Beemaster's International Beekeeping Forum
BEEKEEPING LEARNING CENTER => GENERAL BEEKEEPING - MAIN POSTING FORUM. => Topic started by: Ben Framed on March 16, 2020, 12:30:15 pm
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This doctor explained the following so fluent that even I, without scientific background, can basically understand his thoughts and explanations most clearly. This information looks very promising. I would like for you three scientist to check it out and give us your expert thoughts. I feel certain every member here, will so much appreciate your input. Jim please give these three time to review this before moving to another section please.
Phillip
https://youtu.be/U7F1cnWup9M
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Update. Just came out 22 minutes ago.
https://youtu.be/1vZDVbqRhyM
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Well I by no means consider myself to be an expert on any of this, particularly not when we have Van here, who was an actual research professional, but I did watch both videos just now. Both are great, very well explained. The big thing I personally take away from this is that there is progress being made. It's not as if this virus is completely baffling the scientific/medical community; there seems to be potentially promising treatment options and vaccine ideas coming out of the woodwork, and that, I think, is cause for optimism.
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Just excellent info Mr. Ben.
Conclusion. Common tonic water contains 20mg quinine, similar to chloroquine, not mentioned in the video, I just happen to know from malaria studies. Common tonic water as in gin and tonic, same stuff,
Chloroquine transports zinc into the cell where zinc inhibits the growth of the Corvid 19 virus. Zinc cannot enter into a cell without chloroquine. Chloroquine is a prescription med. however as mentioned common tonic water, available at any grocery store has 20 quinine per 12 oz bottle. Tonic water, chloroquine, plus zinc added to the diet lowered death rate by 10 fold in Korea compared to Italy.
When this hits the news, tonic water will sell out. I gonna buy tonic water, and vitamin with zinc, cheap treatment.
Good catch, Phil. Seriously, this could saves lives.
Van
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https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3609296/#s1title
Article showing same mode of action between Quinine and chloroquine.
https://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=quinine+zinc+transport&hl=en&as_sdt=0&as_vis=1&oi=scholart#d=gs_qabs&u=%23p%3DH26MeWFM4tkJ
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.researchgate.net/figure/UV-spectra-of-quinine-sulphate-and-quinine-zinc-complex_fig3_237327549/amp
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Zinc has been shown to aid in a number of viral cases. it is no cure, but anything that shortens ort lessens the impact is always good.
Glad someone is doing real studies on it. It drives me a tad nuts when someone want to use Fru fru science!
These do appear to have been properly done.
Barry
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The second video is complex. I try to summarize as simply as possible.
The virus must attach to a human cell. This attachment, virus to human cell, is possible by a human cell surface structure known as ace2. High blood pressure medication also diabetes medication increases the ace2 therefore folks taking high blood pressure medication ending in: TAN or diabetes meds ending in PRIL have increased ace2 thus resulting in more virus numbers and much sicker patients.
Contrary, the European medical union cautions the above is hypothetical and warns patients NOT to stop taking the meds ending in TAN or PRIL.
More simply stated a virus just cannot make physical contact with a human cell and enter the cell. The human cell wall inhibits entry of the virus. However the corvid19 virus found a back door that allows entry into a human cell. This back door is called ace2. The ace2 is located in high numbers in lung cells. Thus a lung infection results, inwhich a lung infection is known as pneumonia. The above meds are educationally GUESSED, or hypothesis as we say in science, at increasing ace2, the back door entry for corvid19 into a lung cell.
A curious note, Asians have more ace2 than Americans. I am in no way offer opinions, just my interpretations of the videos. Great catch, again, Phil. Thanks for posting.
Van
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Thank you Mr. Van. I knew you would know! I knew We could count on you. That goes for you also Member and BAHBEES. God job men. I hope this does help.
Gods Blessings,
Phillip
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Mr Van, do you have an idea of what amount of tonic per day we should drink?
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Ben, mixed with Jim Beam, 50-50, about a quart per day, BUT DON"T DRIVE>>>>>>>>> :shocked: :cheesy: :cheesy:
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Phil, I can?t state because that could cause liabilities, also I do not know for sure.
What is known, same infected number of people, however: the Koreans had 1:10 death rate compared to itialians. Koreans about 45 deaths and Italian about 450: exact numbers are in the video, I am posting approximate numbers. The Koreans used the zinc transporter they block the virus as described in my earlier post.
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Ben, mixed with Jim Beam, 50-50, about a quart per day, BUT DON"T DRIVE>>>>>>>>> :shocked: :cheesy: :cheesy:
I luv it. Good one ID.
