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Author Topic: Just have to vent  (Read 2619 times)

Offline Twisted T

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Just have to vent
« on: May 31, 2017, 12:44:17 pm »
I'm a newbie and picked up my first two nucs on May 19th from what was supposed to be a reputable breeder. I got the nucs home and left them overnight before I placed them in their new home. When I opened the first nuc, I was thoroughly disappointed. There was only one frame of brood, a frame of honey and pollen and a frame with nothing but foundation and an empty feeder frame. The other nuc was the same way. To me they were both a very week start. I did see both queens and they appeared to be in good shape. I have been feeding them a 1 to 1 syrup in boardman feeders, and after the first week inspection both hives appear to still be very weak. It doesn't appear that they are drawing new comb. Any idea when I should start seeing any improvement? Any help on trying to get them in better shape would be appreciated. Thanks

Offline texanbelchers

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Re: Just have to vent
« Reply #1 on: May 31, 2017, 01:05:58 pm »
You got 3 frames and a feeder and they called it a nuc?  I hope you didn't pay more than $100 for them.  That being said, it is a start.  That is basically what I use to get a queen mated.

One week isn't much time for any changes, but there should be some.  Did you see eggs, all stages of larva (small to large) and capped brood?  Since you identified a brood frame, I'm assuming you can tell the difference between capped brood and honey.

Are they in a wood nuc box or did you move them into a larger box?  Medium or deep? pictures?  There isn't much to go on from your post.  At any rate, they should have the smallest entrance possible and not too much space to protect.

I have never used one, but (because) Boardman feeders have a bad reputation.  I would consider using the jar and cap inside the hive or over the inner cover to minimize issues.  Are they taking any syrup?

Offline Twisted T

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Re: Just have to vent
« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2017, 01:17:03 pm »
I got burned on the price :angry:

I did see larva and eggs, the queens appear to be trying. I transferred them to one deep for each nuc. I do have entrance reducers for each, I will put them on this evening. I guess it will just take some more time. They are taking the syrup.

Offline texanbelchers

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Re: Just have to vent
« Reply #3 on: May 31, 2017, 03:14:52 pm »
They should be ok in the larger boxes with small access.  Make sure you have all the frames inserted, that is 8 or 10 in the appropriate box.  If you have an inner cover you can set the feeder jar above the hole, place an empty super box around it and then your top cover.  If you have some screen material, you can cover the hole completely and put the jar above it.  That way you can refill the jar from behind without getting into the bees.

The queen will only lay enough eggs that can be handled by the existing nurse bees.  In the hive each bee has a task.  For example, if a bee is on nurse duty, it won't be drawing wax or clean house.  As the number of bees increase the overall numbers can increase exponentially.  This is one of the main benefits of a nuc over a package.  Generally you'll get more bees and they have already setup house.  You're most of the way there, it will just take time.

I know it is tempting, but give them a week or so between visits into the hive.  I won't say it interrupts them an exact amount, but it does distract them to some extent.  However, we can only learn so much from books and online and being in the hive is the best teacher, so don't just walk away.   :wink:

Offline Twisted T

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Re: Just have to vent
« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2017, 03:21:58 pm »
Thanks. I'm learning as I go.


Online cao

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Re: Just have to vent
« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2017, 04:28:22 pm »
That is basically what I use to get a queen mated.
Same here. 

Sounds to me that they should have waited at least 2-3 weeks at least to sell that as a nuc.  I think texanbelchers has given you good advise.  When you start with a colony that small, it takes a little extra time for them to get enough bees to do all the necessary tasks.  As long as they are growing and have fresh brood and food they should be fine.  Bee patient.  Bees do things at their own pace.

Offline Bush_84

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Re: Just have to vent
« Reply #6 on: June 01, 2017, 09:22:23 pm »
http://www.bushfarms.com/beesmath.htm

I reference this quite a bit. It gives you a good idea of what will happen in the future. I have also read that a frame of brood will emerge out to about three frames of bees. So these Nucs will take time to expand. If you don't have any capped brood in this nuc I would expect a couple weeks before you see much of a difference.
Keeping bees since 2011.

Also please excuse the typos.  My iPad autocorrect can be brutal.

Offline sc-bee

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Re: Just have to vent
« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2017, 09:58:27 pm »
Sounds too me like you only have two drawn out frames.... why put them in a larger box to protect?IMHO they should have stayed in the nuc box. They will build faster in the smaller space.

