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MEMBER & GUEST INTERACTION SECTION => THE COFFEE HOUSE ((( SOCIAL - ROOM ))) => Topic started by: Kathyp on August 30, 2021, 03:17:02 pm

Title: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on August 30, 2021, 03:17:02 pm
I debated putting this under an existing heading, but I think it might deserve its own space. 

https://dnyuz.com/2021/08/30/the-world-is-still-short-of-everything-get-used-to-it/

One of many articles.  Between drought, fires, locust infestation and floods...not to mention the pandemic, things are getting a little scary.  We are used to an excess of goods.  We should probably be planning for a scarcity of goods. 

Being a prepper had gotten a bad rep, but there are things that people can and should do to prepare for shortages (or storms).  People don't know how to grow stuff, or kill and prepare things.  They don't think about power being off for days or water not coming from the tap.

What prepper things are you doing? 



Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: ifixoldhouses on August 30, 2021, 03:31:14 pm
IF I told ya, Everyone would know what I've got :smile:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on August 30, 2021, 04:28:47 pm
Quote
IF I told ya, Everyone would know what I've got

LOL.  We could just describe methods and thoughts rather than specific stashes  :cheesy:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on August 30, 2021, 04:50:20 pm
IF I told ya, Everyone would know what I've got :smile:
My thoughts exactly.  :wink:  My family has been working toward becoming as self-sufficient as possible for some time.  We are nowhere near there yet, but we make a little bit of progress every year.  We have recently started sampling some meals from those long-term food storage places to see whether we'd like to purchase any.  Some of the stuff we have tried is pretty good, and some of it has been very bad. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: gww on August 30, 2021, 05:35:58 pm
I sorta prep but for a different type of fear then thinking things are going to go bad.  I do it to keep me from having to go back to the store any sooner then absolutely needed.  If I can match store prices closely, I will buy things I use every day in six months quantities shipped to me.  Like coffee and tobacco and such.  For only two people living in one house, I have an ungodly amount of refrigerators and freezers going.  Not the same as canned and dried but I do have enough solar to keep most of them going if that is all I tried to do with it.  I would get by for a while but think my chickens would struggle cause those suckers can eat.
Cheers
gww
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on August 30, 2021, 06:21:24 pm
 
Quote
The15thMember
My family has been working toward becoming as self-sufficient as possible for some time.  We are nowhere near there yet, but we make a little bit of progress every year. 

My family did that without knowing anything about prepping just our way of life. lol. We raised 3 hogs a year for country ham, sausage, pork chops etc, fed out at least one yearling beef for our own use, chickens for meat and eggs, ran trotlines for all the fish we would need for the next year, and a load of variety of vegetables from the garden.  The food always tasted so good and fresh when properly prepared for the freezer. Might need to go back to the basics simply for the food value?

Quote
The15thMember
We have recently started sampling some meals from those long-term food storage places to see whether we'd like to purchase any.  Some of the stuff we have tried is pretty good, and some of it has been very bad.
Modify message

Member have you and your family looked into a freeze dryer? I do not have one but did a little checking and I like the concept.



   
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on August 30, 2021, 06:27:19 pm
Quote
gww

I do have enough solar to keep most of them going if that is all I tried to do with it.

Gww I do not have solar panels and do not know a thing about them. Being you have been there and done that, do you have any helpful recommendations?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: gww on August 30, 2021, 07:34:02 pm
Ben
Probably one of the dumber things I have done though I was bored at the time and it was fun learning about.  If you want power when there is no power you can buy, it is really neat and works very well but at a price.  If you just want to save a little money on your bill, you might be able to do it if your electric company has rebates and you use them as your battery.  But then your power goes down when they go down.  A generator would work better for outages under normal situations.  If you get a battery big enough to really run stuff, it is a loser all the way compared to what I get electric for in my area.   The solar panels do great if you don't have shade and they give no issues.  The big charge controllers and inverters are expensive and can go bad in time though mine are still going, but you make yourself the electric company which means any problems are yours.

You will probably not buy enough to cover central air in your house unless you are super rich.  I will say this.  I can not run my whole house all night but have not lost power since 2013 when our power has went down.  I usually know when we lose power cause my tv in the basement goes out cause it is not on the circuit.  I could run an extension card but all the other tvs work and my computer keeps going and so I am usually to lazy to care.

We have not had power outages here during that time that last more then just a few hours and so I have been able to just keep trucking like nothing happened.   Doesn't seem like my electric bill has went down but I also am a nut and do nothing to conserve in any way but can run a lot of stuff for a short time with no power coming in.   

I had built a couple of wind mills and had them up but we don't have wind here and I took them down..  I did think it was interesting building them though and in the right place they would have helped but are much harder to control then solar which is great and easy as you don't have to find a place to put the extra power they make just to control them.

My final position though is that batteries suck and are expensive and in no way can beat what the power company can do unless you build in a place that is impossible to get power lines to.
Cheers
gww
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on August 30, 2021, 07:38:54 pm
My family did that without knowing anything about prepping just our way of life. lol. We raised 3 hogs a year for country ham, sausage, pork chops etc, fed out at least one yearling beef for our own use, chickens for meat and eggs, ran trotlines for all the fish we would need for the next year, and a load of variety of vegetables from the garden.  The food always tasted so good and fresh when properly prepared for the freezer. Might need to go back to the basics simply for the food value?
   
My mom was listening to a podcast the other day that was discussing this.  The one lady was saying how her grandmother wouldn't have viewed anything like this as "prepping", she would have called it "life".  We have certainly found out how much better home-raised food tastes, just based on the comparatively little that we do grow ourselves. 


Member have you and your family looked into a freeze dryer? I do not have one but did a little checking and I like the concept.

We have, and we are really liking the concept too.  It's pretty expensive, but we love the idea that we could freeze dry our own food (which is generally much more delicious than the prepackaged meals we've been sampling).  It's pretty expensive and bulky, and we're not sure if we have anywhere we could keep it, but it's something that is appealing to us. 

Quote
gww

I do have enough solar to keep most of them going if that is all I tried to do with it.

Gww I do not have solar panels and do not know a thing about them. Being you have been there and done that, do you have any helpful recommendations?
We have also been considering solar, but are unable to do so on our roof due to tree cover, which is making placement of panels a challenge.  There is a cleared piece of property adjacent to ours that we could potentially use if we purchased it, but as it is, we're not sure if we could really make it work or not. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on August 30, 2021, 07:43:10 pm
Thanks gww. We don't have much trouble here with electricity going out for usually more than the time you described. Hats off to the electric company. I was thinking more in line for a backup in case of one of those rare times that the power company 'might' go haywire. Hoping it would keep the freezer going until things could be repaired. You are right about batteries too. Have you priced a car battery latey? Wooo..
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: gww on August 30, 2021, 07:51:56 pm
Ben
In those types of situations I have to believe a generator would work cheapest.  Small solar for lights and a radio or something would work good for little used camping areas and such.  There is usually no sun on the days that the power goes out and so that means giant battery and giant solar to cover and does not happen often enough to be worth it.  Of course this is just my two cents.
Cheers
gww
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on August 30, 2021, 07:52:18 pm
Quote
We have, and we are really liking the concept too.  It's pretty expensive, but we love the idea that we could freeze dry our own food (which is generally much more delicious than the prepackaged meals we've been sampling).  It's pretty expensive and bulky, and we're not sure if we have anywhere we could keep it, but it's something that is appealing to us.

I know what you mean. I watched a couple videos and it looks like they are operated along with a standard vacuum pump. Something like we would use to pull a vacuum on an AC unit for recharging after repairs have been made. I can't seem to find enough basic information to build my own. I suppose mathletics would play a key role in the amount of vacuum needed per cubic square inch of frozen space involved? I do not see any reason, if a person knew the basics of operation and the mathematical formulas needed per such, should not be able to accomplish this goal of building their own? Beside that it should be a cakewalk?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on August 30, 2021, 07:58:09 pm
Ben
In those types of situations I have to believe a generator would work cheapest.  Small solar for lights and a radio or something would work good for little used camping areas and such.  There is usually no sun on the days that the power goes out and so that means giant battery and giant solar to cover and does not happen often enough to be worth it.  Of course this is just my two cents.
Cheers
gww

Yes you are right. Simply not worth the trouble for that need. I do have a 5500-6500 generator that I bought from Harbor Freight several years ago. So far haven't needed it for that purpose. Again tribute to a good electric company service. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: salvo on August 30, 2021, 10:21:44 pm
Hi Folks,

The simple activity of *canning* now casts shadow on you. This is from Facebook. They're watching. Always watching:

[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]

Sal
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: gww on August 31, 2021, 04:06:02 am
SAL
in a techno world and people being people, you can find haters on every subject.  You look and you might find haters tracking people who have a mole on their right side above their lip.  There might be a problem in this world but the problem is probably not canning but more people having a view on everything and others posting everything about their lives to be looked at.  Not saying good but just saying look down on the hating even if you have to accept it cause such is the world.  Not a thing that is bad enough to justify actions like the Unabomber took against tech.  We have computers and people just have to recognize there are idiots out there and ignore them.  Doubt the clock can be turned back by any means.

Funny thing thing about hate, nobody lives a perfect life but Jesus and everybody does something that will bother some one else and just cause that some one else is bothered, their being bothered does not add up to a majority of those being bothered.   Don't worry be happy.
Cheers
gww
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on August 31, 2021, 07:53:50 am
Phillip,
I put a 8K solar system on my barn roof. Part of the job was to connect the barn to the house and eliminate a $35 a month meter charge. That helps to make it pay for it. Bee careful buying solar systems that connect to the power grid. Most are designed so that they don?t work if you are running on a generator. They have to have power to turn on. Generators have high harmonics and they are designed not to turn on with a generator. I paid extra for my system to run with a generator. This allows the generator to run at idle with a load that is less than the solar systems output.
Jim Altmiller
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on August 31, 2021, 08:28:36 am
What prepper things are you doing?
I have two generators.  Both rely on fossil fuel so not really self sufficient.  The sensible thing for preppers to do is to get a horse and raise hay for the short term.  For the long term you would have to get a male and female.  Generators are more prevalent here in FL then where I came from but for emergency you need them more in the north.  When a storm hits the short supply runs out quick.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on August 31, 2021, 08:42:24 am
Being you have been there and done that, do you have any helpful recommendations?
This is so hilarious asking a republican for recommendations on a liberal topic.  Without taking a hand out from the government solar power is a net loss even here in FL.  You got to scratch your head.  DeSantis is giving out government money to his republican supporters for solar power systems.  Can you believe the irony?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on August 31, 2021, 12:34:15 pm
Being you have been there and done that, do you have any helpful recommendations?
This is so hilarious asking a republican for recommendations on a liberal topic.  Without taking a hand out from the government solar power is a net loss even here in FL.  You got to scratch your head.  DeSantis is giving out government money to his republican supporters for solar power systems.  Can you believe the irony?


I do not think gww being a republican or democrat has anything to do with it.  I ask him as one American which is a member here to another American who is a member here.
Stick to the subject.  :shocked: :cheesy:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on August 31, 2021, 12:59:55 pm
Does everything HAVE TO become so partisan with you guys??  Prepping has little to do with being Republican or Democrat.  Natural disasters and pandemics affect all alike, as does economic depression or governmental collapse.  In my opinion this thread is about smart strategies to have in place in case things like this occur, not who has the best policy to prevent them. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on August 31, 2021, 01:08:01 pm
Does everything HAVE TO become so partisan with you guys??  Prepping has little to do with being Republican or Democrat.  Natural disasters and pandemics affect all alike, as does economic depression or governmental collapse.  In my opinion this thread is about smart strategies to have in place in case things like this occur, not who has the best policy to prevent them.

Exactly! Thanks Member. This is a good topic subject, Let's not let the talk of politics ruin it. There are post here which distract from the subject. I will give allowance, allowing each time to voluntary modify, or voluntarily take them down themselves/ourselves.

Phillip
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on August 31, 2021, 01:12:07 pm
Quote
Does everything HAVE TO become so partisan with you guys??

Some people see everything through that lens.

Water was my big concern.  You can figure out how to do without almost anything except water. 

To that end, I have the usual storage containers, but I also had a hand pump put on our failing old well when we had a new one drilled.  It would get us by with the amount we could pump from it.

I am looking at those freeze dryers too.  I wish I knew someone who had used one of them because they are spendy!

Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on August 31, 2021, 01:24:14 pm
Quote
Does everything HAVE TO become so partisan with you guys??

Some people see everything through that lens.

Water was my big concern.  You can figure out how to do without almost anything except water. 

To that end, I have the usual storage containers, but I also had a hand pump put on our failing old well when we had a new one drilled.  It would get us by with the amount we could pump from it.

I am looking at those freeze dryers too.  I wish I knew someone who had used one of them because they are spendy!

I agree, water is number one. We are on a water well, and if no electricity, then no running water. The hurricane that just passed New Orleans has also passed here. Thankfully not much here. But again New Orleans is without power last I heard.

If solar panels were in place, and the sun was shining which is a good point made by gww; Wonder what kind of set up would be needed to run water, even if a short period each sunshiny day?  Would batteries be needed? The Well is 220.
Anyone here know?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on August 31, 2021, 01:37:50 pm
Phillip,
I put a 8K solar system on my barn roof. Part of the job was to connect the barn to the house and eliminate a $35 a month meter charge. That helps to make it pay for it. Bee careful buying solar systems that connect to the power grid. Most are designed so that they don?t work if you are running on a generator. They have to have power to turn on. Generators have high harmonics and they are designed not to turn on with a generator. I paid extra for my system to run with a generator. This allows the generator to run at idle with a load that is less than the solar systems output.
Jim Altmiller

Thanks Jim. There is a local company which sells 100 watt panels. Do any of you have any idea how many it would take to run a 220 water well, without battery backup, for short periods of time, long enough to flush toilets etc. Maybe then turning the well off and keeping the freezer cold? Or is this out of reach even if enough panels were incorporated? As I told gww, I don't know enough about this subject to amount to much help in my concerns..
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on August 31, 2021, 02:26:11 pm
ben you can put a hand pump on an exiting well.  I know someone who is getting this done.  It's not cheap, but less cost than the solar set up. 

To keep the animals watered would mean bringing them all down to the house and fencing, but I have the stuff to do it.  Just not sure I have the will  :grin:
In the end, they might all end up on the dinner table anyway. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: salvo on August 31, 2021, 02:29:52 pm
Hi Folks, Kathy,

Just a smile here. I'm very visual,... and literal.

You mention water,... then Freeze drier.

Freeze dried water! Simply add water.

btw; I too have a hand pump on a shallow well.

I'm also kinda in the sticks. No marauding bands of ne*er-do-wells on foot. I'd hate to be in a city.

OH! and I've got a good supply of lead,.... for shooting chipmunks and squirrelly things.

Sal
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: gww on August 31, 2021, 02:40:15 pm
Kathy
What it takes with your pump is five gal buckets and that will you were discussing.

Ben
running your existing well even short time means big battery and big inverter due to how much it takes at one time.  Might have been (?) sunny boy inverters that had the ability to invert strait from panel to inverter but was kinda new when I got out of keeping up with stuff and I could be wrong on name.  If you did not need to use your current well system, they do make water pumping only that may have smaller cost.  You may have no power even from solar with the right storm as it can be destroyed just like every thing else.  Doesn't pay to be to comfortable with our ideals but more just be flexible and fix problems as things happen.

I go with hand pump being safest route but nothing will cover every thing.
Cheers
gww
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on August 31, 2021, 03:03:45 pm
Hand pump is the safest bet, but also unpractical for me as my Deep Well situation for power loss of a few days. My Deep Water Well is equipped with all necessary inner parts, including the deep well pump attached to the feed line which runs all the way from the pump deep in the ground, inside the main well shaft, then incorporated to the house feed line. For a short period of time I would not want to temporarily pull the pump and lines plus electrical lines which is in the well shaft. This is why I am asking about alternative solar panels.

As you say, an act of nature can destroy a solar panel system. I hope we never have such a catastrophe. The last time of major outage here was the big ice storm on 94. Our power was out for a week.

Perhaps the mentioned generator may be the best and easiest alternative for short term outages? Still I am curious about solar panels.. Having an adequate supply of electricity may mean both generator on cloudy days and possibly solar on sunny days in an emergency? Especially if fuel such as gasoline is depleted?

I am not attempting to take away from you preppers point of view of long time needs. Carry on friends. lol 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on August 31, 2021, 03:05:16 pm
We have also discussed a hand pump for our well, but it's not something we've looked into deeply yet.  Our wellhouse is actually situated inside our main animal pasture, so it would be easy to water the animals from it by hand if need be. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on August 31, 2021, 03:08:01 pm
Yes or as Sal stated have a separate shallow Well with a hand pump for emergencies?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: gww on August 31, 2021, 05:00:59 pm
One thing a prepper should have a lot of is vinegar and plenty of containers to help with garden produce.
Cheers
gww
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: ifixoldhouses on August 31, 2021, 05:10:38 pm
I use 55 gallon rain barrels and a large life straw filter for my water plan.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on August 31, 2021, 05:27:33 pm
Prepping has little to do with being Republican or Democrat.  Natural disasters and pandemics affect all alike, as does economic depression or governmental collapse.  In my opinion this thread is about smart strategies to have in place in case things like this occur, not who has the best policy to prevent them.
Prepping has nothing to do with natural disasters.  We are a society that is totally dependent on electricity.  Mechanical generators are the simple answer for short term outages.  Living off grid is a very expensive endeavor not meant for someone with limited means.
A hand pump can only be put on a shallow well.  A shallow well gets contaminated in a flood.  A deep well will too if the casing is not higher then the flood water.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on August 31, 2021, 05:31:00 pm
Our wellhouse is actually situated inside our main animal pasture, so it would be easy to water the animals from it by hand if need be.
Watch out of e coli.  Not a really good idea.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on August 31, 2021, 06:07:10 pm
I grabbed this just as an example and research start point.

https://www.newlifeonahomestead.com/best-hand-pump-for-existing-well/

It can be expensive, but so are solar setups so if water is the main concern, the hand pump could end up being cheaper.

Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on August 31, 2021, 06:29:55 pm
Quote

Prepping has nothing to do with natural disasters.


That is your opinion and you entitled to it. At the same time please do not discourage others, especially those who rarely post here in the coffeehouse, from posting their valuable opinions and input on this interesting subject, with argumentative suggestions stemming from your own personal opinion of which 'unforeseen circumstances' may be relevant or irrelevant to preparing. Others may have a different opinion and outlook than yourself. May I suggest you start a new topic if you wish to argue your reasoning of which circumstances (has or has not to do with being prepared) such as "natural disasters"..  Perhaps you may title it:  "Prepping has nothing to do with natural disasters." In the meantime, please stay on the subject of this topic..

Thanks

Phillip



 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: salvo on August 31, 2021, 06:38:09 pm
Hi Folks,

Get healthy,.... and get juiced at the same time.

[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]

Sal
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on August 31, 2021, 06:54:21 pm
Quote
That is your opinion and you entitled to it. At the same time please do not discourage others

It was an inaccurate statement anyway.  Prepping does not have to mean going off-grid or building a bunker filled with non-perishables.  It should mean at the very least you are prepared to take care of yourself in an emergency.  The longer you can be self-sufficient, the better.

I said before that I was always amazed when I went on disaster assignments that so few were prepared for even a short period of time without services.  We never know what will happen.  Two of my families of relatives were in TX last winter.  It was an unexpected storm that caught a lot of people out.  We just watched the south get hammered again with a hurricane.  Solar flares, fires...SH. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on August 31, 2021, 08:08:02 pm
I grabbed this just as an example and research start point.

https://www.newlifeonahomestead.com/best-hand-pump-for-existing-well/

It can be expensive, but so are solar setups so if water is the main concern, the hand pump could end up being cheaper.
Good article, Kathy.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on August 31, 2021, 09:36:10 pm
Quote
I am looking at those freeze dryers too.  I wish I knew someone who had used one of them because they are spendy!

I wish I knew someone who had one that I could study kathy.. I do not think it would be that difficult to build one if we knew the formulas involved... Maybe even stepping up to a 7 cubic foot self made freeze dryer?
Anyone have any input about this?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on August 31, 2021, 10:22:25 pm
I grabbed this just as an example and research start point.

https://www.newlifeonahomestead.com/best-hand-pump-for-existing-well/

It can be expensive, but so are solar setups so if water is the main concern, the hand pump could end up being cheaper.
Good article, Kathy.

Yes an excellent article. Thanks from me as well. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on August 31, 2021, 10:49:50 pm
One thing a prepper should have a lot of is vinegar and plenty of containers to help with garden produce.
Cheers
gww

gww when I was a boy one of my best friend's Grandmother refused to can her vegetables on the kitchen stove. She had an old antique wood burning stove/oven that they would set up out under the big Oak Trees and would actually can all their vegetables using mason jars. I thought this was a neat thing to do. The whole family would 'come together' on canning day. They worked together while laughing and enjoying each others company, having a good ole time.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on September 01, 2021, 08:29:04 am
I grabbed this just as an example and research start point.
Why would you spend 5 grand on a hand pump when you could buy a generator for 300 and not lift a finger?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on September 01, 2021, 08:36:48 am
She had an old antique wood burning stove/oven that they would set up out under the big Oak Trees and would actually can all their vegetables using mason jars.
That is Okay in a water bath, not so good for a modern pressurized canner where you can't control the heat source.  Phil, have you ever done any canning yourself?
 At this point I am going to say don't go into home canning foolishly.  A lot of the old timers got sick from canning their own food because they made mistakes.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on September 01, 2021, 09:16:05 am
She had an old antique wood burning stove/oven that they would set up out under the big Oak Trees and would actually can all their vegetables using mason jars.
That is Okay in a water bath, not so good for a modern pressurized canner where you can't control the heat source.  Phil, have you ever done any canning yourself?
 At this point I am going to say don't go into home canning foolishly.  A lot of the old timers got sick from canning their own food because they made mistakes.


She lived to be a ripe old age and died of natural causes.  :cheesy:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on September 01, 2021, 11:59:25 am
I grabbed this just as an example and research start point.
Why would you spend 5 grand on a hand pump when you could buy a generator for 300 and not lift a finger?
Maybe you'd like to not rely on electricity in this area at all.  Or maybe you're worried about whatever kind of fuel the generator requires.  It's just another option.   

She had an old antique wood burning stove/oven that they would set up out under the big Oak Trees and would actually can all their vegetables using mason jars.
That is Okay in a water bath, not so good for a modern pressurized canner where you can't control the heat source.  Phil, have you ever done any canning yourself?
 At this point I am going to say don't go into home canning foolishly.  A lot of the old timers got sick from canning their own food because they made mistakes.
What an idyllic picture, Phillip!  I agree that lots of people on blogs and such don't know what they are doing where canning goes, and that can lead to unsafe products.  But as long as one uses reputable canning recipes, from places like Ball Canning and the National Center for Home Food Preservation, there is really nothing to worry about.  Obviously if you use your head, and your nose, and don't eat anything that potentially looks or smells off, I'd be pretty confident about it being okay. 

My mom has been doing a lot more canning this year than in previous years, and she's been really into trying different pickles, which I've been excited about since pickles are my actual favorite food.  She's made a bunch of different cucumber pickles, zucchini pickles, and dilly beans.     
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on September 01, 2021, 12:37:21 pm
Yes it was an idyllic picture member. This had been a family tradition for this family, and handed down since the early 1900s. I guess ole granny wanted to keep up the joy of the family tradition setting while enjoying the art of the old ways of doing it. While providing good wholesome food for her family.  Really, think about it. If there was no electricity ole granny would be well ahead of the pack! She knew how to survive with just the very basics and survive well!

:grin:




Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on September 02, 2021, 08:40:41 am
My mom has been doing a lot more canning this year than in previous years, and she's been really into trying different pickles, which I've been excited about since pickles are my actual favorite food.  She's made a bunch of different cucumber pickles, zucchini pickles, and dilly beans.     
Pickled products are much safer to can then meats and vegetables.  We all do it but smell is not a good test for tainted food.  By the time it smells bad it already looks bad.  The pop top is probably the best invention for can goods.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on September 02, 2021, 11:24:15 am
My mom has been doing a lot more canning this year than in previous years, and she's been really into trying different pickles, which I've been excited about since pickles are my actual favorite food.  She's made a bunch of different cucumber pickles, zucchini pickles, and dilly beans.     
Pickled products are much safer to can then meats and vegetables.  We all do it but smell is not a good test for tainted food.  By the time it smells bad it already looks bad.  The pop top is probably the best invention for can goods.

We never canned meat, we 'froze it'. I do not think my friends family mentioned earlier did either. It was vegetables for us. We always used the "pop" tops for the assured sure seal. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on September 02, 2021, 04:12:47 pm

We never canned meat, we 'froze it'.
Well then you are dependent upon electricity.  Down here people stock up for hurricanes but it requires a generator to keep the freezer going in the high temperatures.  Some will store ice for drinking water.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on September 02, 2021, 05:21:29 pm
Quote
Well then you are dependent upon electricity.

That's right Brian, as we were discussing earlier. This is the reason I was asking about running a freezer on solar panels without the need for batteries. Also power, direct from solar panels to a 220 well and or a freezer in times of an emergency where electricity is not available. Or times when electricity may not be available for extended periods of time.
As I told gww I do have a 5500-6500 generator but would also like to know if there is a solar panel metod sufficient enough, providing enough electricity to run the freezer for at least a couple hours a day and the well the amount of time needed to collect water and flush what needs to be flushed... etc.. Again without a battery.. Strictly emergency use only, if you will.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on September 02, 2021, 06:45:00 pm
How about a solar generator  :grin:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Geoff on September 03, 2021, 06:13:48 am
 
   You sure got a good topic rolling here Kathy. Looks like we will be rained in for a couple of days so I'll try and contribute !  !
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on September 03, 2021, 08:30:53 am
Phillip,
A new 20 CF freezer uses about 350 watts.  A one HP well pump uses 2 kw with a start up load of 4kw.
Setting up a 1kw system would bee very doable. You probably want a battery system to handle the well.
Jim Altmiller i
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on September 03, 2021, 08:43:24 am


That's right Brian, as we were discussing earlier. This is the reason I was asking about running a freezer on solar panels without the need for batteries.
Not possible.  You don't get a lot of sun during a hurricane better to go with a wind mill.  There are several ways to produce power using free energy from nature but all require a substantial investment.  Without a government hand out it will never pay for itself.  Which means it will never pay for itself it is just a question of who will pay.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on September 03, 2021, 08:46:02 am
How about a solar generator  :grin:
??? I will bite.  What is a solar generator and why would you use it?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on September 03, 2021, 08:54:07 am
I use 55 gallon rain barrels and a large life straw filter for my water plan.

That is not a bad idea, in fact if there was a sheer emergency this could make the difference in life and death. From what I understand lack of drinking water was a key problem in New Orleans during Katrina.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on September 03, 2021, 09:03:47 am
From what I understand lack of drinking water was a key problem in New Orleans during Katrina.
That is why people freeze ice.  Even if the freezer gets flooded the ice is protected in zip lock bags.  All types of exterior storage of water is susceptible to contamination during a flood.  No need to store water for flushing toilets in a flood they won't.  Best thing is to horde bottled water in high ground.  Even a tree.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on September 03, 2021, 10:04:01 am
Quote
That's right Brian, as we were discussing earlier. This is the reason I was asking about running a freezer on solar panels without the need for batteries.

Quote
Not possible.  You don't get a lot of sun during a hurricane

As discussed in the big picture of this topic; There may be different reasons, thoughts, and frames of mind why some folks may wish to be prepared. Emergency situations are one. It is not usually during an event such as a hurricane that you just mentioned, or an ice storm which has also been mentioned that have the need for emergency electricity. It is the aftermath. For example, the ice storm of 94 was late February. Although the damage was done, within a few days the sun was out shining and temps began rising, yet electrical power was out for a week at our residence. We were among the fortunate ones. Some lost power for weeks!

If 350 watts as mentioned by Jim for some type freezers then solar might work as per the specific questions asked earlier in reply 50?

Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on September 03, 2021, 10:35:59 am
How about a solar generator  :grin:
??? I will bite.  What is a solar generator and why would you use it?

Brian that was a joke. The solar panels do the generating and batteries store the (juice). If there really is a solar generator I?ve not heard of it.  :grin:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on September 03, 2021, 10:43:13 am
Take into consideration the moon rover and other solar assisted powered stuff we have had on the moon and are using on Mars. Technology is far advanced. To what extent could  this technology benefit us today in being prepared? Or off the grid as Member suggest?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on September 03, 2021, 11:59:06 am
Take into consideration the moon rover and other solar assisted powered stuff we have had on the moon and are using on Mars. Technology is far advanced. To what extent could  this technology benefit us today in being prepared? Or off the grid as Member suggest?
Space exploration has been the testing and proving ground for much of our technological advancement, and I'd imagine solar is no different in that respect.  There is no doubt that solar technology is better today than it was, say, 20 years ago.  Batteries too, which are usually a big bulk of the cost of a solar setup.  My family is particularly interested in the bi-directional charging of some of the new electric vehicles that are coming out, like the Ford Lightning.  That way you can use the truck for transportation and also as at least part of a battery array. 

Quote
That's right Brian, as we were discussing earlier. This is the reason I was asking about running a freezer on solar panels without the need for batteries.

Quote
Not possible.  You don't get a lot of sun during a hurricane

As discussed in the big picture of this topic; There may be different reasons, thoughts, and frames of mind why some folks may wish to be prepared. Emergency situations are one. It is not usually during an event such as a hurricane that you just mentioned, or an ice storm which has also been mentioned that have the need for emergency electricity. It is the aftermath. For example, the ice storm of 94 was late February. Although the damage was done, within a few days the sun was out shining and temps began rising, yet electrical power was out for a week at our residence. We were among the fortunate ones. Some lost power for weeks!

I think something that makes someone a "prepper" as opposed to someone who is prepared for an anticipated natural disaster, is that as preppers we aren't preparing for something specific.  I mean sure, we all have things we think are more or less likely to go wrong, for example if you live in an area with a lot of tornadoes, you are probably more prepared for those than you are for an EMP bomb, but I think prepping is really focusing on broad strategies to help you and your family (or whatever group you are with) survive some sort of temporary or semi-permanent disaster.  Thus we are attempting to live as self-sufficiently as possible, so that we could hopefully (to steal Doom and Bloom's slogan) "succeed if everything else fails".  And there are hundreds of things, some big and expensive, and some simple and easy, that one can do to work toward such a goal.  It's not about hording up supplies for an eventuality that may never come, it's about living in such a way that you have a chance of getting along without outside help if it's not available.                   
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on September 03, 2021, 12:46:56 pm
Yes I looked up the definition of "prepper" before I responded to Brians post which might have questioned the meaning of the word or what the word meant, as related to this topic. Considering post of different views and reasons of being prepared as posted in this topic. All the above you mentioned is covered and included.
I suppose we can take it as the once taught motto, (and may still be the motto?), of the of the Boy Scouts. "Be prepared"   I consider that slogan in itself to mean be prepared for anything which may come up in life. Be is specific or in general...    :grin: Thank you for your deep thoughts on this Member..

Phillip

Quote
I think something that makes someone a "prepper" as opposed to someone who is prepared for an anticipated natural disaster, is that as preppers we aren't preparing for something specific.  I mean sure, we all have things we think are more or less likely to go wrong, for example if you live in an area with a lot of tornadoes, you are probably more prepared for those than you are for an EMP bomb, but I think prepping is really focusing on broad strategies to help you and your family (or whatever group you are with) survive some sort of temporary or semi-permanent disaster.  Thus we are attempting to live as self-sufficiently as possible, so that we could hopefully (to steal Doom and Bloom's slogan) "succeed if everything else fails".  And there are hundreds of things, some big and expensive, and some simple and easy, that one can do to work toward such a goal.  It's not about hording up supplies for an eventuality that may never come, it's about living in such a way that you have a chance of getting along without outside help if it's not available.   
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on September 04, 2021, 09:23:34 am

I think something that makes someone a "prepper" as opposed to someone who is prepared for an anticipated natural disaster, is that as preppers we aren't preparing for something specific.               
Then everyone is a prepper.  We all buy food on a weekly or monthly basis.  People who are like yourself are usually referred to as off grid or self sustainable.  A "prepper" is someone that prepares for Armageddon.
Kathy even went so far as to use the term "crazy prepper" as the topic.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on September 04, 2021, 10:00:21 am
I do not think Kathy minds folks who prepare for whatever reason, posting here. Off grid, on grid, rain, snow, sleet or hail.  lol....Old ways of wood stove canning or new ways of freeze dried food. Water powered, solar powered, wind powered, and yes; even bicycle power electricity as Sal posted.  :shocked: :cheesy:  lol

So far it has been an interesting subject as noted by some who have said as much when posting, even as one member here as far away as Australia..... 

Perhaps you or others have more contributing ideas of ways to be prepared that have not mentioned?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on September 05, 2021, 08:54:02 am
May I suggest you start a new topic if you wish to argue your reasoning of which circumstances (has or has not to do with being prepared) such as "natural disasters"..  Perhaps you may title it:  "Prepping has nothing to do with natural disasters." In the meantime, please stay on the subject of this topic..
Phillip
Quote
I do not think Kathy minds folks who prepare for whatever reason, posting here. Off grid, on grid, rain, snow, sleet or hail.  lol....Old ways of wood stove canning or new ways of freeze dried food. Water powered, solar powered, wind powered, and yes; even bicycle power electricity as Sal posted.
So I take it some off topic topics are OKay?  Maybe Cider was right.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on September 05, 2021, 09:23:28 am
May I suggest you start a new topic if you wish to argue your reasoning of which circumstances (has or has not to do with being prepared) such as "natural disasters"..  Perhaps you may title it:  "Prepping has nothing to do with natural disasters." In the meantime, please stay on the subject of this topic..
Phillip
Quote
I do not think Kathy minds folks who prepare for whatever reason, posting here. Off grid, on grid, rain, snow, sleet or hail.  lol....Old ways of wood stove canning or new ways of freeze dried food. Water powered, solar powered, wind powered, and yes; even bicycle power electricity as Sal posted.
So I take it some off topic topics are OKay?  Maybe Cider was right.

prepper |ˈprepər|
nounchiefly North American
a person who believes a catastrophic disaster or emergency is likely to occur in the future and makes active preparations for it, typically by stockpiling food, ammunition, and other supplies: there's no agreement among preppers about what disaster is most imminent | whether you're a doomsday prepper or simply like to be prepared, emergency foods should be kept on hand.

