepers. That is why I am encouraging Florida bee rancher  to continue his experiments until he is confident, one way or another, that his idea and experiments are a successful or not. And at the same time , when he reaches a decision, he will he happy to share this conclusions with us. I don't know Florida bee rancher any more than I know you. I have no irons in the fire here except the idea that controlling the pesky small hive beetle would be good for all...  Kind  regards,  Philip Hall

[eltalia]

@Ben Framed

We definitely are playing the duet here Ben, maybe I am on Base with my
 tinted scepticism?
Thing is the number of people globally looking to turn a buck from bee
keeping - discounting the honeybadgers - grows every year almost at
compounding rates. The more airtime the industry gets the greater
escalation of the numbers.
This is not opinion but Fact by sheer numbers of startups excetera
- just one example here;
https://m.you    tube.com/watch?v=fHkQOA77EqQ

The NeverWet guy posted here, into a group that not only holds some
very savvy and well respected (USA) b'keeps, yet whilst his post has
been read more than 500 times and responded to more than 30 times..
not a peep from the guy since. Maybe he is of the opinion the points
raised are not valid, maybe he is simply a shy type... but the cynic in
me whispers it's more like the true generosity is a good as the reporting.
And that from a peer review perspective is a poor effort to say the least.

The concept is great, beetles (any) require rough surface to climb and
they prefer to climb over flying, but the delivery of results whilst accuring
Youtube "clicks" does not communicate this guy is fair dinkum, in my book.
Just another who has twisted logic to suit his own purpose, and we b'keeps
fall into line to then suffer the consequences, as Derek reports.

Dunno [shrug] I remain open to persuasion as I want to see a solution here
as much as any other ridgy didge (bona fide) b'keep.

Bill

[tycrnp]

I've said it before on the forum, I use the never wet system with great results!

Jim, I also want that recipe you were talking about at Beefest.

[Ben Framed]

@ eltalia yes it seems we are playing the duet😊. And I am thinking we are on the same team. You may very well be 100 percent right with your scepticism outlook toward this situation. Then again you may not be right? The fact is, every family, community, and government even bees, need "guards" to be protective of its people or
It's kind. In this case I am thinking that you are the guard force trying to protect the bee community from opportunist. Is this a fair assumption? On the other hand, we really don't know this guy's heart or his true intentions. Only The Good Lord knows. So if he truely is trying to help, then I say more power to him. If he is only out for self gain and a few minutes of fame and a few bucks then shame on him. If he is a honest and straight up fellow, I don't want it to be shame on me. I had questioned him when I watched the video several months ago in the comment section and he answered my questions to my satisfaction. I  can't speak for others, only myself. He seemed to know what he was talking about. I am thinking that if he is a good guy then he deserves our, or at least my, support. Now, if he does go through all of this experimentation again, with the  industrial type never wet and fails and does not report this to us then we will  know where Molly hid the peaches !! Right? I haven't looked at the YouTube video that you sent to me but I will here shortly. Thanks for your reply to me !! Sincerely, Phillip

[Ben Framed]

I've said it before on the forum, I use the never wet system with great results!

Jim, I also want that recipe you were talking about at Beefest.

tycrnp can I ask you how long you have been using this system?  I am new to this forum and haven't read your previous post on this matter. I am very interested in this product. And I hope that you don't mind the questions as I am trying to learn and was told, " the best way to learn is to ask questions". I have another question for you . I noticed that your location (town) or city is just 26 miles from Florida bee farmers (town) or city.  Do you personally know Florida bee farmer? And if yes, what is your relation to him? Friend, Family etc. If not how did you come across this system? Can you tell us more about the way you use this product? I have read the previous comments and have noticed  discrepancies on how it is to be used successfully. (Location of placement) Thanks for your comment. Kind reguards, Philip Hall

[BeeMaster2]

Jim, I also want that recipe you were talking about at Beefest.

TY,
See post #26.
Jim

[Ben Framed]

Jim, I also want that recipe you were talking about at Beefest.

TY,
See post #26.
Jim

Jim, this does sound promising. I am interested and would like to ask you if Dave mentioned how thick to apply the to apply this grease, or how long it will last, or how it is accepted by the bees and there reaction to it? Will it get hot and run down onto the wax ares of the frames?  Will  you be kind enough to give your personal experiences once you have tried this on your hives?  Is Dave a member of your forum? Or any others that was telling you about this new formula a member of your forum?  It would be nice to hear from them also.   Thanks, Phillip Hall

[BeeMaster2]

I just talked to Dave.
He said to use your hive tool and wipe a little on the last 3/4? of the brood nest is frame tabs and in the space between the frames on the hangers. Basically where the SHBs hide.
Good luck.
Jim

[Ben Framed]

I just talked to Dave.
He said to use your hive tool and wipe a little on the last 3/4? of the brood nest is frame tabs and in the space between the frames on the hangers. Basically where the SHBs hide.
Good luck.
Jim

💯. Many Thanks!!

