Author Topic: American Sniper (Read 15248 times)

sc-bee · « **on:** January 06, 2015, 11:03:12 pm »

Who plans on seeing American Sniper? And if you do leave us a comment.

asprince · « **Reply #1 on:** January 13, 2015, 08:46:57 pm »

I saw it this weekend. I really enjoyed the movie. It kept my attention all the way through. If you get a chance to see it I recommend.

Steve

Kathyp · « **Reply #2 on:** January 13, 2015, 09:38:37 pm »

Don't see how it could miss. It's directed by Eastwood and apparently stays true to the story. I plan on seeing it, but not sure if i'll end up waiting for PPV.

sc-bee · « **Reply #3 on:** January 19, 2015, 02:00:33 pm »

Waitng for the crowds to die down. It is shattering box office records for a new release. One I definitely paln to see on the big screen.

hjon71 · « **Reply #4 on:** January 19, 2015, 08:18:58 pm »

I plan on seeing it. I just don't know when.

BlueBee · « **Reply #5 on:** January 19, 2015, 10:10:05 pm »

What would Michael Moore do?

sc-bee · « **Reply #6 on:** January 19, 2015, 10:29:55 pm »

Quote from: BlueBee on January 19, 2015, 10:10:05 pm

What would Michael Moore do?

Who really cares..........we know what Clint would do. That is what matters :) Who is Michael Moore anyway?????

Michael Bush · « **Reply #7 on:** January 20, 2015, 11:10:42 am »

>What would Michael Moore do?

Take everything out of context and then gripe about it...

sc-bee · « **Reply #8 on:** January 30, 2015, 08:27:45 am »

Finally got to see American Sniper this weekend. I had made one 45 min trip earlier just to find it was sold out. Yes I will admit I have seen plenty movies that had a better entertainment factor but that was not the point of the movie. The movie IMHO is meant to try and give you an inside look at what war does to an individual on an individual basis and family level. The affect on both Kyle and his wife is explored. No it is not intended to be a pro-war statement etc as a lot of the controversy has been about.
But of course a lot of controversy has arisen from the movie. I did find it odd that reports are that viewers in Baghdad were liking the movie. Reports that in the opening scene they were yelling out in the theater. Shoot her, Shoot her. Of course those more up on the historical relations of different groups in this region can probably educate me on this attitude in Baghdad. Since then it has been pulled in Baghdad. Then of course there is the Ventura deal as he spouts off. Only wish Chris Kyle was here to answer is allegations. And there is the Katrina issue referenced in the book. Also Kyles wife is suing Craft International a company that Kyle and two business partners started. Apart from the equity issue in the company she does not want the company to ue a logo Kyle designed for Craft International. The logo is known as the Craft Skull. Read the story of the logo here:
http://www.thecraft.com/craft_skull.html

All that said the story attempts to show the struggle and inter-turmoil Kyle had trying to balance a military career and a family life. He also struggled with the fact of feeling he let his brethren down when he was not on tour. Yes how many lives did Chris Kyle take???? Not to be-little the impact of taking a life but more important HOW MANY LIVES DID HE SAVE!

For the intended purpose of the movie which IMAO was not entertainment, I give it a 8.5.

jalentour · « **Reply #9 on:** January 31, 2015, 10:52:53 pm »

SC,
You're dead on in your review.
I would have liked to see more development of the characters aside from Kyle.
The acting and script are pretty good, not great. I doubt it will any awards other than Eastwood, maybe. Although I am not sure he was nominated for anything.
It is a story many Americans want to know about.

It does make me wonder how much more Chris Kyle would have done for veterans. He could have made a huge impact.

Maggiesdad · « **Reply #10 on:** February 01, 2015, 09:01:30 am »

Watched it yesterday with my USMC son... It was hard to took at, but it reinforced my core beliefs. I've spent the last two weeks reading up on a book called Esther. Sometimes the only choice is annihilation, but key is take no plunder. I get so tired of us as a nation going off half fast and asking our young men and women to do a job with one or both hands tied behind their backs.

Many pages yet to be written in this story, and the tiny hated nation is the canary in the coal mine.

sc-bee · « **Reply #11 on:** February 01, 2015, 03:38:56 pm »

Quote from: Maggiesdad on February 01, 2015, 09:01:30 am

I get so tired of us as a nation going off half fast and asking our young men and women to do a job with one or both hands tied behind their backs.