It seems you will not be satisfied with anything less than getting off subject with argumentation..  This is at least the third time, I have directly or indirectly 'KINDLY' ask you for your cooperation in keeping this topic moving forward. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on September 06, 2021, 09:03:51 am
When a moderator has more new post per day than all other members the forum isn't a forum anymore.  I tried.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on September 06, 2021, 12:13:49 pm
https://generark.com/pages/solar-generator

This subject has interested me since I did Katrina.  I was shocked that people watched that storm come in for days and yet were so unprepared for the aftermath. They screamed and cried that no one was there to help them.  I get it.  They didn't know or care that no one could get in to set up and help them, and we all live with a false sense of security about getting help and services, especially if we live in cities.
 In later years, I found that most people are unprepared to spend even a few days without services.  This is especially true of people in urban areas.

I noticed that with this last hurricane they were telling people to be prepared to spend 72 hours without any help.  That's an improvement.  People need to know that instant help is not happening.  It is not enough. 

So...If people think about it a bit, they might begin to do those little things that will save them no matter what happens...short of getting nuked or something.   :grin:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on September 06, 2021, 12:15:16 pm
When a moderator has more new post per day than all other members the forum isn't a forum anymore.  I tried.

Brian I realize this topic is posted in the coffeehouse and in the coffeehouse, certain allowances are tolerated especially on political topics. However, this is not a political topic. In an unexpected breath of fresh air, we have had a variety of folks taking interest and posting on this subject who rarely post in the coffeehouse. This subject has been recognized by even Geoff from Australia as a good topic.

For you and others here at the coffeehouse argumentation of points of view have become habit for each of us who normally post here (including myself).
But: Taking the above paragraph into consideration, I have ask; " 'please' stay on subject" without the normal argumentation. Even still you are intent on getting off subject anyway, distracting from the subject with unprovoked, unnecessary petty argumentation by continued interruptions taking away from this unique subject, (by unintentional or intentional derailing the subject) Taking ALL the above into consideration; and realizing old habits are hard to break, 'with patience' I kindly I ask you at least '3 times' to please stay on subject. I think if one were to read the entire topic from start until end as you might have done. It would be clear I have been fair to you Brian, going as far as giving you allowance by suggesting; "If you wish to argue your point please start another topic"....

The reason for the sudden sternness in my last post there, stemmed from your previous post by challenging my abilities of being a fair moderator. In my opinion was not only 'out of line', but added further distraction at the same time, while indirectly challenging beemasters ability in picking a fair moderator. I think if you will go back and read the entire topic you or anyone else should clearly see that I had been 'kind' and more than 'fair' with you Ace.

In my opinion even in the coffeehouse, a certain amount of order should be maintained 'especially' on 'benevolent subjects'.. Continued argumentative behavior on 'non political subjects' will no less discourage others from posting in the coffeehouse on 'this type subject', causing damage or slow growth. I feel a certain responsibility in maintaining order on this unique type topic..  If you can not understand this Brian I do not know what else to say to you. I could have sent this to you privately but chose not to since you publicly have not let up. If you can not understand these thoughts, my attempt to reason with you I 'SUGGEST' you send a PM...............

Phillip

Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on September 06, 2021, 12:16:18 pm
https://generark.com/pages/solar-generator

This subject has interested me since I did Katrina.  I was shocked that people watched that storm come in for days and yet were so unprepared for the aftermath. They screamed and cried that no one was there to help them.  I get it.  They didn't know or care that no one could get in to set up and help them, and we all live with a false sense of security about getting help and services, especially if we live in cities.
 In later years, I found that most people are unprepared to spend even a few days without services.  This is especially true of people in urban areas.

I noticed that with this last hurricane they were telling people to be prepared to spend 72 hours without any help.  That's an improvement.  People need to know that instant help is not happening.  It is not enough. 

So...If people think about it a bit, they might begin to do those little things that will save them no matter what happens...short of getting nuked or something.   :grin:

Thank you Kathy. Some good stuff here!!!!
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on September 06, 2021, 01:30:41 pm
https://generark.com/pages/solar-generator

This subject has interested me since I did Katrina. 

Kathy you are more then welcome to do your research but I can tell you how it is going to end.  There is no battery anywhere that can power a house for a week that the average person can afford let alone a month.  Today and for many years to come that amount of energy storage will come from fossil fuel.  It is possible to do it with hydrogen cells but here again costs, availability and safety put it out of reach for the common man.  Solar cells only make sense if you live in an area that has strong sun rays and only if there is a grid to pump the excess into and draw when there is no sun.  They do cut dependency on fossil fuels but do not pay for themselves.
Wind power is more affordable mainly because you can build your own wind mill.  The electric gear required to attach it to the grid is still expensive.  And finally not all areas have enough wind to support a generation station on a personal basis.  Water power is even worse.
In conclusion if you were actually preparing for an emergency then I suggest you get a oil tank and fill it when the price is the lowest and then you can run your diesel generator for a month.  You can't be looking for fuel after the emergency unless you want to shoot it out at the gas station.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on September 06, 2021, 02:52:36 pm
There is no battery anywhere that can power a house for a week that the average person can afford let alone a month. 
This is true at the moment but it may not be for long.  This is from a booklet a solar guy gave us when he did an estimate on a system for us. 

"V2H stands for "Vehicle-to-Home". This capability will allow the EV (electric vehicle) to act as the home's back up power supply when the grid is down. Current wall mounted batteries like the Tesla Power Wall or the LG CHEM REUS10 can store about 10 kWh of electricity. The batteries in fully electric cars range from 50 kWh to 125 kWh of storage or 5 to 12 times more storage than the current home battery systems. . . .  Battery technology is rapidly advancing and prices are anticipated to follow the same trajectory as solar did over the last 10 years (80% reduction in installation costs)." 

According to this guy, bi-directional charging electric vehicles are the answer to the age-old battery problem in solar.  As I may have mentioned previously, the new Ford Lightning claims to be able to run an average house (at 30 kWh/day) for three days.   
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on September 06, 2021, 02:58:18 pm
Quote
As I may have mentioned previously, the new Ford Lightning claims to be able to run an average house (at 30 kWh/day) for three days. 


https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/companies/ford-f-150-goes-viral-after-providing-generator-power-to-texas-home-during-pandemic/ar-BB1dUlVT
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on September 06, 2021, 05:19:18 pm
As I may have mentioned previously, the new Ford Lightning claims to be able to run an average house (at 30 kWh/day) for three days.   
I don't put much faith in what a salesman tells me, and a car salesman...
What I can tell you is it will take about 15k watts to run my air conditioner.  That is full capacity of my whole house generator so I don't intend on using the generator to cool the house.  This miracle ford can run my air conditioner for 6 hrs/day for 3 days  and how many tanks of fuel will it take?  Where will you get the gas?  What is the price tag on this miracle ford? 
Let me give you some basic insight on energy transmission.  Every time you change forms of energy you lose some.  For instance going from mechanical to electrical or electrical to mechanical and even electrical to electrical.  Most likely going from the truck to the house there is an inverter involved.  There will be some switchgear involved too like all generator set ups to isolate the house from the grid so you don't kill a lineman.  So if a salesman is going to tell me this truck is going to power my house I would tell him bring his truck over to my house and lets see what it will do at what costs.
Technology hasn't changed much.  What has really changed is everything in made in china with no restrictions.  No concerns for pollution, no concerns for worker health and no concerns for safety.
If all this technology was made in America it would cost the same as it did when it was first invented here.  Ly-po cells were invented during the space race but deemed too dangerous to put on board a space ship so they went with Ni-cad technology.  If a car burns up or you phone or lap top burns up not quite the same as life support systems on a space ship.  I do not know what the plan is if this happens in an air plane today.  I know there was a time when you couldn't bring one.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: cao on September 06, 2021, 06:30:50 pm
My cousin has been looking into that ford truck and if I remember correctly the base model starts out at 45k, but to get one to power your house it is about 90k.  A person around here could buy a small house for that price.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on September 06, 2021, 06:40:52 pm
Quote
My cousin has been looking into that ford truck and if I remember correctly the base model starts out at 45k, but to get one to power your house it is about 90k.  A person around here could buy a small house for that price.

We were traveling this last weekend and looking at all the rec vehicles that people have.  Many are easily 90k +.  I can see how that truck would be attractive to people who spend a lot of time camping, etc.  The + would be that it would have other uses if the power went out.  I can't see many buying it as a substitute for a generator.
Interesting idea though and I expect we'll see quite a few of them around here.  Camping, fishing, hunting, boating, and other outdoor recreation are big things here in the few months we are not rained out. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: salvo on September 06, 2021, 07:01:21 pm
Hi Folks,

For work, I drove a Kia Soul for three years. We leased three of them, MSRP about 35,000 in 2018. One hundred mile range on a full charge,... in summertime, about 65 mile range in winter. All three needed battery change after a bit more than one year. Two needed computers to be re-worked over the three years.

We got Chevy BOLTS to replace them. Batteries subject to spontaneous combustion at high charge. Computers were modified to reduce charge limit. Fix is not good. We don't know what is going to happen. We're advised to not leave them plugged in for extended periods or when no one is around to notice the flames.

Mercedes has a new battery operated auto. Please see video:

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=mercedes+electric+ar+duracell+aa&&view=detail&mid=CB339026CB432DB7F73BCB339026CB432DB7F73B&&FORM=VRDGAR&ru=%2Fvideos%2Fsearch%3Fq%3Dmercedes%2Belectric%2Bar%2Bduracell%2Baa%26FORM%3DHDRSC3

Sal
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on September 06, 2021, 07:06:20 pm
I don't put much faith in what a salesman tells me, and a car salesman...
What I can tell you is it will take about 15k watts to run my air conditioner.  That is full capacity of my whole house generator so I don't intend on using the generator to cool the house.  This miracle ford can run my air conditioner for 6 hrs/day for 3 days  and how many tanks of fuel will it take?  Where will you get the gas?  What is the price tag on this miracle ford? 
It's not a gas-powered truck, it's all electric.  You charge the car with your own power, (grid, solar, what-have-you), and it acts as a battery.  The thing that is new about this technology is that not only can the battery power the car, it can also be used to power other things. 

Let me give you some basic insight on energy transmission.  Every time you change forms of energy you lose some.  For instance going from mechanical to electrical or electrical to mechanical and even electrical to electrical.  Most likely going from the truck to the house there is an inverter involved.  There will be some switchgear involved too like all generator set ups to isolate the house from the grid so you don't kill a lineman.  So if a salesman is going to tell me this truck is going to power my house I would tell him bring his truck over to my house and lets see what it will do at what costs.
Technology hasn't changed much.  What has really changed is everything in made in china with no restrictions.  No concerns for pollution, no concerns for worker health and no concerns for safety.
If all this technology was made in America it would cost the same as it did when it was first invented here.  Ly-po cells were invented during the space race but deemed too dangerous to put on board a space ship so they went with Ni-cad technology.  If a car burns up or you phone or lap top burns up not quite the same as life support systems on a space ship.  I do not know what the plan is if this happens in an air plane today.  I know there was a time when you couldn't bring one.
Quote
My cousin has been looking into that ford truck and if I remember correctly the base model starts out at 45k, but to get one to power your house it is about 90k.  A person around here could buy a small house for that price.

We were traveling this last weekend and looking at all the rec vehicles that people have.  Many are easily 90k +.  I can see how that truck would be attractive to people who spend a lot of time camping, etc.  The + would be that it would have other uses if the power went out.  I can't see many buying it as a substitute for a generator.
Interesting idea though and I expect we'll see quite a few of them around here.  Camping, fishing, hunting, boating, and other outdoor recreation are big things here in the few months we are not rained out. 
I'm not saying this is an end-all fix-all.  My family isn't running out and buying this truck and a solar array today.  The technology is brand new, so of course it's expensive and not yet tested in the field.  My point is that I think it could become a catalyst for making solar more feasible than it is currently.   
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on September 07, 2021, 08:57:20 am

Mercedes has a new battery operated auto. Please see video:

Hilarious.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on September 07, 2021, 01:23:59 pm

Mercedes has a new battery operated auto. Please see video:

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=mercedes+electric+ar+duracell+aa&&view=detail&mid=CB339026CB432DB7F73BCB339026CB432DB7F73B&&FORM=VRDGAR&ru=%2Fvideos%2Fsearch%3Fq%3Dmercedes%2Belectric%2Bar%2Bduracell%2Baa%26FORM%3DHDRSC3

Sal
:cheesy:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on September 09, 2021, 03:05:06 pm
Quote
As I may have mentioned previously, the new Ford Lightning claims to be able to run an average house (at 30 kWh/day) for three days. 


https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/companies/ford-f-150-goes-viral-after-providing-generator-power-to-texas-home-during-pandemic/ar-BB1dUlVT

This may be one of the trucks that Member mentioned? She also mentioned another one 'all electric'. Either way it would be nice to have some electricity in an outage situation.

Quote

The15thMember
It's not a gas-powered truck, it's all electric.  You charge the car with your own power, (grid, solar, what-have-you), and it acts as a battery.  The thing that is new about this technology is that not only can the battery power the car, it can also be used to power other things.

Your posted news article Kathy Title:

"Ford F-150 goes viral after providing generator power to Texas home during blackout"
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on September 09, 2021, 04:21:26 pm
Quote
As I may have mentioned previously, the new Ford Lightning claims to be able to run an average house (at 30 kWh/day) for three days. 


https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/companies/ford-f-150-goes-viral-after-providing-generator-power-to-texas-home-during-pandemic/ar-BB1dUlVT

This may be one of the trucks that Member mentioned? She also mentioned another one 'all electric'. Either way it would be nice to have some electricity in an outage situation.

Quote

The15thMember
It's not a gas-powered truck, it's all electric.  You charge the car with your own power, (grid, solar, what-have-you), and it acts as a battery.  The thing that is new about this technology is that not only can the battery power the car, it can also be used to power other things.

Your posted news article Kathy Title:

"Ford F-150 goes viral after providing generator power to Texas home during blackout"

The truck in the article is the F-150 Hybrid; the truck I was speaking of is the F-150 Lightning.
https://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/f150-lightning/2022/

In other news, my family has decided to get a Harvest Right freeze dryer.  My mom has been doing some more research on it, and we think it'll be worth the money.  Not only can we set aside some of our own food for long term storage, but it will also enable us to store food for convenience in a way that saves space and is shelf stable, so we can free up some room in the freezers.  For example, my mom will often make an extra casserole or lasagna and put it in the freezer for a quick and easy meal on days where we are busy or something unexpected prevented her from making supper, and freeze drying things that like will enable us to keep more on hand.  We will also be able to freeze dry our goats milk, which is currently taking up half of one of our freezers.  With the freeze dryer we will be able to store 1 gal. of milk in a quart jar.           
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on September 09, 2021, 06:34:43 pm
Quote
In other news, my family has decided to get a Harvest Right freeze dryer.

Ah, a test subject!!  :cheesy: Please keep us up to date on how it goes!

As for the truck, I'd rather have the hybred.  What good is an all electric truck if the power goes out no matter how you are using it?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on September 09, 2021, 07:29:00 pm
Quote
In other news, my family has decided to get a Harvest Right freeze dryer.

Ah, a test subject!!  :cheesy: Please keep us up to date on how it goes!
I certainly will!  If you are interested, we've been watching a guy on YouTube who has had one for a long time, and he posts how different foods turn out and tips for using it, and we've really been learning a lot about it from him.  His channel is called "Retired at 40--Live. Life. Simple."

As for the truck, I'd rather have the hybred.  What good is an all electric truck if the power goes out no matter how you are using it?
The hybrid definitely seems more versatile, but at the risk of re-opening a potentially contentious subject, we were particularly interested in the truck as part of a solar setup, and the Lightning has more battery capacity than the hybrid.  Our use for it would be mostly as a farm truck and as a battery for the house, so the more limited driving range wouldn't be much of an issue for our use.  I also saw that GMC is looking to include similar technology on the upcoming Hummer.  I was excited to see them resurrect the Hummer, I always thought they were cool.  Maybe we can get a Hummer with a pickup bed instead.  :happy:  I guess we'll just wait to see how the technology and pricing progresses in the next couple of years.     
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on September 09, 2021, 08:04:20 pm
Quote
The15thmember
my family has decided to get a Harvest Right freeze dryer.


Those things are amazing! I watched a video where they actually freeze dried ice cream!
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: salvo on September 09, 2021, 11:28:25 pm
Hi Folks,

Are you guys going here? It's long, but it touches on lots of stuff.

https://www.theorganicprepper.com/another-lockdown-get-prepared/

Sal
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: salvo on October 03, 2021, 09:30:33 am
Hi Folks,

Preppers! Beware!

https://www.thedailybell.com/all-articles/news-analysis/new-facebook-warning-are-you-concerned-that-someone-you-know-is-becoming-an-extremist/

SAL
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on October 04, 2021, 08:44:27 am
I also saw that GMC is looking to include similar technology on the upcoming Hummer.
Another useless vehicle to electrify.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on October 04, 2021, 09:06:57 am
I also saw that GMC is looking to include similar technology on the upcoming Hummer.
Another useless vehicle to electrify.