[eltalia]

@ eltalia
(edit)
In this case I am thinking that you are the guard force trying to protect the bee community
 from opportunist. Is this a fair assumption?

Not even close, Phillip.
Forums are supposed to be about pooling concepts and outcomes
for review, in all forms.
I have made previous comment at other times on this SHB "trap"
,both here and on other forums. No matter how you wrap your
opinion on my review of this "invention" the posts are justified until
that time something changes.
Something like the advertiser bringing content to the table.
Following your ideals only serves to put slieght on valid comment,
a form of passive silencing.
That I cannot go along with.

Bill

[Ben Framed]

@ eltalia
(edit)
In this case I am thinking that you are the guard force trying to protect the bee community
 from opportunist. Is this a fair assumption?

Not even close, Phillip.
Forums are supposed to be about pooling concepts and outcomes
for review, in all forms.
I have made previous comment at other times on this SHB "trap"
,both here and on other forums. No matter how you wrap your
opinion on my review of this "invention" the posts are justified until
that time something changes.
Something like the advertiser bringing content to the table.
Following your ideals only serves to put slieght on valid comment,
a form of passive silencing.
That I cannot go along with.

Bill

Yes that small piece of quote from a question that I ask you which  was taken from my larger  post 37 to you, but I also went on to say this :
 if he truely is trying to help, then I say more power to him. If he is only out for self gain and a few minutes of fame and a few bucks then shame on him. If he is a honest and straight up fellow, I don't want it to be shame on me. I had questioned him when I watched the video several months ago in the comment section and he answered my questions to my satisfaction. I  can't speak for others, only myself. He seemed to know what he was talking about. I am thinking that if he is a good guy then he deserves our, or at least my, support. Now, if he does go through all of this experimentation again, with the  industrial type never wet and fails and does not report this to us then we will  know where Molly hid the peaches !! Right?

Not only that, but before I sent this answer to you,   tycrnp posted in 36 , The post before I answered you; in post 37, that he has been using this system with great results.. As you know I am new here. I am considered a new bee and rightfully so. The first post that I read here on this subject is this line and topic, and the inventor did reply, in post 31.    Now, I have not researched in past post for his replays or lack of but only took you word that he would not reply in the past after his  30th reply. So I don't know when that 30th reply was or what that reply was, or how many times he had been questioned since that reply, nor at this  particular time do I even care. You told me "very savvy and well respected (USA) b'keeps, yet whilst his post has
been read more than 500 times and responded to more than 30 times.. 
not a peep from the guy since. And again I took and take your word for it . So I really don't know what to think of all of this mess, If his new experiment works out, then it works out, and if he fails he fails. I am hoping that he  succeeds. I joined this forum to learn all I can about bees, Not to debate weather a fellows intentions are honerable or not. But I will say , I do hope his intentions are honorable along with yours. And being new here and with honest hopes of making new friends who also love bees, I am wondering if I would do better just watching YouTube. At least the video makers are nice , friendly and glad to help when I have had a question for them in the past in comment section.  Happy Easter to you and your family..

[eltalia]

@ Ben Framed
"So I really don't know what to think of all of this mess"

Let the points made sit as they are, not to clutter it all up with noise/squelch
- that's the way forward.
Take offence if that is your way, none is taken or directed. Requesting validation
is not offensive behaviour, got it?

FWIW... I do not do "Easter" nor any of the nonsense around the roots of it,
however I do respect the (bee) beliefs of yhose who do, when those beliefs hold
water and are simply anoyher way of doing the same thing.
So... you enjoy your day, Phillip.

Bill

[Ben Framed]

@ Ben Framed
"So I really don't know what to think of all of this mess"

Let the points made sit as they are, not to clutter it all up with noise/squelch
- that's the way forward.
Take offence if that is your way, none is taken or directed. Requesting validation
is not offensive behaviour, got it?

FWIW... I do not do "Easter" nor any of the nonsense around the roots of it,
however I do respect the (bee) beliefs of yhose who do, when those beliefs hold
water and are simply anoyher way of doing the same thing.
So... you enjoy your day, Phillip.

Bill

Yes I agree, let the points sit as they are. So far I don't see that you have made one. And I thank you for the good day wish. Got it ?