Yes.... hands tied as in the scene when the spotter tells him if you are wrong you will spend the rest of your life in prison. You think as the enemy picks a target they care who is on the other end??? Rules of engagement in war are only for us???

Our Pastor mentioned another book "Fearless" about the life of a Navy seal. From the early days of drug abuse to becoming a SEAL. HE said it was a good read.

Dallasbeek · « **Reply #12 on:** February 02, 2015, 01:39:18 pm »

I saw American Sniper yesterday and sc-bee's comments are right on.

The closing scenes apparently are footage of Chris Kyle's memorial at Cowboys Stadium and the 180-mile funeral procession down Interstate 35 to his burial place in the Texas State Cemetery in Austin, the highway lined with people carrying flags, every overpass draped with flags, people showing their respect and grief over Kyle's death. Here in Texas, it was a big thing -- a real tragedy.

The previews before the movie were remarkable to me because with one exception out of about 10 previews, the movies coming out are dystopian. Even a remake of Mad Max! Another Terminator movie with Arnold Swartzneger repeating "I'll be back" once again. What's going on with all these dark movies?

I think Bradley Cooper did a remarkable job. He had to bulk up big time to play this role. But, yeah, the movie does show how war affects not only the warrior, but everyone around him.

I'd suggest we reserve judgment on Jesse Ventura's cause. The jury heard all the evidence and awarded him damages against Kyle's estate. Ventura was a Seal, too, remember.

Dallasbeek · « **Reply #13 on:** February 02, 2015, 03:01:43 pm »

Quote from: kathyp on January 13, 2015, 09:38:37 pm

Don't see how it could miss. It's directed by Eastwood and apparently stays true to the story. I plan on seeing it, but not sure if i'll end up waiting for PPV.

It hurt to pay almost $20 a ticket at AMC IMAX, but I suggest seeing it on the big screen, Kathy.

sc-bee · « **Reply #14 on:** February 02, 2015, 03:22:58 pm »

Quote from: Dallasbeek on February 02, 2015, 01:39:18 pm

I'd suggest we reserve judgment on Jesse Ventura's cause. The jury heard all the evidence and awarded him damages against Kyle's estate. Ventura was a Seal, too, remember.

I agree......my comment about Ventura spouting could have been reserved. Yes the evidence was heard and he won. I just would like to hear or see how it would have went if Kyle were here. Let's see wouldn't it be nice if Ventura does collect he donates the money to the Military Charity of his choice? Or Jessie "The Body Ventura's" money may be gone?

Dallasbeek · « **Reply #15 on:** February 02, 2015, 03:38:28 pm »

Quote from: sc-bee on February 02, 2015, 03:22:58 pm

Quote from: Dallasbeek on February 02, 2015, 01:39:18 pm
I'd suggest we reserve judgment on Jesse Ventura's cause. The jury heard all the evidence and awarded him damages against Kyle's estate. Ventura was a Seal, too, remember.

I agree......my comment about Ventura spouting could have been reserved. Yes the evidence was heard and he won. I just would like to hear or see how it would have went if Kyle were here. Let's see wouldn't it be nice if Ventura does collect he donates the money to the Military Charity of his choice? Or Jessie "The Body Ventura's" money may be gone?

Yes, that would be the noble thing for Jesse to do. Absolutely.

And yes, it's a shame Kyle is no longer living and helping others, and that the guy that killed Kyle and his friend, Chad Littlefield, didn't get the help he really needed before shooting Kyle and Littlefield. The shooter is still awaiting trial for two counts of capital murder. IMO, justice delayed is justice denied, but I'm sure the legal process in this case is complicated by the question of the shooter's sanity. In the movie, the guy going with Kyle was made to look a little "off". Just a hint of it, I thought.

Maggiesdad · « **Reply #16 on:** February 02, 2015, 05:37:53 pm »

Today is Chris Kyle Day in Texas...

I'll wager that chaps Mister Moore where the sun don't shine...

Dallasbeek · « **Reply #17 on:** February 02, 2015, 06:50:19 pm »

Today is the second anniversary of the day he was killed. That's why the guv declared today as Chris Kyle Day.