Brian what have you found about electrification of the hummer that qualifies it as being useless?





Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on October 04, 2021, 01:03:56 pm
Quote
https://www.thedailybell.com/all-articles/news-analysis/new-facebook-warning-are-you-concerned-that-someone-you-know-is-becoming-an-extremist/

On a happy note, Facebook is down all over the world.

https://downdetector.com/status/facebook/   :cheesy:

Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on October 04, 2021, 06:28:47 pm
They probably got hacked and are being held for ransom.
Jim Altmiller
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on October 04, 2021, 07:29:46 pm
Quote
They probably got hacked and are being held for ransom.

One can only hope.  Funny thing is that it was international and all FB sites.  Whatever happened it was big and fast.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on October 05, 2021, 08:48:43 am

Brian what have you found about electrification of the hummer that qualifies it as being useless?
Over sized, over weight.
The point of electrification is to reduce our carbon footprint on the world.  Taking a gas guzzler and making it electric doesn't do that.  We really don't need to pit the oil companies against the green movement.  All that is needed is to tax vehicles by weight.  If the tax is high enough people will make the right choice.
We are being told that USPO will be more expensive and take longer as they transition from air to ground transportation.  A step in the right direction but not nearly enough.  Rail is the most efficient form of transporting goods.  But this country has invested nothing in rail infrastructure.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on October 05, 2021, 09:48:03 am

Brian what have you found about electrification of the hummer that qualifies it as being useless?
Over sized, over weight.
The point of electrification is to reduce our carbon footprint on the world.  Taking a gas guzzler and making it electric doesn't do that.  We really don't need to pit the oil companies against the green movement.  All that is needed is to tax vehicles by weight.  If the tax is high enough people will make the right choice.
We are being told that USPO will be more expensive and take longer as they transition from air to ground transportation.  A step in the right direction but not nearly enough.  Rail is the most efficient form of transporting goods.  But this country has invested nothing in rail infrastructure.

Brian, how did you transport the materials needed for the remodel of your home? It is doubtful they magically floated from the local building supplier to your home? lol 😬 I rather doubt you trailered them with your car? Most likely a pick-up truck. That is how I see most folks doing it at lowes.  With a simple lightweight trailer, you could have enjoyed the comfort of a hummer to transport your materials instead.
Do you ever look for facts before you post? You really should. Some unsuspecting reader might believe your bunkum. Member is correct and spot on when she says GM will soon come out with an electrified version of this same H3. Which can be used as an aid for herself and her family, providing extra electricity during an emergency if she decides to make the purchase. So really the hummer is not useless at all....... 

According to
Motor Ask:

"The Hummer H3 now has a fuel economy rating similar to other midsize SUVs.
It comes with 16 mpg (city) and 20 mpg (highway), making it one of the most fuel-efficient vehicles in its class.Reports are emerging that General Motors is planning to release the Hummer EV sometime in 2021. This Hummer model will be fully electric, meaning car buyers won't need to judge it based on its gas mileage."



 




Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on October 05, 2021, 09:58:44 am
Quote
The15thmember
my family has decided to get a Harvest Right freeze dryer.


Those things are amazing! I watched a video where they actually freeze dried ice cream!


Member how are things progressing with the freeze dryer?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on October 05, 2021, 10:57:08 am
Member how are things progressing with the freeze dryer?
My mom actually hasn't ordered it yet, but she is planning to, maybe this week if she has time.  My sister's birthday was last week so we were really busy.   
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on October 05, 2021, 11:12:02 am
What taxing by weight would do is not encourage people to "make the right decision" but punish people who need to have the heavier vehicle.  It already costs more to run most of those heavy vehicles, so most people don't own them unless they need them or can afford the extra cost.  In the first case, those would be people who farm, tow heavy stuff, do construction work, etc.  In the second, a sin tax on a vehicle would not matter.  They can afford the cost.

My state already tried this with recreational vehicles.  Not that they wanted them off the road, but they saw another source of revenue by increasing the tag tax.  People who could afford the vehicles in the first place paid the extra and there were no fewer rec vehicles on the road. 

since we can usually find examples of things already tried, it's a good idea to look for those first and figure out if they were effective and who was really hurt or helped by the change.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on October 06, 2021, 08:31:14 am

It comes with 16 mpg (city) and 20 mpg (highway),
These are laboratory numbers.  No one actually gets these results

Quote
I rather doubt you trailered them with your car?
I have a minivan and yes I trailered long and heavy supplies with an equipment trailer.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on October 06, 2021, 08:50:35 am
It already costs more to run most of those heavy vehicles, so most people don't own them unless they need them or can afford the extra cost.  In the first case, those would be people who farm, tow heavy stuff, do construction work, etc.  In the second, a sin tax on a vehicle would not matter.
You have to be joking.  There are more jacked up Super Duties here in FL then there are republicans.  Stretched out wheel base and oversize tires that make the vehicle useless on the farm.  First of all I was thinking pleasure vehicles not commercial vehicles.  When there is a need there is a need but these abortions are just for joy riding.  No one that spends 80 grand on a vehicle puts a 2x4 in it.  My step daughter has a make believe Jeep.  If you put that on wet grass it would get stuck.  Anything that needs moving I get a call.
Quote
My state already tried this with recreational vehicles.  Not that they wanted them off the road, but they saw another source of revenue by increasing the tag tax.  People who could afford the vehicles in the first place paid the extra and there were no fewer rec vehicles on the road. 
CT has had a luxury tax as long as I can remember.  The only thing they did wrong was allow someone that lives in CT to register a vehicle in another state.
States need revenue to combat climate change.  Many states don't have this tax and those that do have too low a rate.  Most use book value but they should use weight.  Weight tears up tires and consumes energy.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on October 06, 2021, 09:28:19 am
Ace,
Why do you want to stop climate change? The earth has been going through climate change for 4.5 billion years. The relative position of the earth to the sun and the suns output has far greater effects on our planet than we do. One volcano can put out enough dust and gasses to block out the sun and change the climate for a year or 2.
Carbon dioxide is a small fraction of the elements in the air. On the other hand water vapor is a large percentage of our air and can drastically change our temperatures but you never here Environmentalist complain about water vapor. Why is that?
Jim Altmiller 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: paus on October 06, 2021, 10:32:07 am
Light bulb just lit.  Lets start a water vapor bank like some of our climate change advocates started a carbon bank.  Another thing , ELECTRIC cars what do you think is used to "reliably " power generators to make the electricity.  Then consider line loss , transformer loss, charger efficiency loss battery charging loss , etc, etc,  Example 55,000 Btu are used mostl diesel to produce one gallon of ethanol which contains 38,000 btu.  We have some real genus that figured that out
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on October 06, 2021, 11:05:24 am
Quote
Ben Framed 
I rather doubt you trailered them with your car?


Quote
Acebird
I have a minivan and yes I trailered long and heavy supplies with an equipment trailer.

I hope you are not serious! Do you have any idea how dangerous it is to haul heavy loaded trailers with a mini-van with trailer in tow? !!!   Not only does this endanger yourself, but innocent motorists and their families! Why do you think they make heavier vehicles? I will tell you. For Hauling Long and Heavy Loads!!
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on October 06, 2021, 02:22:36 pm
Carbon dioxide is a small fraction of the elements in the air. On the other hand water vapor is a large percentage of our air and can drastically change our temperatures but you never here Environmentalist complain about water vapor. Why is that?
Jim Altmiller 
That is a really good point, Jim.  I have never thought about that before.

Quote
Ben Framed 
I rather doubt you trailered them with your car?
Quote
Acebird
I have a minivan and yes I trailered long and heavy supplies with an equipment trailer.
I hope you are not serious! Do you have any idea how dangerous it is to haul heavy loaded trailers with a mini-van with trailer in tow? !!!   Not only does this endanger yourself, but innocent motorists and their families! Why do you think they make heavier vehicles? I will tell you. For Hauling Long and Heavy Loads!!
What's the big deal, Phillip?  My father hauls stuff like construction supplies and hay and his John Deere mower all the time with his trailer and our Suburban.     
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on October 06, 2021, 05:06:04 pm
> What's the big deal, Phillip?  My father hauls stuff like construction supplies and hay and his John Deere mower all the time with his trailer and our Suburban.   

There is a great difference in a suburban and a mini Van when it comes to load capacity.  No comparison. A Chevy suburban is made to pull heavy loads safely if desired.  A mini Van is not. It is about safety.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on October 06, 2021, 05:22:22 pm
@ The15thMember

Just a small sample of reasons why it is a big deal. .

https://auto.howstuffworks.com/auto-parts/towing/towing-capacity/information/truck-tow-over-capacity.htm
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: gww on October 06, 2021, 05:29:02 pm
I have owend minivans since they came out in 1987.  They can come with towing packages for a reason.  For a couple of years it was my only truck with a trailer.  You can over load anything but there is zero wrong with using a mini van to haul lots of stuff using a trailer.
Cheers
gww
Ps Many times the only differrence as far as the law is concerned on over loading a truck comes down to how much you are willing to pay for a liesence plate.  If you buy the lowest you are over loaded at 12,000 lbs if you pay the price 25,000 is not over loaded.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on October 06, 2021, 05:39:53 pm
>You can over load anything but there is zero wrong with using a mini van to haul lots of stuff using a trailer.

True I have seen motor cycles pulling trailers. Loads within limits are fine and goes without saying. Aces description of long heavy hauling with a mini-Van is the reason I posted a response. Safety first is always a good choice. Don?t you agree?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: gww on October 06, 2021, 07:23:48 pm
ben
Quote
Don?t you agree?
Not always.  I hauled a bunch of logs to a saw mill and took the back roads and and would have been mad if a cop pulled me over to infource the letter of the law.  Yes I realize if I had been on a crowded interstate and disrupting traffic or having to go over speed to not disrupt traffic the law may have been needed to be inforced.  Most people do what they have to do using what they have to work with.  Common sense can be a rare thing but usually rules when applied.  The same argument you put forth is used for talking on the phone though I would argue eating while driving would be just as bad.  The same argument can still be made on how poeple use oa on thier bees and even more so before it was made an approved treatment.  Yet those that needed to use it cause it worked did not look down on the practice.  No, I do not go always with safety first as others see it when I myself am the one that will pay any price for mistakes but more try to use situational common sense for the things I am facing and do what I think I have to.
Cheers
gww
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on October 06, 2021, 08:21:03 pm
Not always is an answer I can relate too gww considering your explanation. Living out in the country and gravel roads when I was a kid, we did the same sort of thing on those backwoods gravel roads of home. Back then the roads were so narrow, we had to stop to let another car pass, so 15-20 Mph was tops. I don?t know what Ace was doing in his city environment. Maybe he added the heavy long load pulled by a mini-Van in exaggerated terms to make a prideful point to counter criticizing Members hummer stuff. lol. Most likely he will say his load was within safe limits. If not I will be surprised! 😊
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on October 07, 2021, 10:13:37 am
Light bulb just lit.  Lets start a water vapor bank like some of our climate change advocates started a carbon bank.  Another thing , ELECTRIC cars what do you think is used to "reliably " power generators to make the electricity.  Then consider line loss , transformer loss, charger efficiency loss battery charging loss , etc, etc,  Example 55,000 Btu are used mostl diesel to produce one gallon of ethanol which contains 38,000 btu.  We have some real genus that figured that out

Since this topic has began its turn towards politics, (thanks to Ace), I might as well put my two cents in on this as well.lol....

Thanks Paus and Jim, that is science. It?s a shame we have such dummies In charge of the future of America. Coal use in America has been burned at a lot cleaner rate than the old days of just releasing it into the atmosphere which is a real energy boost with a abundantly great supply here in America.  When I was in school the definition of energy was the ability to do work. Cripple energy and cripple the ability of America to prosper. That is just what this President and his squad has done. He has crippled energy in America while other countries are literally going full steam ahead.  America last agenda or policy?
Sad



Ace,
Why do you want to stop climate change? The earth has been going through climate change for 4.5 billion years. The relative position of the earth to the sun and the suns output has far greater effects on our planet than we do. One volcano can put out enough dust and gasses to block out the sun and change the climate for a year or 2.
Carbon dioxide is a small fraction of the elements in the air. On the other hand water vapor is a large percentage of our air and can drastically change our temperatures but you never here Environmentalist complain about water vapor. Why is that?
Jim Altmiller 

True there has been the ice age, the tropical age etc.




Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on October 07, 2021, 12:19:27 pm
Phil this is what I said
I have a minivan and yes I trailered long and heavy supplies with an equipment trailer.
Long supplies like framing lumber and drywall, heavy supplies like fill, sand and stone, mulch.  If you overload any vehicle you will most likely burn out the brakes.  Truck manufacturers tout about horsepower of the engine but it is the brakes that will get you is trouble.  I am sitting here laughing at you going off the deep end.
Thanks Paus and Jim, that is science.
Far from it.  Neither one and including you have no scientific background or credentials to contradict what real scientist have been warning us about.  When they first sounded the alarm no one listened.  It has taken a while and now we have seen some of the predictions come true.  There aren't as many naysayers as there used to be but a lot of the misinformation still continues.

There is a world of difference between generating power at the power plant vs, using a home generator.  People who go off grid train themselves to use much less energy otherwise they couldn't afford it.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on October 07, 2021, 12:36:06 pm
When I was in school the definition of energy was the ability to do work.
I teach two of my younger sisters science in homeschool, and we just happen to be studying thermodynamics right now.  Your education serves you well, Phillip, as I can confirm that energy is still defined as the ability to do work.  Here is the answer key to the worksheet they were doing just yesterday.  :cheesy:
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]

People who go off grid train themselves to use much less energy otherwise they couldn't afford it.
This is absolutely something my family has been focusing on in recent years too.  We really pay attention to using less hot water, turning off lights, and we are considering getting some more energy efficient appliances at some point.  We are also in the process of replacing all the windows in the original areas of the house.  Our house has several more modern additions that were put on by the previous owner, but the old windows are from the 60's and don't seal well.       
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on October 07, 2021, 12:39:55 pm
Quote

If you overload any vehicle you will most likely burn out the brakes.  Truck manufacturers tout about horsepower of the engine but it is the brakes that will get you is trouble.  I am sitting here laughing at you going off the deep end.


Exactly, that?s one scenario burning out the brakes. There are other factors involved in heavy hauling, sway being another which may lead to loss of control of the vehicle. There are other reasons which I will not continue to try and explain. Laugh on said the ant to the grasshopper. Until the grass hopper realized he wasnt prepared for trouble. I hope this doesn?t happen to you with your heavy hauling of such materials as you described with your minivan. I?m not advocating or promoting your decisions. But in the least use a trailer with trailer brakes. If not for the safety of yourself, for the safety of others.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on October 07, 2021, 06:42:31 pm

Quote
Thanks Paus and Jim, that is science.

Quote
Far from it.  Neither one and including you have no scientific background or credentials to contradict what real scientist have been warning us about.  When they first sounded the alarm no one listened.  It has taken a while and now we have seen some of the predictions come true.  There aren't as many naysayers as there used to be but a lot of the misinformation still continues.

I suppose you are a environmental scientist Ace? Where did you obtain your degree? LOL 😂 Yes the misinformation continues alright. Funny how you believe the scientist that best suits your agenda while you disregard the opposing debating world of renowned scientist. Thought you do not acknowledge, there are scientist who say global warming is far stretched to say the least. Jim is right, one eruption of a super volcano will put the world into a environmental winter. What is it that Paus reported that is incorrect?   

Apparently your hero is not overly concerned; "Former President Barack Obama and his family have completed the purchase of a $11.75 million waterfront house situated on nearly 30 acres on Martha's Vineyard ? an affluent island located south of Cape Cod in Massachusetts. And it is stunning." While he waste thousands of gallons of jet fuel traveling from to and fro.

Apparently you are not overly concerned either. You could not wait to get to sunny Florida, playing follow the leader when Mr Trump did the same, made the move to Florida. lol   :wink:
And what about the folks in Florida, fishermen etc, who was scared out of their whits when Al Gore made his predictions of flooding of beach front property. I suppose you did not hear of the folks who marked water levels on piers and docks during high and low tide and after all these years and claim the sea level has not rose one inch! 

