A question concerning Varroa Destructor and the viruses (plural) it carries

[Ben Framed]

We know that Varroa destructor not only lives off of the bee or larva which is its host and causes its weakness and untimely demise to the bee and devastation to larva, but varroa destructor also carries viruses (plural )which can cause havoc on a hive, even collapse. My question; When varroa enters a hive, and introduces these viruses, can the bees themselves spread these viruses throughout the hive or is it varroa destructor itself which does the spreading? I suspect the bees also spread the viruses.

Phillip

[Michael Bush]

All of these viruses existed before Varroa.

[Salvo]

Hi Folks,

To further buttress Mr. Bush:

It's my personal "understanding"/opinion that these pestilences are ubiquitous. They're in the environment already (just like Covid). Varroa weakens the bee's ability to live in spite of and fend off these diseases.

Last year eastern Massachusetts had its first case of AFB in a long time (one case all season), very close to my and my mentees' hives. Clubs, members, mentors were cautioned to take extraordinary precautions, just short of dipping your shoes in disinfectant when you left a property. It's out there.

When I talk to newbees about varroa, I liken it to a tick attached to you,... the size of a house cat, sucking the life out of you. Too many ticks? Your dead. Too many varroa? Your colony is dead.

Please see here (Tom Seeley is in it. It's safe.).

Some honeybee colonies adapt in wake of deadly mites

https://news.cornell.edu/stories/2015/08/some-honeybee-colonies-adapt-wake-deadly-mites?fbclid=IwY2xjawEnJOpleHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHaZbOANh2TAYCuBNrNV70VwIORKPDfvNzadJNwhnMc5KzVHq3YkrnhiTZQ_aem_iZVuGsIjFWijXGt-WV4i1g

Sal

[beesnweeds]

I suspect the bees also spread the viruses.

Yes, they can spread viruses like DWV.  Not saying my thinking is correct but this is why I personally prefer disease resistant bees like Russians over VSH bees.

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-021-88649-y

[Ben Framed]

Thanks each of you for your replies.

Phillip

[Michael Bush]

What I observed with the Russians was they had high mite counts but they survived them.  Surviving Varroa is not about mite counts.

[Bill Murray]

They're in the environment already (just like Covid). Varroa weakens the bee's ability to live in spite of and fend off these diseases.

[/b]

This is also what I have learned, been taught, and been led to believe.

[Ben Framed]

All true, at the same time isn?t it also true that before CCD was understood by the public and many beekeepers, a complete colony would simply disappear within a matter of days which had previously shown no outward sign of illness? Leaving the hive with honey pollen and brood etc? Isn?t it now understood that Varroa, along with the viruses they carry, were the major culprit in the once mysterious CCD? 

Phillip

[beesnweeds]

In the past as far as the late 1800s there's been reports of high sudden losses similar to CCD.  CCD may have been caused by a combination of viruses like Nosema and iridovirus.  Combinations of viruses can cause sudden collapse.  The weak die and the strong survive and rebound. 

I'm not sure if the public understands and some beekeepers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIzhf9ucagk

[Ben Framed]

What I observed with the Russians was they had high mite counts but they survived them.  Surviving Varroa is not about mite counts.

In the past as far as the late 1800s there's been reports of high sudden losses similar to CCD.  CCD may have been caused by a combination of viruses like Nosema and iridovirus.  Combinations of viruses can cause sudden collapse.  The weak die and the strong survive and rebound. 

I'm not sure if the public understands and some beekeepers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIzhf9ucagk

Thanks, beesnweeds. Your and Mr Bush words are the point I am getting too. I am thinking of our friends in Australia, who have yet to run across Varroa Destructor.  I reached the opinion sometime ago that it?s not varroa destructor itself, which devastates our hives so quickly upon interdiction, though the effects of varroa are bad enough and hard enough on our bees in their own respect. It is a variety of viruses they carry which devastate hives quickly when Varroa Initially invades an area in my opinion. Is the lack of immunity to these viruses, plural, which devastate hives beyond the point of survival (initially) in my opinion. What  survivors do rebound, I am thinking  have a natural immunity, or an immunity effect built from introduction and survived which helps them fight the viruses which will devastate a hive quickly to the point of collapse.  I have been at Beemaster since 2017. I started posting in 2018 after much study here. Expert beekeepers here have had to much to say about such matters. It is my thinking that the viruses varroa carry are the main initial killers of our bees when varroa destructor is introduced.

[Bill Murray]

Phillip your hitting the nail on the head. Its not the MITE that KILLS the bees they just weaken them to the point they are susceptible to any variety of factors.

[Ben Framed]

Thanks Bill,
Beekeepers have come a long way in dealing with SHB and Varroa.

[Michael Bush]

Varroa also spread the diseases.  Sucking the hemolymph of one bee and moving to another...

[Bill Murray]

Michael,  I realize the mite is a vector, but is it not true the viruses are always in the hive? I know a couple people that have virus testing done and the claim is viruses are always present but at different levels. I myself dont do this so second hand info. Just wondering.

[Michael Bush]

>but is it not true the viruses are always in the hive?

Yes.  Before Varroa they were also.  But now they spread faster.