Keith13 · « **Reply #18 on:** February 03, 2015, 08:41:38 pm »

Michael Moore? Never heard of her

Keith

sc-bee · « **Reply #19 on:** February 09, 2015, 09:20:47 pm »

Started reading the book. I was surprised to read he shot a 300 mag. I thought .308 was the standard ? I guess not when you are making one mile shots.....

sc-bee · « **Reply #20 on:** February 09, 2015, 09:43:02 pm »

.300 Winchester Magnum

A lot of new things have happened with the 300 Win Mag over the past few years. The US Army has made a major push to adopt it for their new versions of the M24 SWS and as such a new emphasis was placed on making it an effective cartridge for 1500 meter engagements. The 300 WM is an outstanding cartridge for military sniping, but as you might imagine, it offers a lot of power and penetration, which limits its role in Law Enforcement. The Secret Service does use the .300 WM, but they?re situation is rare and unique and they do not typically have to be concerned with hostage situations. They just need to insure that the possible assassin is stopped, and the .300 WM is a good caliber to do that. The .300 WM is also a great round for going through media in order to hit the target. With the new heavier loads the .300 is very capable of extending well past 1000 meters reliably. One big criticism of the .300 WM is the amount of recoil that the round produces and how hard it is on barrels. Yes, it can punish the shooter but with heavy tactical rifles and even potentially the use of effective muzzlebrakes the recoil can be managed. Proper training can help as well.

Recommendation: The .300 WM is high recommended for military use, but not so for Law Enforcement use. If a suitable round can be found that limits over-penetration, the .300 WM could be a very flexible cartridge, even offering good armor penetration with the right ammo selection.

Dallasbeek · « **Reply #21 on:** February 10, 2015, 12:26:37 am »

I thought he was using a .338 Lapua. A .300 WM? Good round. i'll have to look up how they compare, but I hunted elk with a young guy shooting a .338 and when he fired a round beside me, I definitely felt it. And the elk 200 yards away felt it way more.

Dallasbeek · « **Reply #22 on:** February 10, 2015, 06:26:59 pm »

According to Reid Schram, writing in Epoch Times, Chris Kyle used a McMillan TAC 338 on his last deployment and said he would have used it before if it had been available. In his first three deployments, he used a heavily modified Remington in .300 WM, but his 2,100- yard shot was on the third deployment, with the .338 Lapua magnum -- the longest kill shot on record. That rifle costs north of $5,000 before scope and modifications, so I don't think I'll be getting one anytime soon, not to mention that I can't even see 2,100 yards, much less make that kind of shot. I hope the movie inspires our military to turn out a few more like Chris Kyle.

Michael Bush · « **Reply #23 on:** February 10, 2015, 08:56:00 pm »

>...not to mention that I can't even see 2,100 yards, much less make that kind of shot.

That's why they make scopes...

Maggiesdad · « **Reply #24 on:** February 10, 2015, 10:00:32 pm »

I don't care who you are - 2100yds is some serious AT&T.

sc-bee · « **Reply #25 on:** February 11, 2015, 02:42:22 am »

Quote from: Dallasbeek on February 10, 2015, 06:26:59 pm

According to Reid Schram, writing in Epoch Times, Chris Kyle used a McMillan TAC 338 on his last deployment and said he would have used it before if it had been available.

Just in the first of the book now .... no reader here. I knew it was a Remington frame. He may mention the .338 later.

Dallasbeek · « **Reply #26 on:** February 11, 2015, 12:47:42 pm »

The fact that a box of 20 rounds of ammo for the .338 runs $80 to $100 limits the number of people using the .338. The .308 or .30-06 is adequate for most any game except brown bears in America. I took my last elk with a .270 after the scope on my 06 got banged up. Had misgivings about using .270, but it did the job very well.

Michael Bush · « **Reply #27 on:** February 12, 2015, 08:46:40 am »

>The fact that a box of 20 rounds of ammo for the .338 runs $80 to $100 limits the number of people using the .338.

I would think anyone who is interested in the .338 would be handloading. I've never bought a factory round for my .25-06.

sc-bee · « **Reply #28 on:** February 14, 2015, 11:33:30 pm »

Chris Kyle- - The Real American Sniper - The History Channel

Dallas they mention him switching to the .338 . Said it will penetrate 5 layers of body armor.