While we are at it lets not forget the unseasonably mild winter weather experienced last year caused by global warming? especially in Texas. No burst pipes I suppose? :tongue:

"But I still luv-you Ace"    lol  :cheesy:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on October 08, 2021, 10:33:22 am
there are scientist who say global warming is far stretched to say the least.
If they are truly scientist that make this claim they have a right to convince their peers that they are right.  So far that hasn't happened.  I am not a scientist and have to choose which theory makes sense to me.  In the mean time I find it humorous to make fun of someone who has made it their life's work or occupation having nothing to support your conviction but Google.
Southern Florida is basically the Everglades dried out and developed by entrepreneurs making it a tourist attraction and a retirement community.  While the polar caps are melting I find it odd that people that live on the coast complain that they get flooded time and time again from just a normal FL rain and claim this never happened years ago.  I don't know who you know down here but I don't think they are given you an accurate account of what is happening.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on October 08, 2021, 10:45:14 am

Quote
Southern Florida is basically the Everglades dried out and developed by entrepreneurs making it a tourist attraction

Well no wonder Brian.  :cry:

https://youtu.be/wkpi5bAfVUc




Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on October 08, 2021, 09:21:12 pm
Ace,
The places that flood due to wind is not about the seas rising as you inferred, is about building on land that is so close to sea level that the water doesn?t have enough drop off to allow it to drain through long pipes that empty into the ocean. In San Marco, the oldest section of Jacksonville, for as long as it has existed, they have been complaining about drainage. Most neighborhoods are only a few feet above the river and it is close enough to the ocean to bee tidal water. If the oceans were rising, San Marco, like Miami, would bee under water.
Jim Altmiller
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on October 08, 2021, 09:34:54 pm
Today, Judy and I visit the Ack Encounter in Kentucky. It is massive and build according to the specifications in the Bible.
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]

They have lots and lots of scientific data on display to help prove that the ark existed. One of charts shows the history of the earth?s temperatures over the centuries.
Here it is:
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
As you can see, our climate has been in constant change long before man could have any effect on it.
If you get the chance, try to visit the Ark Encounter.
Jim Altmiller 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on October 09, 2021, 09:38:45 am
The chart is outdated.  Doesn't go far enough.
https://climate.nasa.gov/scientific-consensus/
As you can see the temperature is up to 1 degree C and rising at an unprecedented rate.  Over and above what your chart has recorded in past history.
Details matter.
To deny what is happening is like burying you head in the sand.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on October 09, 2021, 12:23:29 pm
Weather has, is, and always will be changing. We have solar eclipse for one example that have an effect on weather that can explain the changes you refer to for example. Under normal circumstances these patterns are constantly changing. It's impossible to take a solar flare or eclipse, which the effects of, may indeed reach the earth's atmosphere and bring forth a few years of temporary, noticable change from the normal or average if you will, temperatures. Especially in a short span of a hand full of few years, compared to the long range chart of millions of years, that is undeniable.

If you are really concerned perhaps these same scientist, which squall and squawk, should stop shooting bruning, gaping holes through the delicate ozone layers of the earth's protective atmosphere with rockets?  :cheesy:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on October 09, 2021, 06:25:14 pm
Weather has, is, and always will be changing. We have solar eclipse for one example that have an effect on weather that can explain the changes you refer to for example. Under normal circumstances these patterns are constantly changing. It's impossible to take a solar flare or eclipse, which the effects of, may indeed reach the earth's atmosphere and bring forth a few years of temporary, noticable change from the normal or average if you will, temperatures. Especially in a short span of a hand full of few years, compared to the long range chart of millions of years, that is undeniable.
This is a common misconception, but solar eclipses and flares have no long term effects on larger temperature patterns and only negligible short term effects. 

Solar eclipses actually have nothing to do with the sun itself at all, it's simply the sun being temporarily blocked from view by the moon.  Solar eclipses cause a slight drop in air temperature when they are occurring, since the sun is often partially obscured for several hours, but the eclipse only effects a tiny swath of the earth.  The moon's shadow cast onto the earth is only about 100 miles broad, so the area of the earth that is affected by this very brief, very minor temperature change is very small.  (We were fortunate enough to see the total solar eclipse in 2017, and it was one of the most amazing things I have ever or will ever see.)   

Solar flares are caused by the sun ejecting an abnormally large amount of energy from a section of the sun.  These energy bursts sometimes do reach the earth, but they are usually not in the wavelength of visible or UV light, the primary way the earth is heated by the sun.  Solar flares are usually mostly x-rays and magnetically charged particles.  The earth's magnetic field captures the particles, which cause spectacular auroras during solar flares, and while the x-rays can sometimes cause trouble for satellites and high altitude polar airliners, neither of these things affects weather or temperature to any real extent.   

If you are really concerned perhaps these same scientist, which squall and squawk, should stop shooting bruning, gaping holes through the delicate ozone layers of the earth's protective atmosphere with rockets?  :cheesy:
   
The ozone hole is whole other controversy.  I remember my high school science teacher talking about how the ozone hole was only discovered when satellites became sophisticated enough to detect the ozone layer, and the hole was already there.  We don't really know that it hasn't always existed.       

As interesting as this conversation is, we are getting kind of off topic here.  Could this climate change section of the thread be moved to a different thread?  I don't think it should be deleted or anything, it's a good discussion, but not sure it belongs here. 

Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on October 09, 2021, 07:44:57 pm
Yes the topic started going astray with politics, "again", about 19-20- post ago and sort of progressed from there. I simi-gave up since no one complained. I will go through this topic sometime tonight or tomorrow when we are not so tied up at my home per your legitimate request Member.

Phillip 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on October 10, 2021, 09:51:41 am
https://photos.app.goo.gl/zwbzhUcnQ1L5GvBk6
Saw this on FB this morning.  This is what a prepper needs not an electric Ford.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on November 01, 2021, 01:53:40 am
Some of you might like this idea for your shop..


https://youtu.be/1RRLcIAgd-M
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 12, 2021, 02:42:07 pm
Our freeze dryer finally arrived a few days ago!  My mom and I spent a good portion of yesterday unboxing it and getting it all set up.  We are running our test cycle right now.  The manual recommends you try out moist bread in the machine first, just to be sure everything is working properly and to get the manufacturing smell out.  So far it's been extremely user friendly.  Everything came well packaged and labeled, and the manual is really detailed and actually in print, as opposed to digital, which I always prefer.  We're really excited about it!   
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Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: gww on December 12, 2021, 02:52:06 pm
I like hard copy instructions as well.
Cheers
gww
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 12, 2021, 02:57:05 pm
I am glad to see you have this Member, you will be the first person that I know that has one of these. Keep us updated...

Thanks, Phillip
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on December 12, 2021, 08:05:27 pm
Member,
I?m also very interested to hear how it works out, how good the food taste, and is it worth getting.
Jim Altmiller
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on December 13, 2021, 08:48:33 am
Member,
I?m also very interested to hear how it works out, how good the food taste, and is it worth getting.
Jim Altmiller
I think an astronaut has to give up the taste of good food.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: CoolBees on December 13, 2021, 03:33:21 pm
Our freeze dryer finally arrived a few days ago!  ...

Now this is something I've been wanting to get into. The units I've looked at are pricey but worth it - once you have a good food supply tucked away - should something "happen" to society. The foods I've tasted out of a freeze dryer, were quite good.

Combining a good freeze dryer with a good vacuum sealer seems like a winning combination. This is the vacuum sealer that I have - https://www.vacmasterfresh.com/vacmaster-vp215-best-selling-commercial-chamber-vacuum-sealer/ ... I just don't have the freeze dryer - yet ...

Please let us know how it works for you 15th.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 14, 2021, 06:29:02 am
Quote

The foods I've tasted out of a freeze dryer, were quite good.

I have not tasted any, but this is my understanding also.The freeze dried food not only retains its nutritional values, but its taste as well.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on December 14, 2021, 09:42:11 am
I love freeze dried fruit. We buy it in small packages. They taste great.
Jim Altmiller
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on December 14, 2021, 11:29:35 am
Quote
I love freeze dried fruit

MRE fruit brick   :cheesy:

Please keep us updated and some pics too.  This is on my list.  Already have a good vacuum machine and use it a lot! but if the freezer/power dies, the food dies.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: cao on December 14, 2021, 11:47:00 am
There is a lady down the road a ways that has started a business with one.  She sells lots of freeze dried stuff at craft fairs and farmer's markets.  She said her biggest seller is freeze dried skittles.  At $5 for a 2 oz bag, you could pay for that machine pretty quick.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 14, 2021, 03:20:38 pm
Quote
I love freeze dried fruit

MRE fruit brick   :cheesy:

Please keep us updated and some pics too.  This is on my list.  Already have a good vacuum machine and use it a lot! but if the freezer/power dies, the food dies.
It's true.  The other motivating factor for us was space.  There's only so many places in the house/garage where another freezer can go.  But it's nothing to put up another shelf somewhere for storing shelf-stable food. 

There is a lady down the road a ways that has started a business with one.  She sells lots of freeze dried stuff at craft fairs and farmer's markets.  She said her biggest seller is freeze dried skittles.  At $5 for a 2 oz bag, you could pay for that machine pretty quick.
We are really excited to try candy, we hear it's really good! 

Blueberries are on sale at the store this week, so we may try those as our first real batch.  I'll let everyone know how they turn out. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 14, 2021, 09:17:38 pm
So I'll give you guys a blow by blow of our first try with the freeze dryer, since there seems to be a lot of interest.  We've got blueberries, banana slices, and some old previously frozen raspberries.   
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The machine pre-cools the chamber for 15 minutes before you put the food in.  Now that it's in, it will freeze the food down to -10F.  This will probably take a few hours.  (The color on this picture is a little weird because I had to use the flash.) 
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Once the food is down to that temp, the machine will automatically turn on the vacuum pump and suck essentially all the air out of the chamber.  Next it will start the drying phase.  Based on our test with the bread the other day, at this point it will alternately warm and cool the chamber to get all the moisture out of the food.  This is the longest phase of the process, and may still be going on tomorrow morning.   

Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on December 14, 2021, 10:07:33 pm
Member,
Thanks for the update.
How large is the freezer unit. That is a major factor for us.
Jim Altmiller
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 14, 2021, 11:12:03 pm
Awesome! Thanks 15th, looking toward to more updates as the program unfolds!
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 14, 2021, 11:26:55 pm
Member,
Thanks for the update.
How large is the freezer unit. That is a major factor for us.
Jim Altmiller
We have the medium which is 18 in. wide, 29 in. tall, and 21 in. deep.  You also need room for the vacuum pump to sit next to it.  We have ours in the pantry.  The only issue with placement so far is that the machine makes the room really warm, which makes the it less efficient, so we have the door propped open to help with the air flow.  We're thinking of getting a fan in there somehow to help circulate the air, and Mom's planning on rearranging so the more perishable food isn't right next to the warm freeze dryer.  Here's a picture from the doorway, so you can get a better sense of the size. 
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Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: CoolBees on December 15, 2021, 12:11:09 am
Wow - that unit it a lot smaller than the one I was looking at. The one I saw was about 6' tall & 30" wide - free standing.

Pls keep us updated. I'm definitely interested in the results.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on December 15, 2021, 08:22:54 am
It is pulling out moisture so plumb the exhaust from the vacuum pump to the outside.  The moisture will also make all the box goods stale and shorten the shelf life.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 15, 2021, 11:17:06 am
It is pulling out moisture so plumb the exhaust from the vacuum pump to the outside.  The moisture will also make all the box goods stale and shorten the shelf life.
It actually doesn't expel the water as vapor into the air.  The machine has a condenser, which liquefies the water pulled out of the food, so when the cycle is finished, you just open the drain valve and drain the water into a bucket.  It doesn't make the room damp, only warm, and that's only because we have it in a very small room.  The vacuum pump itself heats up quite a bit, but I doubt the machine would noticeably raise the temperature of a larger room. 

When I checked on the freeze dryer this morning, the drying cycle was close to complete.  You can see the drying time on the screen, as well as the total cycle time in the corner.  I'll let you all know when the food is done.
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Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 15, 2021, 03:38:08 pm
It's done!  The total cycle time was 18 hrs., 13 min., 13 sec.  All three fruits taste really good!  The bananas and the blueberries even improved in flavor, and the raspberries stayed about the same.  The consistency of the berries is like a puffed cereal, and the banana is a little denser.  The raspberries are visually indistinguishable from before, the bananas got just a little bit brown, and some of the blueberries busted open.  Also, the blueberries weren't very good quality, a lot of them were mushy, and the mushy ones didn't really work; they just deflated into little mushy skins.  The nice firm blueberries worked great though, even the ones that broke open. 
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Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 15, 2021, 03:42:56 pm
Awesome! Have you decided what your next go-round will be? (What type of food). Thanks for the update!
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 15, 2021, 03:45:11 pm
Awesome! Have you decided what your next go-round will be? (What type of food). Thanks for the update!
Actually yes, we're doing yogurt drops and ice cream sandwiches.  :smile:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 15, 2021, 03:55:49 pm
Here they are all jarred up.
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Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: gww on December 15, 2021, 05:51:44 pm
As I am sure you could not resist trying them, how did they taste?
Cheers
gww
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: CoolBees on December 15, 2021, 05:57:30 pm
That's really awesome!!!
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on December 15, 2021, 07:58:33 pm
They look great. I may yet get one. 😊
Did you use a vacuum sealer on the jars?

Jim Altmiller
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 15, 2021, 08:08:57 pm
As I am sure you could not resist trying them, how did they taste?
Cheers
gww
I actually mentioned it in reply #143, but they were all great.  I can't wait for breakfast tomorrow to put some on my oatmeal.

They look great. I may yet get one. 😊
Did you use a vacuum sealer on the jars?

Jim Altmiller
No, we actually don't have a vacuum sealer for jars (yet).  But even if we did, we're going to use this batch up pretty fast, so it didn't seem necessary to do anything to help preserve them beyond just jarring them up.   

Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on December 16, 2021, 08:12:25 am
The fruit doesn't even look close to dry.  I think you should sacrifice a jar and not open it for 6 month to see if something deteriorates.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 16, 2021, 11:12:44 am
The fruit doesn't even look close to dry.
Ok, are you referring to the blueberries that are deflated?  Because I did say that those didn't work.  If we wanted to fully dry them, we'd have left them in the machine longer, but if we had, we would have been only left with little crispy blueberry skins, and we didn't see the point in that, so we tossed the bad ones to the chickens.  If you are referring to all the fruit as a whole, you are just wrong.  All three fruits are completely dry.  If you tap on them with your finger it sounds like they are made of plaster, and if you crush one up, it's nothing but powder.  Unlike in a dehydrator, the food from a freeze dryer won't look much different than when it went in; it won't shrivel up or anything like that. 

I think you should sacrifice a jar and not open it for 6 month to see if something deteriorates.

We'll get to long term storage soon, but this is literally our first try with this machine.  If we were going to store it for months at a time or longer, we'd put it in mylar with an oxygen absorber or use a vacuum sealer. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 16, 2021, 11:37:44 am
Last night's batch was done this morning when I got up.  We did ice cream sandwiches and yogurt drops, and this batch took 10:42:03.  Here's some pictures of how they look.  (My artist sister went a little overboard with piping out the yogurt!  :cheesy:)  Both taste really good, although the vanilla ice cream in the sandwiches is a little less flavorful than before.  The yogurt drops are exactly like the ones you can get in the store.  We also tried rehydrating some of the yogurt, and it went back to being yogurt that was almost indistinguishable from how it was before we freeze dried it. 
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Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: gww on December 16, 2021, 12:22:58 pm
Seems funny storing ice cream on a table top don't it. :grin:
Cheers
gww
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 16, 2021, 02:04:38 pm
Seems funny storing ice cream on a table top don't it. :grin:
Cheers
gww
It's totally strange.  Your brain just can't totally comprehend that it's not going to be cold when you bite into it.  :grin:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: CoolBees on December 16, 2021, 02:40:53 pm
Looks like some great Christmas candy gifts.  :grin: Nicely done!
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on December 17, 2021, 08:26:47 am
If we were going to store it for months at a time or longer, we'd put it in mylar with an oxygen absorber or use a vacuum sealer.
If it is not for long term storage then what is the point, unless you want to live on cookies?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 17, 2021, 10:51:26 am
If we were going to store it for months at a time or longer, we'd put it in mylar with an oxygen absorber or use a vacuum sealer.
If it is not for long term storage then what is the point, unless you want to live on cookies?
Why are you not actually listening to what I'm saying?  You literally cut out of my quote the answer to your own question. 

We'll get to long term storage soon, but this is literally our first try with this machine.  If we were going to store it for months at a time or longer, we'd put it in mylar with an oxygen absorber or use a vacuum sealer. 
Obviously the purpose of the machine is for long term storage, and obviously we are not planning on living on cookies.  We are just starting out experimenting with the machine, and it's going to require some trial and error, and part of that trial and error is eating the food that comes out of it. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 17, 2021, 11:48:06 am
If we were going to store it for months at a time or longer, we'd put it in mylar with an oxygen absorber or use a vacuum sealer.
If it is not for long term storage then what is the point, unless you want to live on cookies?
Why are you not actually listening to what I'm saying?  You literally cut out of my quote the answer to your own question. 