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I understand. I appreciate what you have shared very informative and you shared knowledge here may save lives. Thank you so much
Phillip
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Ben, mixed with Jim Beam, 50-50, about a quart per day, BUT DON"T DRIVE>>>>>>>>> :shocked: :cheesy: :cheesy:
Iddee not that was funny! Once again you made me literally laugh out loud!! :shocked: :grin: :grin: :grin:
Phillip
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Once again thank you Barry, Van, and Member... Much appreciated!
Phillip
PS You to Iddee lol 😂
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Molecular Biology is fascinating!
Taking some lead off of the info here I just bought some Tonic to go with my stock of Bombay Saphire. Plus some Mens high Zinc multi-vitamin. This may or may not make a difference at all for me. Though it is pretty much guaranteed those certainly are not going to do me any harm and if anything will help with boosting energies and morale going into the bee-spring work period.
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Fantastic information and discussion.
Thanks, Phillip and all.
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Van, BAABEEs, Member, check this out! The next question; Is this drug readily available? Is this one of the drugs that fits into the 90 percent of drugs, manufactured in China? If so, will China have it in sufficient amounts, and be willing for world wide distribution in a moments notice? Are there drug companies which make, or can make, and produce mass amounts of this drug here in America making it readily available for Americans as well as other countries? Are these reasonable questions?
Thanks Phillip
https://youtu.be/Ua9AdoXZFZQ
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Van, BAABEEs, Member, check this out! The next question; Is this drug readily available? Is this one of the drugs that?s fit into the 90 percent of drugs, manufactured in China? If so will China have it in sufficient supplies and amounts for world wide distribution in a moments notice? Are there drug companies which make or can produce mass amounts of this drug here in America making it readily available for Americans as well as other countries? Are these reasonable questions?
Thanks Phillip
https://youtu.be/Ua9AdoXZFZQ
I think those are reasonable questions and I don't know the answer to any of them. :cheesy: I think this seems like really good news though.
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Thank you for your response Member.
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Chloroquine, you nailed that one Mr. Ben over a week ago. What took the FDA so long? BenFramed should counsel those researchers, tell them which direction to head. It?s all in Mr. BenFrame original post, the subject of this post, originated days ago.
Wait another week and mention will be made of tonic water, contrary to big pharma who wishes to sale their drug. Those folks will do anything to hide tonic water and quinine. Big pharma can?t make a dime off tonic water, so every effort will be made to hide. Think of the $$$$$$ almost every person in the world would buy RX to prevent or lessen corvid19. So hush hush about tonic water and quinine.
Thank you again Mr. Ben, Phil, your best catch yet!
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>BenFramed should counsel those researchers, tell them which direction to head. It?s all in Mr. BenFrame original post, the subject of this post, originated days ago.
Mr. Van Thank you for the kind words. I am just bold enough to try! lol But realizing my lack of proper education in this field, would be my disadvantage. On the other hand, with you by my side I think we as a team, could give them a run for their money! Getting this mess straightened out pronto! lol :wink:
PS It would not be a bad idea to ask Iddee, Member, and BAABEEs along just for good measure. :grin:
Phillip
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Mr. Ben brought the subject choloquine malaria drug [see video] on March 16, this thread, FDA just ordered one million doses and is now, just recently, news folks are talking about Mr. Ben?s, Phil subject matter, this thread. What took everybody, new media, so long??? All the media had to do was read this post on BeeMaster by BenFramed. Again, good catch, Phil.
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Thank you Mr Van. I agree this is very important news and I am very happy to hear that the FDA has decided to finally move on this. So important. But I can not really take credit for the find, I think the Good Lord led me to it and form me, to you, through me. Teamwork Mr Van. I credit YOU for confirming just how important this drug is for this situation. I am happy that you studied it and know of it. I feel we at Beemaster are blessed that you are here to enlighten us. I also wish to recognize Member and BAABEEs for their input. But you are the key to our understanding and conformation. Just more proof that a Scientist may retire but is never retired. Thank you so very much and lets pray that we, nor our families and friends, have to be faced with this dread.
Phillip
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Mr Van it seems more and more people in the medical field are agreeing with you and what you had to say weeks ago. Thank you Mr Van.
https://youtu.be/vQ_mrOkZnbc
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Yeah thanks guys zinc and tonic water is now on my daily schedule.
I?d also like to add, in regards to the above video, that although 1000000 tests have been done, and congrats for that, it?s still a long way behind other countries like Italy, tests per capita but is moving forward which is positive.
Stay safe all.
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At 18:50 The President speaks of this once more. Mr Van.
Phillip
https://youtu.be/nAyneT9Nutw
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Not to be the wet blanket, but this so far has been largely hot air. Anecdotal evidence is not what we need. We need a good study done on it, but currently there is little real evidence to say this will work. The Non-medical politicians need dearly to shut up and sit done and let the medical folks lead...with NO interference. There has been far too much minimalization lingo out of the current leadership for me to trust what they say.