Richard M · « **Reply #29 on:** February 15, 2015, 06:49:02 am »

Quote from: sc-bee on January 19, 2015, 02:00:33 pm

Waiting for the crowds to die down. It is shattering box office records for a new release. One I definitely plan to see on the big screen.

American Sniper is alright I guess and exciting if you happen to be American, but I can't help feeling that they should make a movie called "Best Sniper" or something similar.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/defence/11383552/British-Royal-Marine-is-worlds-deadliest-sniper.html

Richard M · « **Reply #30 on:** February 15, 2015, 07:24:09 am »

Quote from: Dallasbeek on February 10, 2015, 06:26:59 pm

......Chris Kyle used a ..... but his 2,100- yard shot was on the third deployment, with the .338 Lapua magnum -- the longest kill shot on record.

WHAAAAT?????

The actual longest range sniper kill on record was a double by Corporal of Horse Craig Harrison of the Household Cavalry (British Army) in Helmand, Afghanistan, when he shot a Taliban machine gunner and then he killed the number 2, following which he put a round through their machine gun too, (to prove it wasn't a fluke) at a range of 2475m or 2707 yards.

http://www.ammoland.com/2014/04/british-sniper-sets-new-long-distance-kill-shot-record-8120-feet/#axzz3RoHyi3Vk

Second longest shot on record was by Corporal Rob Furlong of 3rd Battalion, Princess Patricia's Canadian Light Infantry (so sort of American) at 2430m.

Third was also a Canadian from the same regiment.

Kyles shot was 1900m - still bloody good but no cigar; it might have the longest shot on record for an American maybe but that doesn't make it a world record.

(actually it isn't, best shot by an American was Sgt. Bryan Kremer - 2300m in Iraq).

So there you have it, the best snipers are British. Most kills & longest shot.

And the best infantry soldiers in the world are British too - Royal Marine Commandos. (Although I think the Parachute Regiment might take issue with that.)

rookie2531 · « **Reply #31 on:** February 15, 2015, 08:14:26 am »

I remember seeing a short on a sniper and his site man. He missed a couple times and the targets was not fully aware they were even being shot at, being so far away, they heard no shot. One was armed and the other was not. One was finally shot and the other ran. The t.v. said that this was the farthest kill shot on record. It was somewhere in the middle east, but don't remember who it was.

Dallasbeek · « **Reply #32 on:** February 15, 2015, 01:25:41 pm »

"......Chris Kyle used a ..... but his 2,100- yard shot was on the third deployment, with the .338 Lapua magnum -- the longest kill shot on record.

WHAAAAT?????

The actual longest range sniper kill on record was a double by Corporal of Horse Craig Harrison of the Household Cavalry (British Army) in Helmand, Afghanistan, when he shot a Taliban machine gunner and then he killed the number 2, following which he put a round through their machine gun too, (to prove it wasn't a fluke) at a range of 2475m or 2707 yards. "

Richard,

I don't know, but maybe Harrison's shots came after Jyle's. Records are meant to be brokem, after all. Regardless, some Soviet and Finnish snipers' kill numbers were upwards of 500, I understand, so Kyle's 150 (official) to 250 (his estimate, allegedly) kills pale in comparison. Anyway, these guys are all just doing their jobs and it's nothing they're particularly proud of, I suspect.

sc-bee · « **Reply #33 on:** February 15, 2015, 03:30:51 pm »

Kyle himself said he did not want the number included in the book cause that is not what it is about. He stated the publicist convinced him to include a number. As said above I don't think any will brag about a number.... it was about protecting their brothers.
Kyle himself said he was not the best sniper.... in particular he said today's sniper has advantages on those of old school. Meaning computerized sniper weaponry.

Dallasbeek · « **Reply #34 on:** February 15, 2015, 04:32:48 pm »

Michael Moore says snipers are cowards. I'd like to him get the huevos to put himself out there as a sniper, since every enemy combatant wants to take out a sniper.

Keith13 · « **Reply #35 on:** February 17, 2015, 07:57:30 pm »

Quote from: sc-bee on February 15, 2015, 03:30:51 pm

Kyle himself said he did not want the number included in the book cause that is not what it is about. He stated the publicist convinced him to include a number. As said above I don't think any will brag about a number.... it was about protecting their brothers.
Kyle himself said he was not the best sniper.... in particular he said today's sniper has advantages on those of old school. Meaning computerized sniper weaponry.