The15thMember don't take it personal. Ace is also a avid arguer.  :cheesy: If there is one thing he loves more than bees, it's arguing! It doesn't matter if he is right or wrong. He doesn't let a little thing like that stand in his way, (no ma'am), just as long as he can get a little gab our of you.    :shocked: :wink: :cool: 

And what better place to stir up a little foray than here at the coffeehouse in the morning?.... :wink: :cool:  You got to love him! Bless his heart...   :grin:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 17, 2021, 01:13:34 pm
The15thMember don't take it personal. Ace is also a avid arguer.  :cheesy: If there is one thing he loves more than bees, it's arguing! It doesn't matter if he is right or wrong. He doesn't let a little thing like that stand in his way, (no ma'am), just as long as he can get a little gab our of you.    :shocked: :wink: :cool: 

And what better place to stir up a little foray than here at the coffeehouse in the morning?.... :wink: :cool:  You got to love him! Bless his heart...   :grin:

I must admit, I got a good laugh out of it, because his insistence to be negative about something that everyone else has been finding so positive was just so ridiculous.  Only someone who truly loves arguing for arguing's sake would continue on the same path so heedlessly.  I won't pretend to understand the sick pleasure he gets from his trolling, but each to his own I suppose.  :wink:     
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXtoEFcPkbM
 :cheesy:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: CoolBees on December 17, 2021, 04:04:39 pm
So - I have a curious question: What would happen if you freeze-dried honey?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 17, 2021, 04:15:52 pm
So - I have a curious question: What would happen if you freeze-dried honey?
My sister asked that too, and I'm not exactly sure, but there would be no point in it, as honey is already shelf-stable basically forever.  But just for curiosity's sake, if honey is approximately 18% water, and you took all that water out, what would happen to it?  My guess would be it would become extremely viscous.  I wonder if the sugars would come out of solution, and if it would crystallize?   
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 17, 2021, 04:27:22 pm
You two have introduced an interesting twist. To be successful in the process honey would first have to freeze completely in order to be freeze dried. Or would it? Will honey become completely frozen at that temperature?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: cidersabuzzin on December 17, 2021, 04:46:28 pm
I think a post went astray or even diverted....just saying :wink:
Sorry iddee :smile:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 17, 2021, 04:54:10 pm


I think a post went astray or even diverted....just saying :wink:

Well I saw your name at the bottom of who's online and I though I would take a pick at you hoping for a response. But I rethought the post I made, and took it down, as I did not want to take a chance of offending you...  Sincerely I say; Merry Christmas Old Friend!!

Phillip
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 17, 2021, 05:08:03 pm
Quote
I think a post went astray or even diverted....just saying :wink:
Sorry iddee :smile:

Oh don't worry about iddee, he has been posting here behind your back. lol  :wink: :shocked:  You did not break the pact you two made together to leave, HE DID lol :wink: 

PS, But Im glad he did. It would not be the same in the coffeehouse without you 'two' rascals , Remember 'One' did not make the show or a team. It was the 'Three' Stooges' who made the 'team' and the show a success !!

One more PS
Merry Christmas to you too iddee! :grin:





Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 17, 2021, 05:10:55 pm
The15thMember,  We have strived in keeping this particular topic, on topic. I am sure to hear from Ace on this. I promise we will get back on track... (it may take a post or two) :wink: Thank you for your patience!

Phillip
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: CoolBees on December 17, 2021, 06:02:55 pm
Regarding freeze-dried honey - I've no idea if it would work - but little "honey cubes" would be cool.  :grin: Anyways ... just thoughts ....

(I gotta get me one of those machines ... I'd be trying to freeze-dry everything - maybe even the cat ...  :shocked:)  :cool:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: CoolBees on December 17, 2021, 06:03:56 pm
Regarding freeze-dried honey - I've no idea if it would work - but little "honey cubes" would be cool.  :grin: Anyways ... just thoughts ....

(I gotta get me one of those machines ... I'd be trying to freeze-dry everything - maybe even the cat ...  :shocked:)  :cool:

... or a bunny ... Definitely a bunny!  :cool: :cool: :cool:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 17, 2021, 06:07:58 pm




> Regarding freeze-dried honey - I've no idea if it would work - but little "honey cubes" would be cool.  :grin: Anyways ... just thoughts ....


A Good thought too cool! I would love to have freeze dried honey as well!... What a treat! Maybe Reagan will make a go at it just to see what happens?



> (I gotta get me one of those machines ... I'd be trying to freeze-dry everything - maybe even the cat ...  :shocked:)  :cool:

 :shocked:  I'm with you Alan!  (excluding the cat)! lol
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 17, 2021, 06:10:40 pm
If honey would work. I would think sorghum would as well, or it should?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 17, 2021, 07:24:06 pm
The15thMember,  We have strived in keeping this particular topic, on topic. I am sure to hear from Ace on this. I promise we will get back on track... (it may take a post or two) :wink: Thank you for your patience!

Phillip
It's fine.  I know what I'm getting into when I post down here.  There's always going to be some off-topic yik-yaking in the coffee house.   :grin:

Regarding freeze-dried honey - I've no idea if it would work - but little "honey cubes" would be cool.  :grin: Anyways ... just thoughts ....

(I gotta get me one of those machines ... I'd be trying to freeze-dry everything - maybe even the cat ...  :shocked:)  :cool:

... or a bunny ... Definitely a bunny!  :cool: :cool: :cool:
I'm just going to ignore the comment about the cat. . . . :angry:  :wink:  :cheesy:  But we'll definitely be freeze drying some rabbit really soon, so I'll give you the juicy (or I guess not juicy, since it's dried  :cheesy:) details on that one. 

So I did some looking about honey and it's as I suspected.  Honey is a supersaturated liquid, basically meaning that it has so many solids (in this case sugar) dissolved in it that under normal circumstances it would already be a solid.  For example, if you tried to stir sugar into water to make the solution only 18% water, it would never work, because you have WAY more sugar than water.  As a result honey doesn't ever technically freeze, it just gets more and more viscous as the temp. lowers.  Now it does undergo a glass transition at about -50F, where the molecules would rearrange and the honey would cease to flow, but I don't know if the freeze dryer goes that low (the preset freeze temp is -10F for the freeze cycle, although you can change it).  The other thing is that substances like honey that form amorphous solids, or "glasses", have different properties, so I'm not sure how the honey would react to the drying process even if you could get it to form a glass, and I'm not sure what would happen to it once the temperature rose again.

Edit: I just thought of another reason why this would be especially pointless.  So if I were to freeze dry liquid Kool-Aid, the machine would suck all the water out and I'd be left with the powder I started with, which if I added the right amount of water to again, would turn back into Kool-Aid.  Well if I freeze dried the honey, and was left only with the sugar solids that are in the liquid honey, I could never rehydrate the honey and get it back to the way it was, because it's supersaturated.  This would mean that by freeze drying it, I'd essentially be permanently diluting it if I wanted it liquid ever again.  And if not, I'm left with dry sugar, which I could have just purchased at the store from Domino.  (Not literally, as it's not cane sugar, but you get the point.) 

Also obviously this process would probably destroy any of the delicate flavors and enzymes that make raw honey so good.           
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: CoolBees on December 17, 2021, 11:50:37 pm
15th: what you, and your family, accomplish is amazing. ... as for freeze-dried cat and/or bunny ... I'm going to wait to respond. ... until I'm "sober" ... and they are dipped in chocolate.  :shocked: :cheesy: :cool: :cool: [Hehehe ... you know what I think about "rabbits"  :cool: :cool:]

P.S. - I looked at the calendar, and guess what day it is? It's "pick on 15th day" (expires in 4 hrs on the left coast). I've been waiting all year for this day! :cool:. Freeze dry me a bunny? ... a little one? ... dipped in chocolate?  :cool: :cool: :cool:

... on a serious note, all jokes aside: I love what your doing with the freeze dryer. Pls keep posting - very important education there. ..

 Thanks again. CB.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 18, 2021, 12:03:02 am
15th: what you, and your family, accomplish is amazing. ... as for freeze-dried cat and/or bunny ... I'm going to wait to respond. ... until I'm "sober" ... and they are dipped in chocolate.  :shocked: :cheesy: :cool: :cool: [Hehehe ... you know what I think about "rabbits"  :cool: :cool:]

P.S. - I looked at the calendar, and guess what day it is? It's "pick on 15th day" (expires in 4 hrs on the left coast). I've been waiting all year for this day! :cool:. Freeze dry me a bunny? ... a little one? ... dipped in chocolate?  :cool: :cool: :cool:

... on a serious note, all jokes aside: I love what your doing with the freeze dryer. Pls keep posting - very important education there. ..

 Thanks again. CB.
:cheesy:  Don't worry, I'm from a big family, I can take a good ribbing for one day out of the year!  :cool:  :cheesy:  I'll have to check with the chef on the chocolate request, but we are planning on trying out freeze drying the leftovers of that sweet and sour rabbit we had the other night that you commented about on the cooking thread.  The food is shelf stable after all, maybe I could sneak a portion over your way!  :wink: :cheesy:  I do know how you love those bunnies, cute and delicious!   :tongue:   
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on December 18, 2021, 05:29:39 am
Member,
I recommend that you try freezing some honey. My daughter bought me some dried cactus honey. It was in a powder form. I suspect it was freeze dried. It kept its flavor.
Jim Altmiller
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on December 18, 2021, 07:45:11 am
So - I have a curious question: What would happen if you freeze-dried honey?
My sister asked that too, and I'm not exactly sure, but there would be no point in it, as honey is already shelf-stable basically forever.
Hey we agree!  For the rest of it I prefer natural foods in their natural state so I would never freeze dry my food for any reason.  For the most part they are just high priced toys.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 18, 2021, 11:13:15 am
Member,
I recommend that you try freezing some honey. My daughter bought me some dried cactus honey. It was in a powder form. I suspect it was freeze dried. It kept its flavor.
Jim Altmiller
I looked up powdered honey because of your comment, and now you that mention it, I remember some of the long term food storage companies selling it.  (I kind of glossed over it because we would never have needed to purchased any.)  Apparently most powdered honey is simply heat dried, not freeze dried, which I guess makes sense, since the honey doesn't need to be frozen to preserve it through the drying process.  Apparently some people like powdered honey because it can be used in baked goods in the same ratio as dry sugar in recipes where the extra water in the honey would be a problem, and it's also used in some cosmetics because the powdered honey doesn't make the final product sticky.  Maybe I'll run a batch through the machine just for science sometime.  :rolleyes:  Although, to use Ace's term, I think I'd prefer to leave my honey in its natural state.  :happy: 

   
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on December 18, 2021, 12:22:05 pm
Quote
Hey we agree!  For the rest of it I prefer natural foods in their natural state so I would never freeze dry my food for any reason.  For the most part they are just high priced toys.

For most of the history of the world people were forced to buy food in its "natural state".  Food poisoning of one kind or another was common.  There was no way to preserve food, so people starved when harvests were not good and game was scarce.  I am guessing that you don't actually eat food in its natural state and that you have both a refrigerator and freezer along with some canned and dried goods. 

When I look at what I have, my question is "How long will this last if there is no other source of food?".  Freeze drying seems like a reasonable way to extend not only the varieties, but the shelf life.

Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: gww on December 18, 2021, 02:22:23 pm
Kathy
See, we do agree sometimes.
Cheers
gww
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: salvo on December 18, 2021, 03:53:33 pm
Hi Folks,

Nothin' new in the world

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Sal
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 18, 2021, 04:50:38 pm
Hi Folks,

Nothin' new in the world

 [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]

Sal
:cheesy: :cheesy:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on December 18, 2021, 06:30:32 pm
Quote
Kathy
See, we do agree sometimes.
Cheers
gww

 :grin:  I suspect that we agree more often than either of us know.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on December 19, 2021, 08:38:07 am
Quote
Hey we agree!  For the rest of it I prefer natural foods in their natural state so I would never freeze dry my food for any reason.  For the most part they are just high priced toys.

For most of the history of the world people were forced to buy food in its "natural state".  Food poisoning of one kind or another was common.  There was no way to preserve food, so people starved when harvests were not good and game was scarce.  I am guessing that you don't actually eat food in its natural state and that you have both a refrigerator and freezer along with some canned and dried goods. 

When I look at what I have, my question is "How long will this last if there is no other source of food?".  Freeze drying seems like a reasonable way to extend not only the varieties, but the shelf life.
Well let me explain the words.  I said, "I prefer foods in their natural state."  That means I'm not going to take wholesome foods and intentionally ruin it.
I don't worry about "no other food source" because I am surrounded by republicans that will shoot their neighbors protecting their stash.  If I survive that there will be plenty of fresh kill to eat assuming the alligators don't get there first.
Let me try to explain something else.  In a famine it is not the one who has the largest hoard of food that survives it is the one with the most money to buy the food that remains in existence.  Guns are useless in a famine unless you plan on eating it.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on December 19, 2021, 11:38:36 am
Quote
In a famine it is not the one who has the largest hoard of food that survives it is the one with the most money to buy the food that remains in existence.  Guns are useless in a famine unless you plan on eating it.

There's some truth in that, but there are plenty of other reasons one might lose access to food.  And yes, I would shoot someone who did not prepare, to protect what I put aside.  I don't think that's a political party position.  It's just common sense. 
we all make choices and live (or die) by those choices.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on December 20, 2021, 09:18:57 am
And yes, I would shoot someone who did not prepare, to protect what I put aside.
So you would live a few moments longer then one who didn't prepare, maybe...
The long term solution is to fine another source or way to create more food.  That will likely happen in a community that shares with a common goal.  Very unlikely it will happen with a person who relies on the power of a gun.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 20, 2021, 01:26:37 pm
So you would live a few moments longer then one who didn't prepare, maybe...
The long term solution is to fine another source or way to create more food.  That will likely happen in a community that shares with a common goal.  Very unlikely it will happen with a person who relies on the power of a gun.

Brian I am not understanding your reasoning here. In an emergency situation, there may not be resources available in a community, or time to find a new food source; let alone "create" one. What kind of food do you suppose a community can "create" in an emergency situation?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 20, 2021, 01:29:20 pm
Member, have you ran a batch of water in order to have plenty of dehydrated water on hand as Sal has pictured?  :wink: :shocked:

That was a good one Sal..
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: CoolBees on December 20, 2021, 01:44:45 pm
...
The long term solution is to fine another source or way to create more food.  That will likely happen in a community that shares with a common goal.  Very unlikely it will happen with a person who relies on the power of a gun.

History is replete with lessons that prove your statement false. Ask the Plymouth colonists (only one example) - the first year they operated with "a common goal". They starved, and many died. The 2nd year they operated with "individual goals". With the help of the Indians**, the harvest was bountiful that year - and they celebrated with a big meal, now known as Thanksgiving.

History does not support your statement - but it's an ideology that keeps getting dreamily pushed, to the detriment of all humankind.

** Indians - Native Americans - for those with a need for modern political speak.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 20, 2021, 02:09:58 pm
Cool Your post reminds me of just how efficient our forbears, (pioneers), were of being independant and prepping for basic survival 'just a short time ago', when as related to mankinds' time. And just how dependent we, as a society have become on one another in most of the modernized world, as a world wide community, for food and goods.

New Orleans was a huge community yet when the tragedy of Katrina hit the community was helpless in that emergency. Not all homes and businesses were completely under water. Many people were trapped in second story dewing places, those who were fortunate enough to have such. A good supply of stored water would be first as Kathy pointed out towards the beginning of this thread.

Which brings us back to the thoughts of this topic: "Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper"

Adding: We might consider a spin off topic discussing Aces' points of intent, which has nothing to do with individual people or families being prepared, but a loaded question, in my opinion, to swing politics back onto this topic without himself taking the blame for doing so. lol 
:wink: 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on December 20, 2021, 02:17:43 pm
Quote
New Orleans was a huge community yet when the tragedy of Katrina hit the community was helpless.

And it didn't need to be because they had plenty of warning.  We have come to expect that if bad things happen, someone will jump in a fix it RIGHT NOW!!  Doesn't work that way even in relatively small disasters like Katrina.  It's not going to work when something bigger happens.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 20, 2021, 02:30:51 pm
Member, have you ran a batch of water in order to have plenty of dehydrated water on hand as Sal has pictured?  :wink: :shocked:

That was a good one Sal..
Oh certainly.  It's amazing how much water comes out of water when you dehydrate it!  And the best thing is it takes literally no space to store!!   :wink: :cheesy:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 20, 2021, 02:36:42 pm
Member, have you ran a batch of water in order to have plenty of dehydrated water on hand as Sal has pictured?  :wink: :shocked:

That was a good one Sal..
Oh certainly.  It's amazing how much water comes out of water when you dehydrate it!  And the best thing is it takes literally no space to store!!   :wink: :cheesy:


 :wink:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 20, 2021, 02:53:33 pm
Ben Framed:
>New Orleans was a huge community yet when the tragedy of Katrina hit the community was helpless.


KathyP
>And it didn't need to be because they had plenty of warning.  We have come to expect that if bad things happen, someone will jump in a fix it RIGHT NOW!!  Doesn't work that way even in relatively small disasters like Katrina.  It's not going to work when something bigger happens.


I agree... Your point is well taken Kathy.. This topic has had some interesting points made, suggestions, strategies, and methods of being prepared...

Your topic is a good one in my opinion. Most likely we are just scratching the surface with ideas and discussion of things to consider which may help to be prepared?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 20, 2021, 03:06:53 pm
History is replete with lessons that prove your statement false. Ask the Plymouth colonists (only one example) - the first year they operated with "a common goal". They starved, and many died. The 2nd year they operated with "individual goals". With the help of the Indians**, the harvest was bountiful that year - and they celebrated with a big meal, now known as Thanksgiving.

History does not support your statement - but it's an ideology that keeps getting dreamily pushed, to the detriment of all humankind.

