Unconsolidated nectar

[Bob Wilson]

I did my first paper combine today. A hive must have been robbed because the queen was gone, there was no brood, and the combs were empty except for a lot of workers. I am glad I made a few nucs this past spring. However it brought into focus a secondary issue... that hive has 15 frames of comb (85%) empty except for scattered patches (15%) of nectar. It seems every frame has some nectar in it. I see this in all my hives.
Why don't the bees fill up one frame of comb before going onto the next? I want to pull some of the empty comb. They are downsizing here at the end of our summer dearth and approaching the fall. However, all the hives have 4 or 5 empty combs, but with patches of uncapped nectar. I don't want to leave all that empty comb for beetles, but neither do I want to deny them the nectar they have collected. What do you beeks do?

[Ben Framed]

Is this a Langstroth hive?

[The15thMember]

In my experience this is pretty normal.  Now that our summer flow is over I've been removing partially drawn supers from the hives that don't need them anymore, and there are usually several frames with a small amount of nectar, either capped or uncapped, roughly in the center of the comb.  I don't know why they fill the comb in this fashion.  If they have enough filled frames and don't need the extra nectar, I'll just freeze those frames and store them for next year.  If I had a hive that needed the stores, I'd probably feed them to stimulate them to fill and cap the combs.   

[FloridaGardener]

Without any scientific basis I think those nectar patches might be...

Our equivalent of commuter mugs when the bees are on the far side of the hive.

A way to help thermoregulate, or transfer humming noises.

Staking out territory, the way a cat leaves scent on the furniture.

A map so they know which comb they are on (applies only to foundation that looks all the same).

[Bob Wilson]

Thanks for the replies.
Ben- they are long langstroths.

[The15thMember]

I wonder if maybe sometimes it happens because they start to fill the comb before they have fully drawn out the frame, but then by the time they have, the flow is over and they are left with just that spot of nectar in the middle. 

[TheHoneyPump]

Without any scientific basis I think those nectar patches might be...

Our equivalent of commuter mugs when the bees are on the far side of the hive.

A way to help thermoregulate, or transfer humming noises.

Staking out territory, the way a cat leaves scent on the furniture.

A map so they know which comb they are on (applies only to foundation that looks all the same).

LoL.

[TheHoneyPump]

In the Fall, about now in most NA regions, we are working at compressing the hives into the desired wintering configuration. This means manipulating combs to consolidate brood and resources to where we think they should be in the hive for best chances at making the coming winter.  While doing so excess combs and boxes are removed. Often when done there are many bees left hanging out carpeting the front of the hive without enough space to get in. The bees left out is not a concern to us as most of those are about to die off of old age and high flight mileage anyways. The important bees, the young ones that will be raising the winter bees, are inside in the heart of the nest. 
Of the removed equipment; What is worthwhile gets extracted. Some choicest combs are kept in storage (frozen) for use as emergency feed inserts in the spring.  The rest;  the stickies, the partial combs of nectar, scrapings, etc ... are open fed (rob) to have the bees take back and pack into the smaller hive space they have been left with. (Do this in dearth of course so the bees rob it out quickly).  In case of just a few hives, only a couple combs and scraps are put out at a time.   In yards with many hives, supers of stickies and partials are cross stacked nearby.  Those are licked clean and dry in a matter of a few hours on a warm day.  Pickup the dry equipment in the evening, when all bees are gone back home, and put into winter storage. Put out the next set early the next morning. Only put out at a time what they can completely cleanup in one to two days, not all at once. 

Hope that helps!

[Bob Wilson]

 But of course, HP.
I suppose there is no way to get an individual hive to consolidate its stores, but I can pull all those patchy nectar frames, and they will consolidate it into the condensed hives I leave them.
How far from my 4 hives should I place them, to prevent a robbing frenzy?

[Ben Framed]

Brilliant Honey Pump. I am glad you posted this. Thanks. It does help!

[TheHoneyPump]

But of course, HP.
I suppose there is no way to get an individual hive to consolidate its stores, but I can pull all those patchy nectar frames, and they will consolidate it into the condensed hives I leave them.
How far from my 4 hives should I place them, to prevent a robbing frenzy?

Close enough they can easily find it.  Far enough that it does not look like, smell like, and lead to a beehive nearby once depleted and the bees start circling. Depending how long your legs are;  that means 20 to 50 big steps away.
Every area also has a predominant normal wind direction. Select a place of that distance and upwind from the hive(s) for rapid discovery and quick cleanouts.
Always use the same spot. The bees remember and will go there everyday and circle around before moving on, whether stuff is there or not. In that way, their discovery of new pickings put out is matter of few minutes - even 2 weeks later.  This homing is also why the first and most effective thing to do with a hive that is experiencing robbing pressure is to move it.

[Bob Wilson]

How long after paper combining thethe two hives, can I go back in, shift the broodnest, and condense the hive?

[TheHoneyPump]

The initial mingling is taking place less than 24 hours.  For the bees to `cycle` through and between combs is 48 to 72 hrs. Sometimes they are faster, sometimes they are slower. Depends on weather and hive conditions.  Wait until you are seeing clear evidence of a good deal of shredded paper fibre fuzz and clippings tossed out the entrance onto the ground, or 4 days minimum, whichever comes first.

Hope that helps!

[Oldbeavo]

HP is right, but make sure you condense the hive pretty tight. We are always surprise how tight bees pack down for winter.
I know it won't help the present issue but we will start to pack down with a couple of weeks of Autumn flow to go. This makes them pack out any existing space with honey.
We had some doubles that were a bit light for bees and packed them down to singles for winter a couple of weeks before the rest. Bit more warmth from smaller space and packing out all the spare comb they wintered really well.
An old bee keeper once said "invest the last of the honey flow in the hives rather than the bank account".

[Bob Wilson]

I followed the advice. The newspaper combine worked beautifully, even in a horizontal hive. Four days later, I saw the newspaper sheds kicked out, I moved the broodnest to the front of the queenless hive. Another four days later, and the queen is laying well. Thanks.