I hate when suppliers take advantage of newbees who do not know what to expect in a nuc. I have seen it multiple times this year  :angry:
« Last Edit: June 01, 2017, 11:13:17 pm by sc-bee »
John 3:16

Offline Captain776

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Re: Just have to vent
« Reply #8 on: June 02, 2017, 07:34:41 am »
Thanks. I'm learning as I go.

Everyone here, including myself has gone through and us still on a learning curve to some degree.

Lesson on NUC's:
When you go to pick them up, that is the time to have them show you frame by frame what they are giving you, then no surprise when you get home.
My first NUC, the kid working at Bee Farm showed me a few frames and the Queen and it looked great to my inexperienced eye.
After one month, I see a lot of bees but can't find a Queen and I wasn't seeing all stages of egg and Larvae.
The Bee Farm easily gave me a new Queen for free and that hive filled right out once I put the new Queen in.

When I bought NUC 2 and 3 together, the Owners wife came out to help us. 69 yo, looks like she is 50, been into the bees since she was young girl.
She showed me every frame, all stages of eggs v Larvae, honey, lots of capped Brood, and way more bees than I got in the first NUC.

Buying a NUC..........full inspection at the Bee Farm before paying, know what you are getting.
Bought my first NUC April 7, 2016.
Like all you when you first started, I am fascinated with beginning Beekeeping and trying to learn all I can.
I retired May 2015 and have added this to my short list of hobbies.

Offline BeeMaster2

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Re: Just have to vent
« Reply #9 on: June 02, 2017, 12:45:13 pm »
Very good point Captain.
My second nuc, the guy pulled out 2 frames together and put them straight in my box then he pulls out 3 frames and puts them in the box. I thought it was kind of odd and I found out why he did it on my first inspection. There were less than 3 frames of bees.
Jim
Democracy is 2 wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.
Ben Franklin

Offline Twisted T

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Re: Just have to vent
« Reply #10 on: June 02, 2017, 01:13:58 pm »
Thanks for the advice. I ordered these nucs back in October. Since then I have joined a local beekeeping club and have found a more reliable source for bees. On a brighter note, I have a swarm in a bait trap! (It is not from one of the new nucs :wink:)

Offline GSF

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Re: Just have to vent
« Reply #11 on: June 20, 2017, 01:41:02 pm »
When I sell nucs I separate the queen by an excluder in one super. Then when the new owners come we go frame by frame, if they are new I explain what they are seeing and what they want to see. Plus I take the donor hive and shake a ton of bees in there to boost the population. In addition, they are to call me for any reason or better yet email me.
When the law no longer protects you from the corrupt, but protects the corrupt from you - then you know your nation is doomed.

Offline Twisted T

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Re: Just have to vent
« Reply #12 on: June 20, 2017, 04:25:28 pm »
I wish you were closer GSF! Since I first posted this, the Nucs are doing great thanks to all the advice that was given. In addition to those two, I have also trapped two swarms in one of my traps and I am going to do a cutout of a hive that has taken up residence in a deer blind. From zero to five hives in two months, I'm learning fast! :grin:

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: Just have to vent
« Reply #13 on: June 21, 2017, 09:43:44 am »
It's always worth clarifying terms with someone selling a nuc.  People have different definitions...
My website:  bushfarms.com/bees.htm en espanol: bushfarms.com/es_bees.htm  auf deutsche: bushfarms.com/de_bees.htm  em portugues:  bushfarms.com/pt_bees.htm
My book:  ThePracticalBeekeeper.com
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Offline Rurification

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Re: Just have to vent
« Reply #14 on: June 21, 2017, 02:30:15 pm »
I wish you were closer GSF! Since I first posted this, the Nucs are doing great thanks to all the advice that was given. In addition to those two, I have also trapped two swarms in one of my traps and I am going to do a cutout of a hive that has taken up residence in a deer blind. From zero to five hives in two months, I'm learning fast! :grin:

That has happened to me, too from a reputable supplier.   One didn't make it, the other languished the first year, then built up gangbusters from then on.   Great queen that has allowed me 4 splits from it and a bunch of random frames of BIAS to boost other hives. 

Bees are not the easiest of pets to keep.   Steep and expensive learning curve.  [But then, most education is usually expensive.]
Robin Edmundson
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