** Indians - Native Americans - for those with a need for modern political speak.
The same thing happened in Jamestowne, Virginia until Smith instituted "He who does not work does not eat".  Aesop's The Ant and the Grasshopper comes to mind. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: CoolBees on December 20, 2021, 07:22:46 pm
Member, have you ran a batch of water in order to have plenty of dehydrated water on hand as Sal has pictured?  :wink: :shocked:

That was a good one Sal..
Oh certainly.  It's amazing how much water comes out of water when you dehydrate it!  And the best thing is it takes literally no space to store!!   :wink: :cheesy:

 :cheesy: :cheesy: :cheesy:

Getting back on topic with this thread - pls share (when you can) what else you come up with 15th. Very good/informative thread - thank you!
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 20, 2021, 07:41:12 pm
Getting back on topic with this thread - pls share (when you can) what else you come up with 15th. Very good/informative thread - thank you!
Will do.  We are taking a break here because we are busy getting ready for Christmas.  We've got several days of baking ahead of us.  But the next batch we are planning on doing is candy.  For New Years Eve we always get candy from a local store that has bulk candy out in barrels, so you can fill up a bag with however much of whatever you like.  But due to COVID they haven't been doing the candy like that, this year or last, so we're going to freeze dry a big variety of candy to try on New Years Eve while we're staying up. 

Last night my sister invented something amazing with the ice cream sandwiches (drum roll please) . . . DESSERT CEREAL!  If we take the little freeze dried ice cream sandwich bites, cut them in half, put them in a bowl, and pour milk over them and eat them like cereal, they partially rehydrate in the milk, and it's SOOO GOOD!!  It's like my new favorite quickie desert.  :grin:

After New Years we'll start on the big guns: Freeze drying whole meals and staples and experimenting with how they rehydrate and how best to store them long term. 

Which reminds me, we don't have a vacuum sealer, and I picked up through this discussion that some of you do.  My mom has just started looking at them.  We have mylar bags and oxygen absorbers that came with the freeze dryer, and we're not really sure if that system needs or could benefit from a vacuum sealer yet, or if we'll like using that method of storage at all.  Those of you that have vacuum sealers, what kind do you have?  Do you like it?  What do you use it for?   
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on December 20, 2021, 07:49:17 pm
I have the Foodsaver.  Costco had them on sale a few years ago and so I got the super-duper one with canisters and stuff.  I use it for garden produce that I want to freeze and if we get a good deal on something for the freezer.  Also good for things you want to ship somewhere and even for smallish things you want to pack. 

Pretty much anything that isn't pointy that you want to save.  I did a bunch of squash and whipped and froze some eggs this year.  If you are going to do wet things like berries and eggs, make sure you get one that will handle liquids well.  Some of them are not so good at that and make a mess.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on December 20, 2021, 08:13:33 pm
We use a seal a meal.
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We use it for vegetables from Judy?s garden and meat.
What is nice about this one is that it has a port that you can use for canning jars.
I bought Judy the lids caps accessories, for Christmas  to be able to vacuum seal jars. I?m hoping it all fits together.
Jim Altmiller
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 20, 2021, 10:07:09 pm
>We have mylar bags and oxygen absorbers that came with the freeze dryer, and we're not really sure if that system needs or could benefit from a vacuum sealer yet

That was going to be my question too. From what I understand about your type system, the freeze dried food is good for 25 years. I am wondering if you do add vacuum sealing before placing in the mylar bag, will it eliminate the need for aid of oxygen absorbers?

PS The ice cream desert sounds good!
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: CoolBees on December 21, 2021, 04:18:40 am
Regarding vacuum sealers: there are 2 main types (that I know of).

1) your "normal" sealer which sucks the air out. &

2) a Chamber sealer.

I've owned 3 normal sealers. They work mostly. And when my 3rd one started breaking down, I learned from a friend about a chamber sealer. I didn't really understand them till I saw one in action.

Basically - a normal sealer sucks the air out of the plastic bag. This works for dry things. It doesn't work too well for fish, or wet meats, etc.

A chamber sealer sucks the air out of a chamber around the bag. This causes the bag to expand (rather than contract), expelling the air in the bag.

The main advantages of a chamber sealer are:
- you can seal wet foods
- you can vacuum seal fresh soup
- or whole meals
- even a bag full of water, to make your own ice packs
- the bags are much cheaper ($.03 to $.07 ea)
-They last much longer (mine is over 7,000 bags)
- I seal paperwork
- I even seal the compressor oil into a bag so it doesn't leak
- and I could go on ...

Heres the one I have ... https://www.vacmasterfresh.com/vacmaster-vp215-best-selling-commercial-chamber-vacuum-sealer/

I do a lot of sealing. I would never go back to a regular sealer.

 Here's a bunch of salmon fillets - perfect seal every time (try that with a normal sealer - I have, it sucks)

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Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on December 21, 2021, 09:37:25 am
The seal a meal has a wet and dry selection. Sometimes you have to fix the bags that are wet. If it is real wet, it helps to do it twice. If you leave enough plastic on top of the bag you can just re seal it. The problem shows up when there is too much water under the seal line.
Jim Altmiller
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on December 21, 2021, 11:03:54 am
Quote
The seal a meal has a wet and dry selection. Sometimes you have to fix the bags that are wet.

mine too.  A bit of a learning curve for the wetter stuff. 

Quote
a Chamber sealer.

This is something I will look at when I kill the one I have!  :grin:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 21, 2021, 12:41:50 pm
Thanks for all the comments everyone. 

That was going to be my question too. From what I understand about your type system, the freeze dried food is good for 25 years. I am wondering if you do add vacuum sealing before placing in the mylar bag, will it eliminate the need for aid of oxygen absorbers?
This is a question we've been trying to figure out.  Retiredat40, the guy whose Youtube channel we've been watching to learn a lot about freeze drying, seems to sometimes do just one, and sometimes he does both, and we aren't sure why.  It's hard to find good information about this stuff, there is a lot of misinformation out there.  I was reading on some website a few weeks ago about oxygen absorbers, and it said that "oxygen absorbers suck all the air out of a package" which is just patently false.  An oxygen absorber is not a magical tiny vacuum sealer.  The words oxygen and air are not interchangeable in this context. 

Here's a bunch of salmon fillets - perfect seal every time (try that with a normal sealer - I have, it sucks)
No pun intended?  :wink: :cheesy: 

Heres the one I have ... https://www.vacmasterfresh.com/vacmaster-vp215-best-selling-commercial-chamber-vacuum-sealer/

Ah, so you've got the top of the house one that everyone recommends.  It's sounding like you have found it to be worth the price though.  We are definitely leaning towards the chamber sealer, just for versatility's sake, that is, if we find we really need/want one.  The biggest question is where we would put it, as it's so large, and with the sucking-type ones, that's not as much of a problem.  We could barely find room for the freeze dryer. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 21, 2021, 03:45:36 pm
Quote

BF
I am wondering if you do add vacuum sealing before placing in the mylar bag, will it eliminate the need for aid of oxygen absorbers?

Quote
The15thMember
This is a question we've been trying to figure out.  Retiredat40, the guy whose Youtube channel we've been watching to learn a lot about freeze drying, seems to sometimes do just one, and sometimes he does both, and we aren't sure why.  It's hard to find good information about this stuff, there is a lot of misinformation out there.  I was reading on some website a few weeks ago about oxygen absorbers, and it said that "oxygen absorbers suck all the air out of a package" which is just patently false.  An oxygen absorber is not a magical tiny vacuum sealer.  The words oxygen and air are not interchangeable in this context.

No doubt you will get this figured out. Let us know of your uncoverings please.

Phillip
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: CoolBees on December 21, 2021, 04:36:26 pm

Quote
a Chamber sealer.

This is something I will look at when I kill the one I have!  :grin:

I highly recommend it. And to clarify - I don't know a single person at the company and have no vested interest - just a few decades of personal experience. There are other chamber sealer companies - but the ocean-fishing community has used them all, and this one is the best.

Here's a bunch of salmon fillets - perfect seal every time (try that with a normal sealer - I have, it sucks)
No pun intended?  :wink: :cheesy: 

Heres the one I have ... https://www.vacmasterfresh.com/vacmaster-vp215-best-selling-commercial-chamber-vacuum-sealer/

Ah, so you've got the top of the house one that everyone recommends.  It's sounding like you have found it to be worth the price though.  We are definitely leaning towards the chamber sealer, just for versatility's sake, that is, if we find we really need/want one.  The biggest question is where we would put it, as it's so large, and with the sucking-type ones, that's not as much of a problem.  We could barely find room for the freeze dryer.

No pun intended -  :grin:  :grin: - I missed that one.  :shocked:

Yes, the chamber sealer is bigger. And - a word of caution: it's very heavy! It's not something I'd recommend planning to move around a lot. But definitely worth the price!!!
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 21, 2021, 08:34:52 pm
I had posted one here but it was not the same so I took it down.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: CoolBees on December 21, 2021, 08:35:11 pm
Alan this one looks similar. On Sale
Might not be the same?


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To clarify - I'm a member of six fishing forums with a total of more than 20k active members. Plus, many yrs in the harbors and around the docks. Vacuum Sealers are an annual topic. The overriding concensus is for Vacmaster. So I followed thier advice and have been extremely happy. ... there may be (and probably are) other great products. And I'd guess these guys have tried them all. ... I'm just passing alone what I learned, and am happy with.

Also - vacmaster gives discounts: Veteran, Club memberships, etc - just call them and ask. They have super customer service. Fwiw.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 21, 2021, 08:37:53 pm
Alan the one I posted looked very similar and was the same brand but smaller and I do not know the other differences. Yours is tried and tested. Thanks.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: CoolBees on December 21, 2021, 08:47:11 pm
No worries Phillip - I responded prior to seeing the brand. Sorry about that. I've heard only good things about everything they  (vacmaster) make. But I only provide this on a Fwiw basis. If it helps someone - good deal!  :grin:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on December 22, 2021, 08:29:19 am
With the help of the Indians**, the harvest was bountiful that year - and they celebrated with a big meal, now known as Thanksgiving.
Understanding what you write might be helpful.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: salvo on December 22, 2021, 04:27:27 pm
Hey Acebird!

C'Mon Man! Quit raining on this kid's parade, Will ya?


Sal





Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on December 28, 2021, 06:12:10 pm
The15thMember. I wonder how freeze dried pollen would fare? It is my understanding that pollen is best kept fresh with freezing. Wouldn't it stand to reason, freeze-drying would insure a good method to preserve pollen as well?  🤷🏻‍♂️
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 28, 2021, 07:03:27 pm
The15thMember. I wonder how freeze dried pollen would fare? It is my understanding that pollen is best kept fresh with freezing. Wouldn't it stand to reason, freeze-drying would insure a good method to preserve pollen as well?  🤷🏻‍♂️
I was thinking the same thing.  Pollen is often dehydrated, so I don't know why it couldn't be freeze dried.  I'm thinking about trying some this summer. 

We're putting our New Years Eve candy in this evening, so I'll let you guys know how it turns out.   
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on December 29, 2021, 12:04:05 pm
Oh guys, the candy is extremely amusing!  We did Starburst, flavored Tootsie Rolls, Swedish Fish, Whoppers, Skittles, organic gummy worms (apparently non-organic ones don't work, since the wax they are coated in that makes them shiny seals in the water), and Milk Duds.  The bottom line of candy on the tray is just straight out of the package and the top is after it came out of the freeze dryer.  The Whoppers didn't work, because nothing happened to them in the vacuum and then the chocolate just melted during the drying phase.  The Swedish fish did absolutely nothing, the ones that are freeze dried are indistinguishable from the ones that are in the package.  The Starburst and Tootsie Rolls are still pretty soft, but they aren't dense anymore, and the Skittles look just like pool balls.  But the gummy worms and the Milk Duds are like the consistence of a cheese puff!  It's so weird.  We haven't eaten anything yet, we're saving the fun for New Years Eve, but we're really excited to try them! 
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Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on January 02, 2022, 01:53:10 pm
We tried all our candy on New Year's Eve and hands down the best was the Milk Duds!  The Skittles, Starburst, and Tootsie Rolls were good too, but they weren't that different from before.  They are lighter and harder, but they rehydrate quickly in your mouth, so the experience of eating them is just crunchy at first and then normal.  The gummy worms tasted good, but they were really hard to eat, because they stick in your teeth.  It was a fun experiment, but I doubt we'll be doing much candy in the future. 

We did another round of fruit and veggies the other day, more bananas, apples, mandarin oranges, pineapples, and carrots.  The fruits are delicious freeze dried, especially the mandarin oranges, which just melt in your mouth.  The carrots aren't great as is, but they rehydrate really well.  After a few minutes in water they feel like a pool noodle in your hands, which sounds gross, but eating it is like the most perfectly cooked carrot you ever had, soft but with good texture, not at all mushy.  If you were going to use them in soup or something, I bet you'd never know the difference.  The pineapple rehydrated nicely as well.  The mandarin oranges didn't though.  They are so powdery that they don't retain their shape once put in water.  Perhaps less water would work better.  The apples rehydrate okay, but they turn brown in water, so we may try rehydrating them in lemon juice in the future if we want them rehydrated, which we may not, as they are delicious as is too, especially the more tart apples like granny smith. 
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Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on January 04, 2022, 06:18:19 pm
Time for our first try with the big guns: freeze drying whole entrees.  This cycle took just over 21 hours.  From right to left we have sweet and sour rabbit, hamburger barbeque (or sloppy joe meat), ham and bean soup, and penne a la philly (red sauce with cream cheese).  We just have it all in half gallon ball jars right now, since we will be rehydrating it all for supper tomorrow to see how it works.  The other picture is how the soup looked coming off the tray.  In the future we probably would keep the beans out of the soup, since they didn't fully dry because water got trapped in some of them, and beans are shelf stable anyway, so it would be just as easy to add them in later when rehydrating the soup. 
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Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on January 05, 2022, 08:48:04 am
At the rate you are going you better build a power plant.  I don't think the new Ford will handle this surge.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on January 05, 2022, 11:06:09 am
At the rate you are going you better build a power plant.  I don't think the new Ford will handle this surge.
Well that's why we're running it now, while the grid is still up.  :wink:

For any who may be genuinely interested, Living Traditions Homestead, who is one of our favorite trusted sources for homesteading advice and has the exact same freeze dryer that we do, talks about the energy consumption and cost of running the machine in this video.  The math starts at about 15:00. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXo6C1HhbDo
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on January 05, 2022, 11:33:50 am
Reagan I watched from 15:00 on. That was really interesting! Thanks for posting.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on January 05, 2022, 11:40:56 am
If a person understood the precise concept of the process in sequence of how this works, I bet that person could build a large one starting out basically with a chest type freezer, (size)-seven cubic foot for example, along with an adequate size vacuum pump?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on January 05, 2022, 02:12:19 pm
If a person understood the precise concept of the process in sequence of how this works, I bet that person could build a large one starting out basically with a chest type freezer, (size)-seven cubic foot for example, along with an adequate size vacuum pump?
You would need a heating element as well.  The drying stage of the process alternates between heating and cooling to pull all the water out of the food. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on January 05, 2022, 03:06:14 pm
The15thMember
Quote
You would need a heating element as well.  The drying stage of the process alternates between heating and cooling to pull all the water out of the food.

Thank you. That makes sense Member. I would suppose these work off of a PID controller, ('electronic brain' lol), such as, or similar to an Ink Bird PID as used in OAV set ups to insure a perfect temperature response? If that is the case this may not be so complicated to build? What do you think?

Phillip
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on January 05, 2022, 05:59:08 pm
Thank you. That makes sense Member. I would suppose these work off of a PID controller, ('electronic brain' lol), such as, or similar to an Ink Bird PID as used in OAV set ups to insure a perfect temperature response? If that is the case this may not be so complicated to build? What do you think?