Kyle said hands down Carlos Hathcock was the best American sniper. Yeah the canucks can shoot a great shot but it was with a .50 caliber sniper rifle. It helps to shoot a round that has a effective target range of 5,000 yards.

read Hathcock's book truly amazing what that fellow did

Keith

Dallasbeek · « **Reply #36 on:** February 17, 2015, 08:34:33 pm »

I'd be truly embarrassed to meet a shooter like that on the range. I fired in one high-power match and we were all such duffers that at 700 yards the guy next to me on my left would fire and my target would drop. Then when it came back up and I fired, the target on the other side would drop. None of us could compensate for the wind properly.

Michael Bush · « **Reply #37 on:** February 18, 2015, 10:28:37 am »

>The actual longest range sniper kill on record was a double by Corporal of Horse Craig Harrison of the Household Cavalry (British Army) in Helmand, Afghanistan, when he shot a Taliban machine gunner and then he killed the number 2, following which he put a round through their machine gun too, (to prove it wasn't a fluke) at a range of 2475m or 2707 yards. "

That might be the longest shot, but the most impressive one ever was Billy Dixon's at the second battle of Adobe Walls where he shot Quanah Parker off of his horse with a borrowed .50-90 sharps at 1,578 yards. That's a round nose lead bullet going about 1500 fps probably about a hold over of 12 feet for the elevation. Who knows what the windage was that day...

Dallasbeek · « **Reply #38 on:** February 18, 2015, 12:41:43 pm »

Quote from: Michael Bush on February 18, 2015, 10:28:37 am

>The actual longest range sniper kill on record was a double by Corporal of Horse Craig Harrison of the Household Cavalry (British Army) in Helmand, Afghanistan, when he shot a Taliban machine gunner and then he killed the number 2, following which he put a round through their machine gun too, (to prove it wasn't a fluke) at a range of 2475m or 2707 yards. "

That might be the longest shot, but the most impressive one ever was Billy Dixon's at the second battle of Adobe Walls where he shot Quanah Parker off of his horse with a borrowed .50-90 sharps at 1,578 yards. That's a round nose lead bullet going about 1500 fps probably about a hold over of 12 feet for the elevation. Who knows what the windage was that day...

Not that Wikipedia should be accorded much credence as a great authority, but the article there says Quanah Parker's horse was shot from under him at a range of 500 yards and then he was hit in the shoulder by a ricocheting bullet after Parker and a group of Comanches attacked buffalo hide merchants at or near Adobe Walls. Michael, can you give a source for the 1,578-yard claim? I know the Sharps was a powerful weapon, but that shot sounds like a buffalo hunter's saloon story, maybe.

Michael Bush · « **Reply #39 on:** February 18, 2015, 01:56:36 pm »

Try a search on google on:
billie dixon 1,578

and you'll get 5 million results... I won't bother listing them here... the distance was not only paced off at the time, but they marked the spot at the time and a surveyor measured it shortly after. It was verified and documented by many witnesses.

Dallasbeek · « **Reply #40 on:** February 18, 2015, 04:04:00 pm »

Okay, I found it, along with a story about replicating the shot with modern versions of the Sharps using smokeless powder more or less equivalent to the best black powder available to Billy Dixon. Of course, Dixon said he was shooting at a group of about 15 mounted Native Americans, so it wasn't precision shooting, but still impressive. Thanks.

Maggiesdad · « **Reply #41 on:** February 18, 2015, 07:12:16 pm »

I'll put Jerry M. up agin' all of 'em w a revolver!

Dallasbeek · « **Reply #42 on:** February 22, 2015, 05:18:25 pm »

Defense rested in the trial of the guy that killed Kyle. (I deliberately omit his name.) Prosecution wants to call two rebuttal witnesses. There may be a verdict this week. Lots of disagreement on whether he was insane. It's agreed that he has/had big time mental problems, but insanity is a legal question, not a medical (psyciatric) one, and that's the big question for the jury. He says he thought Kyle and Littlefield planned to kill him. But if he knew right from wrong, did thinking that constitute self-defense? Tough question for the jury. After my only murder prosecution, I never much trusted juries (I lost on self-defense claim)