Why did I feed pollen? Or I?d buy ice if I were Eskimo

[saltybluegrass]

So I get to seeing all you northerners feeding and preparing to feed for winter-
So I did too 3-4 inches wide strip - flat covers over 4-5 frames- gone in 14 days- they cleaned it out. Trouble I feel may be we are in midst of flowing and tons of pollen right now. 
What have I done to my hive? Make them lazy?
You really could sell me oil if I were a Saudi prince

[FloridaGardener]

As I understand it, some pollen is more nutritious than other types.  So the bees will take the best.

[Ben Framed]

As I understand it, some pollen is more nutritious than other types.  So the bees will take the best.

That seems reasonable, but brings up a question. If the bees collect both pollen patties form us along with natural pollen they collect from nature and therefore pick the one which is best, what do they do with the more undesirable stored pollen? Or for that matter, what do they do with all excess pollen collected that is not used?
Phillip

[Troutdog]

What ya need to sort is why your feeding g pollen.

I much prefer the dry feeders as if eliminates guess work.

Protein in brood out. If my total jelly is minimal in larval cells it's an indicatio  of a pollen shortage. Or nosema.

The northern strategy is to fill em up with syrup and then they  get tired of carb and balance it out with protein collection. The protein is what makes your fat winter bees. In the north it's the difference between a 3 month bee and a 7 month wiinter bee.
This also why treatment free has a higher rate of failure in the north as the mites suck on the fat and reduces their longevity.

All ya did was make a hygienic mess they will clean up. And throw a few bucks away if they dont consume it.
Cheers

[AR Beekeeper]

Ben Framed; 
Honey bees don't collect pollen based on it's nutritional value, they collect what is available.  When it is brought into the hive and placed in cells it is eaten by nurse age bees.  Any not eaten immediately is stored and used when fresh pollen is not being brought in.  The bees prefer fresh pollen over pollen that has been stored as bee bread.

Patties are eaten immediately and is not stored the way pollen supplement fed dry outside the hive is.  One reason patties are eaten immediately is the sugar content makes them attractive to the bees.

To know if pollen supplement is needed do as Troutdog says, look at the amount of food around the very young larvae.

[Michael Bush]

The only time I feed pollen is in a failed fall flow to make sure I get that last batch of young bees going into winter.

[Ben Framed]

Very enlightening, thanks for the explanations.
Phillip

[saltybluegrass]

Did you see any Texas A &M research regarding bees curing hives by bringing medicine in?
Are these 2 different things? I cannot find the specific paper but

[paus]

I was warned by an old bee keeper "Don't feed any pollen unless you have honey to go along with it, because they start raising brood and don't have enough honey to finish the job."  Makes sense and it did make me think.

[Ben Framed]

I was warned by an old bee keeper "Don't feed any pollen unless you have honey to go along with it, because they start raising brood and don't have enough honey to finish the job."  Makes sense and it did make me think.

Makes scenes Paus, but we better make sure they have plenty of both as I understand it. Through winter months they need protein as well as honey or syrup.  Pollen supplies their need for protein and honey their need for energy, (ability to create heat)?  These are both needed for winter survival? Is this correct?
Phillip

[paus]

Biology 101 all animals need protein (pollen) and carbohydrates (honey) for all body functions ie: energy.  You are correct, Ben.

[Ben Framed]

Biology 101 all animals need protein (pollen) and carbohydrates (honey) for all body functions ie: energy.  You are correct, Ben.

Thanks Paus

[van from Arkansas]

Feed feed feed if stores are low.  I feed both sub pollen and sugar as there is not much forage in this oak covered county.
Blessings

[Ben Framed]

Feed feed feed if stores are low.  I feed both sub pollen and sugar as there is not much forage in this oak covered county.
Blessings

Thanks Mr Van, I read you graph update earlier, I am impressed with the fast results!!

[TheHoneyPump]

You see or hear of the northerners feeding pollen patties simply because there is little to no forage late summer and fall.  In agricultural areas there will be near zero.  We do not feed to supplement or to feel good. We feed out of necessity for survival.
There are comments that bees do not store the patties.  My observations are that yes, they definitely do store it packed into the frames. .... if it is quality. 
The bees use and consumption rate of the patty is just like that of syrup.  If the sun is shining with good flight weather and natural sources are found the bees will ignore the patty.  Just like they ignore the syrup if they find a patch of flowers with nectar.  When weather is poor or the conditions out there are scarce forage, they will draw from the patties and the feeders ... and store it.
The only risk of feeding is if there is decent forage they will ignore the feed and the feed will spoil.  The risk of not feeding is the hive contracting and/or getting sick from nutritional stress or starving (death) when available forage is scarce.

Hope that helps!

[saltybluegrass]

Oh there?s no shortage of wild forage - I just get carried away spending money or wanting to interact with them.
They need their privacy - I?m trying to not peek in between inspection dates!

[TheHoneyPump]

Oh there?s no shortage of wild forage - I just get carried away spending money or wanting to interact with them.
They need their privacy - I?m trying to not peek in between inspection dates!

One of the best way to spend time with your bees is:   a comfortable camp chair set 6 feet away in front but off to the side about 45 degrees from the front of the hive.  Plus a cool beverage of course. 

[Nock]

If I remember correctly someone post about being careful with the patties during winter cause SHB love them.

[Michael Bush]

>If I remember correctly someone post about being careful with the patties during winter cause SHB love them.

This is a bigger issue when the weather is warm, like late spring or early fall.  It's getting a bit cold now.  At least here it is...

[Nock]

>If I remember correctly someone post about being careful with the patties during winter cause SHB love them.

This is a bigger issue when the weather is warm, like late spring or early fall.  It's getting a bit cold now.  At least here it is...

Ah. So during winter not so much. Gotcha

[van from Arkansas]

Yes Sir, the beetles luv pollen patties.  I use powder, substitute pollen in warm months.  Currently the air and ground is cooling so the small hive beetle are not such a threat.  So in summation I feed 2X sugar and substitute powder pollen as winter approaches.  My top deeps are full with only a single frame for the queen in most hives: so; no more feeding.

I did notice some hives going gang busters for the 2X sugar syrup whereas a few hives were not so interested????   After a quick look, the hives with little interest in syrup were full of capped honey/syrup.  So I surmise the bees can reason they have ample stores.  Do you agree?  I would like your input, thanks.

Van

[saltybluegrass]

I would assume so