The use of survivors antibodies is likely our shortest route to safety. we did almost have a treatment about 2 years ago...but it got defunded.
Sadly I think that we are now beginning to pay for a decades long growing illogical doubting of science/scientists and doctors.
Barry
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Yes, some of us are old enough to remember Thalidomide. We want new meds tested well before cast into the general public.
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I have total confidence in. Mr Van. He may be the scientist', scientist.
> chloroquine, plus zinc added to the diet lowered death rate by 10 fold in Korea compared to Italy.
And to add to Vans statement above, Mr Trump our President says that STUDIES show that patients who have Lupus, which take this durg, and has been for years, has non existent cases of Corona. This drug has been tested and retested, and used around the world for decades for Malaria, Lupus, and severe Arthritis So throw you blankets, put up the white flag, lol. I will go with the first and second post here from experts and what these experts say. No offence intended to anyone. This may very well save lives, Like President ask, what do you have to lose if you are laying on your deathbed and chloroquine is made available? I commend Mr Trump, the businessman, (now) politician, for being bold enough to make the statement. Each to his own. lol
Phillip
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That is the problem with throwing an untested lifeline to the general public. They will take it every time.
My wife has to take that stuff for tick influenced Arthritis. It has some rather rough side effects. Pretty bad rage being one of them. It resembles what we used to call Roid Rage back when I was a kid. It also causes her to have extreme muscle cramps in her legs. he has learned to only take it for a while and then go off to control the side effects. it has the capacity to do some rather bad long term organ function issues. This is not just aspirin level medications. To make things even more cool because this untried (in a scientific study sense), approach has been so bragged on the supplies have been bought up and hoarded. this means that my wife when she needs it or worse when a lupus patient needs the drug that actually works for them, they cannot get it right now. Worth noting...unless you happen to be quite wealthy...or you are one of the hoarders...you wont be getting much of it either. I have serious doubts that enough tonic water could be consumed to really make a difference.
Not trying to be all negative and all merely realistic. I need hard data.
Barry
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I watched this show. Fauci is currently the voice of reason.
"The data are really just, at best, suggestive," Fauci told CBS's "Face the Nation" on Sunday. "There have been cases that show there may be an effect, and there are others to show there's no effect. So I think, in terms of science, I don't think we could definitively say it works."
Barry
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"There have been cases that show there may be an effect, and there are others to show there's no effect"
Barry, there isn't a medicine on earth that works on all patients.
When terminal, I think it's a great time to test the unknown. What do they have to lose?
That's why we have prescriptions rather than just throwing it out on the store shelf. Nothing works for all, but I also don't think the decision should be wholly made by the doctors and drug makers that will profit by more of it being sold. Our leaders and their assistants should keep a close eye on it and have the final say.
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I am sorry about you wife Barry. I wish there was a miracle cure for what she has. I understand what you are saying about more data. Unfortunately there is not time for more for some folks. I agree with you again that this stuff should not be just handed out. It should be a prescription, therefore a person that test positive and in a bad way should be the one receiving by prescription of a Doctor. I have not heard of hoarding of this medication, however I am concerned about availability of this. As most us know 90% of ALL medication comes from China. I have a very, very good friend which takes this for Lupus. From what I understand, the dose for Corina is 500mg per day for 6 days. I do not know, but I would like to know if taken for short term, will this do organ damage? As iddee said, and I agree. If it is a matter of life and death, the choice is simple. Now as for tonic water. Mr Van pointed out that 12oz has 20mg. We can not nor should we, try and drink that much a day. Far too much liquid intake can be dangerous. But: If we were to take 32oz. three or four times a day, spaced out, in an emergency situation, perhaps it will get a person over the hump if the proper amount of zinc is included? Even this may to much liquid intake? I do not know and I'm not claiming to know. Lets hope no one here, nor members of our families, are faced with these circumstances. Thank you Barry for your input and critical thinking I appreciate your point of view as well as others. That is why I added your name to the heading.
Phillip
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I understand that we are supposed to have social distancing, but shouldn't this be discussed in the Coffee House? I generally log on here for Bee discussions.
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I understand that we are supposed to have social distancing, but shouldn't this be discussed in the Coffee House? I generally log on here for Bee discussions.
Jimmy, from the very first post. "Jim please give these three time to review this before moving to another section please."
The reason that I ask Jim to consider the request, and I suppose he so graciously did, is the importance of the topic, which may save lives, including beekeepers lives which may read here. Maybe even some of our very own friends who may need to know of this information in these critical times. I understand you may not like to see this here in general beekeeping and in that case your request is valid as far as I am concerned. Maybe Jim will move, leaving the heading here and while adding moved to another location that he deems appropriate? That way folks who may be keeping up with this will know where to find it.
Phillip
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