Phillip
I certainly wouldn't know.  I can't even build a Lincoln Log house without instructions.  True story.  :embarassed: :cheesy:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on January 05, 2022, 06:03:32 pm
Thanks for the smile Member! :grin:

Phillip


The15thMember
Quote
I certainly wouldn't know.  I can't even build a Lincoln Log house without instructions.  True story.  :embarassed: :cheesy:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on January 05, 2022, 11:09:59 pm
We rehydrated our entrees for supper tonight.  My mom didn't weigh them before they went into the freeze dryer, so we just winged how much water to add back in.  I personally think that math would be easier in the future, but it wasn't hard to guess just based on the food's consistency.  I took some really close up pictures of the food so you can see the texture of everything.  The hamburger barbeque (sloppy joe) and the rabbit were totally indistinguishable from before.  My dad kept clarifying with Mom that it was in fact freeze dried, because it was so exactly the same.  The soup was harder to guess how much water to add, so depending on what people did it was a little too thick or too thin, but once we got it right, it was indistinguishable too.  The penne was totally the same on flavor, but the pasta took forever to rehydrate, and even then it wasn't quite soft enough.  The tips and tricks booklet that came with the machine suggests rehydrating the pasta a different way, reheating it using the oven, so perhaps that will work better.  But like the beans in the soup, in all likelihood for long term storage we'd just leave the pasta out and cook it and add it in upon rehydrating the sauce, since dry pasta is shelf stable.  The flavor of all this food was AMAZING, totally and complete preserved, and especially when compared to the taste of the barely edible garbage which the long-term food storage companies like Auguson Farms and Ready Hour sell, and at absurd prices at that.  There's still a lot of kinks to works out, for example we were doing some pumpkin puree and shredded zucchini from the freezer today, and we learned we have to break something like that up into smaller pieces after the first drying cycle or it takes forever to get dry in the middle.  But this evening's meals were a resounding success, and we are extremely excited to get as much of our food as possible out of the freezer and fridge and onto the shelves.  The next step will be figuring out everything with the mylar and oxygen absorbers and storing the food for some semi-extended length of time, say 6 months to a year, and seeing how it holds up. 
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Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on January 05, 2022, 11:51:38 pm
Outstanding!!
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on January 06, 2022, 12:05:30 am
Member,
What happens if you freeze dry bread and rolls?
Jim Altmiller
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on January 06, 2022, 12:43:01 am
Member,
What happens if you freeze dry bread and rolls?
Jim Altmiller
The roll in that picture is not freeze dried, just to clarify.  Supposedly you can do it, but many people find it difficult to rehydrate it properly.  Obviously if you just stick the freeze dried bread in water it will get all soggy, so you have to wrap it in something damp to try to get it to be soft again.  We tried it once, and it sort of worked, but the bread was pretty stale, it never went back to being fresh.  You probably could have toasted it and it would have been okay or maybe sopped up some soup with it, but it wouldn't have been pleasant to eat it as it was.   
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on January 06, 2022, 08:41:00 am
At the rate you are going you better build a power plant.  I don't think the new Ford will handle this surge.
Well that's why we're running it now, while the grid is still up.  :wink:

For any who may be genuinely interested, Living Traditions Homestead, who is one of our favorite trusted sources for homesteading advice and has the exact same freeze dryer that we do, talks about the energy consumption and cost of running the machine in this video.
So the unit is somewhere near 538 watts?  Is that what is on the unit tag?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on January 06, 2022, 12:35:57 pm
So the unit is somewhere near 538 watts?  Is that what is on the unit tag?
The tag is on the back of the machine and I can't see it, so I can't check.  It says this on the Harvest Right website, if this is what you are looking for: "At peak, the freeze dryer draws about 16 amps, but on the average about 9 to 11 amps (990-1210 watts) of power per hour. A dedicated 20 amp circuit is recommended. Your freeze dryer will cost an estimated $1.25-$2.80 a day, depending on power costs in your area."
 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on January 06, 2022, 01:08:30 pm
So you would need at least a 2000 watt generator.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on January 13, 2022, 07:55:17 am
So you would need at least a 2000 watt generator.

Yes if you waited until the power grid was off to then decide to freeze dry food. (This would be good an example of being unprepared)  I am thinking the freeze drying should be done in good times of cheap, power company provided electricity.
If we were to wait until the power was off for whatever reason, wouldn't we be spinning our wheels? Wouldn't it be too expensive and un-practical to run a 2000 watt generator for the hours needed to go through the process to cycle?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on January 13, 2022, 08:03:04 am
You don't need to freeze dry foods for a short interruption of power.  You can just freeze the foods that would spoil.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on January 14, 2022, 01:11:37 pm
Member any new experiments with your freeze dryer?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on January 14, 2022, 01:30:42 pm
Quote
You don't need to freeze dry foods for a short interruption of power.

I don't think anyone is investing in food preservation methods because the power might go out for an hour.  It IS for long term disruption and shortages. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on January 14, 2022, 06:16:17 pm
Member any new experiments with your freeze dryer?
We've just kind of been trucking along on the usual stuff, leftovers, fruits, and veggies.  It's been going great.  We just got a new kitchen scale in the mail the other day, which will help with weighing before and after the freeze drying so we know exactly how much water to add back in to rehydrate the food.  My mom also got her canning jar vacuum sealer in the mail today.  We're holding off on anything too experimental for the moment because we are on goat baby watch. 

Quote
You don't need to freeze dry foods for a short interruption of power.

I don't think anyone is investing in food preservation methods because the power might go out for an hour.  It IS for long term disruption and shortages. 
That is correct.  :happy:   
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on January 15, 2022, 09:22:25 am
It IS for long term disruption and shortages.
Explain long term disruption of shortages.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on January 15, 2022, 11:57:19 am
Quote
Explain long term disruption of shortages.

and, not of.

Try it that way and get back to me if you still need an explanation.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on January 16, 2022, 08:12:53 am
Yes I made a mistake.  Still want to know what you consider long term disruption and shortages.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on January 16, 2022, 12:59:47 pm
Quote
Still want to know what you consider long term disruption and shortages.

That's probably a subjective call.  I have done disasters where people were unprepared to survive for 3 days, and some where people could have gone on for weeks.

The extreme would be something like a solar flare or EMP that took out power for months or more.  On the short end, it would be my mothers friend who was snowed in for over a week with the power out unable to get to the store, water frozen, and no heat.

Anyone who thinks this kind of thing can't happen in our country, or can't happen to them where they live, is delusional. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on January 16, 2022, 05:53:12 pm
I agree with Kathy, there are many scenarios where having extra food on hand would be helpful, especially for a large family like mine.  I think COVID has shown us how unreliable the grocery store can be, with shortages due to supply chain issues and panic hoarding.  My family just simply doesn't feel comfortable having only enough food for a week or two on hand any more.  Any natural or societal disaster could lead to food or other necessities becoming temporarily inaccessible, and we feel it's prudent to be as self-sufficient as possible. 

Even with the issue of losing a freezer during a long power outage aside, we can have way more food on hand which is way easier to prepare if it's freeze dried than if it's in the freezer.  For my large family, even 3 freezers, which is what we have now, isn't enough room.  We've got meat, garden produce, milk, normal frozen groceries, pollen, and I need room in a freezer to freeze bee boxes before storage.  If we can get some of that food out of the freezers and onto the shelves, then we can use the freezer for things that can't really be freeze dried, like bread. 

In addition, let's say no disaster ever happens, (which has already proven untrue with COVID, but hypothetically), it's so much more convenient to have the food just on the shelf ready to go.  For example, we have a goat who is going to kid any day now.  Let's say she has her babies overnight tonight, in the cold and the snow, we're all exhausted from being up all night, and we've been out in the barn all day, and now we've got to get some supper together.  Mom could walk out to the freezer in the garage and get a pan of lasagna, heat up the oven, and let it bake for an hour or two.  Or, she could take some freeze dried lasagna off the shelf, add some boiling water to it, and it's ready to eat in 15 minutes.  Yes, it's a lot of money and work up front for the freeze dried food, but the payoff is homemade, nutritious, delicious food at tremendous convenience later, and some food security to boot. 
   
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on January 17, 2022, 09:12:48 am
On the short end, it would be my mothers friend who was snowed in for over a week with the power out unable to get to the store, water frozen, and no heat.

Anyone who thinks this kind of thing can't happen in our country, or can't happen to them where they live, is delusional.
I lived through one of those when I was a kid.  My father tended the fireplace all night then went to work during the day.  We were able to keep the pipes from freezing which is not easy with a fireplace although it did have a heatalator.  This was before kerosene heaters became a fad.
Today it is easy as long as you do the minimal preparation.  You can't run to the store during a panic, you can't get fuel during a panic, you can't buy a generator when the power goes out.  Most of the crisis today is created by panic and lack of planning not the actual disaster.
If a freeze dryer makes you happy then you should get one but I put it in the category of "wants" not "needs" like an over priced truck to power your house.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on January 17, 2022, 11:43:47 am
Quote
I lived through one of those when I was a kid.  My father tended the fireplace all night then went to work during the day.  We were able to keep the pipes from freezing which is not easy with a fireplace although it did have a heatalator.  This was before kerosene heaters became a fad.
Today it is easy as long as you do the minimal preparation.  You can't run to the store during a panic, you can't get fuel during a panic, you can't buy a generator when the power goes out.  Most of the crisis today is created by panic and lack of planning not the actual disaster.
If a freeze dryer makes you happy then you should get one but I put it in the category of "wants" not "needs" like an over priced truck to power your house.

That's great prep for the short term.  Everyone should at least be able to survive for a week on their own.  If, for instance, we had a Carrington Event =, we could have parts of the country out of power for months.  An intentional attack could be as bad if not worse.  This is interesting and worth at least a scan.
https://www.swpc.noaa.gov/sites/default/files/images/u33/finalBoulderPresentation042611%20%281%29.pdf

Nothing is a need until you need it.  If we prepare and do not need it, nothing is lost but some money. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on January 18, 2022, 09:04:51 am
There is no amount of individual preparation that is going to make a real difference if there is a world changing event.  It will come down to how much money you have and whether you can access it.  The only real peppers in my mind are those that are hoarding gold.  The problem with that activity is the ability to trade it for what you need in the case of a world event.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on January 18, 2022, 10:50:07 am
Quote
There is no amount of individual preparation that is going to make a real difference if there is a world changing event.  It will come down to how much money you have and whether you can access it.  The only real peppers in my mind are those that are hoarding gold.  The problem with that activity is the ability to trade it for what you need in the case of a world event.

Money would not matter at that point.  It would be worthless.  There are lots of things that can be used for barter if it came to that.  Gold, silver, ammo, food, fuel...

You are correct that there might be events that are not survivable.  Short of those events, there's no harm in upping the odds of survival in a disaster.  If you choose not to, that's OK.  I am all about choices and the following consequences or rewards of those choices.

Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on January 19, 2022, 08:14:47 am
You are correct that there might be events that are not survivable.  Short of those events, there's no harm in upping the odds of survival in a disaster.
LOL it takes money to prepare.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on January 19, 2022, 10:38:37 am
Quote
LOL it takes money to prepare.

Doesn't have to take much.  You can store dry goods for a long time without spending much.  I started my first bucket of survival food by picking up an extra bag or two of beans or dried soup mix when I went shopping.  That's about an extra 2 dollars.  Water storage containers are cheap and sometimes free.  I got 50-gallon food-grade water containers for 20 dollars each.  They smell like vinegar, but if that's the only water I have, I don't think the smell will bother. 

You can do what you think is important.  If this is not important to you, then don't bother.  No one is going to force you to do it.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on January 19, 2022, 01:36:53 pm
You either have to spend an enormous amount of time and or groceries that a large percentage of the country doesn't have.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on January 19, 2022, 02:53:46 pm
Quote
You either have to spend an enormous amount of time and or groceries that a large percentage of the country doesn't have.

No you don't.  Even if you did, we tend to make time and money for things we think are important.  I already told you how I started putting things away and it was not at all expensive or time consuming.  I wonder sometimes if you actually read stuff, or just keep spouting your incorrect talking points?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on January 20, 2022, 08:35:48 am
Quote
You either have to spend an enormous amount of time and or groceries that a large percentage of the country doesn't have.

No you don't.  Even if you did, ...
Well which side of the fence do you want to argue?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on January 20, 2022, 01:15:04 pm
Quote
Well which side of the fence do you want to argue?

Neither.  Do or don't do.  Your choice.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: salvo on January 25, 2022, 11:31:04 pm
Hi Folks,

I saw this today:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Dn3kBBU1wc&t=304s

Sal
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: salvo on January 27, 2022, 09:20:25 am
Hi Folks,

You thought that Norway guy was.... well.... in NORWAY! Never happen here, RIGHT?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4q3pLGGRP0

Prepping is more than just enough food.

BTW: More What's Cooking pictures please. We got SNOWMAGEDDON coming. I gotta go get bread and milk. OH! And oatmeal.

Also: Thanks Ben for keeping some of my posts,... how you say,... polite. I have to find more obscure ways to curse.

Sal
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on January 28, 2022, 09:38:22 am
LOL.  Well Sal I guess you better not buy that new electric Ford truck and just drive junkers the rest of your life.
Every state would have to have monthly inspections to assure this tell tale feature is still active and running right.  There are not enough unemployed technicians in the country to make that happen.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on January 28, 2022, 03:15:07 pm
BTW: More What's Cooking pictures please. We got SNOWMAGEDDON coming. I gotta go get bread and milk. OH! And oatmeal.
Stay tuned, Sal!  We're having chicken and dumplings tonight.  :cool:  The freeze dryer has enabled us to seriously step up our oatmeal game.  We now keep all our oatmeal additives on a tray so that we can easily setup the oatmeal buffet every morning.   

We recently went ahead and purchased a handheld Foodsaver and the attachments for ball jars, so we can seal our freeze dried foods in jars for short term storage (a couple years).  Through doing some more looking at it, we found there is no benefit to vacuum sealing over oxygen absorbers and mylar, and the oxygen absorbers and mylar will last much longer, so we probably won't be getting a chamber or baggie sealer, as it seems to be redundant.   
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on February 11, 2022, 01:45:05 pm
We packaged up our first food in mylar for long term storage yesterday: hamburger barbeque.  We are planning on storing it on the shelf for at least a year before opening it up to see how it is. 
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Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on February 11, 2022, 02:29:53 pm
That looks great.  How did the avocados dry? and how do you rehydrate something like that?  Did you do anything to the jars to remove air?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on February 11, 2022, 02:57:58 pm
That looks great.  How did the avocados dry? and how do you rehydrate something like that?  Did you do anything to the jars to remove air?
You're not understanding the picture.  The avocados are just the picture on the bag.  Harvest Right gives you fancy bags for free, most company's are just mylar colored.  You can do avocados though.  Mom was watching a video the other day where Retired at 40 did avocadoes and then ran them through the food processor to make avocado powder for guacamole.  You could also just rehydrate them in water as slices if you wanted probably.  We do store some freeze dried food in vacuum sealed jars for short term storage. 
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Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on February 11, 2022, 03:22:27 pm
Lol.  Oh good.  I was curious about raspberries and bbq, but I figured to each their own!   :cheesy:

Thanks for the clarification.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on February 12, 2022, 01:05:59 am
Lol.  Oh good.  I was curious about raspberries and bbq, but I figured to each their own!   :cheesy:

Thanks for the clarification.
:cheesy:  We might not be doing anything that crazy, but we have been putting almost everything that isn't meat in our oatmeal lately! 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: salvo on February 12, 2022, 09:21:42 am
Hi Folks,

I think I've said, I prefer my oatmeal cold. Also, I don't like to put honey in hot stuff. Kills... whatever.

Cold oatmeal, and to your taste, instant coffee crystals, cocoa powder, and honey and milk. Stir it up!

MOCHA CHOCA LATA YA YA!

Sal
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on February 12, 2022, 11:58:40 am
Hi Folks,

I think I've said, I prefer my oatmeal cold. Also, I don't like to put honey in hot stuff. Kills... whatever.

Cold oatmeal, and to your taste, instant coffee crystals, cocoa powder, and honey and milk. Stir it up!

MOCHA CHOCA LATA YA YA!

Sal
I just microwave my instant oats and put the honey in afterward, so I don't feel like it's hot enough to damage the honey.  I don't like coffee, but I have put Ovaltine in oatmeal. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on February 13, 2022, 08:37:01 am
I don't like coffee, but I have put Ovaltine in oatmeal.
You better stock up.  You won't be finding that after Armageddon.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: salvo on February 23, 2022, 08:13:42 am
Hi Folks,

Close to 70 degrees today. Eight inches of snow Friday!

While we are heading for a possible record high-temperature Wednesday (we have an outside shot at hitting 70 in February for just the fifth time on record), a sharp and dramatic change will follow. Temperatures will drop some 50 degrees in about 12 hours Wednesday night into early Thursday. And, right on cue, another juicy storm has a bead on New England.

Gotta go buy bread and milk
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Sal
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on February 24, 2022, 03:26:20 pm
Hi Folks,

Close to 70 degrees today. Eight inches of snow Friday!

While we are heading for a possible record high-temperature Wednesday (we have an outside shot at hitting 70 in February for just the fifth time on record), a sharp and dramatic change will follow. Temperatures will drop some 50 degrees in about 12 hours Wednesday night into early Thursday. And, right on cue, another juicy storm has a bead on New England.

Gotta go buy bread and milk
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Sal
It got suddenly warm here as well.  It was supposed to get cold again, but the long range forecast changed, and now it looks like it'll be in the upper 50's/lower 60's for the foreseeable future.  Perhaps you should stock up on more bread and milk, Sal.  Then you wouldn't have to panic every time there was severe weather.  That's what it means to be a prepper, you know.   :wink: 

Speaking of milk, we freeze dried some of our goats milk for the first time.  Here's a picture of it afterward.  It was a quart liquid, and as you can see it's a little less than half that volume now. 
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Also, I bet no one can guess what this freeze dried food is.  Anyone want to take a guess?
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Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: gww on February 24, 2022, 04:40:22 pm
Egg?
Cheers
gww
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on February 24, 2022, 05:39:16 pm
Egg?
Cheers
gww
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First try!  Nice going, gww.  Yes, that is 18 eggs in one qt. jar!  :grin:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on February 24, 2022, 09:08:19 pm
Where are the whites?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on February 25, 2022, 12:08:15 am
Where are the whites?
They are there; they are just clear, so they aren't as visible as the orange yokes.  We whisked them up before freeze drying so the whites are just blended in.   
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on February 25, 2022, 08:18:55 am
So scrambled.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on February 25, 2022, 10:27:13 am
So scrambled.
Yes. I just wanted it to be clear that we did not cook them prior to freeze drying.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: salvo on February 25, 2022, 08:58:34 pm
Hi Folks,

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Sal
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on February 25, 2022, 10:05:00 pm
 :shocked: Sal sometimes I just have to observe with the intricacy of ironwork of what you say, along with 'plain ole bewilderment' . lol  You can come up with some, flat out cannon fodder. lol   :wink: :cheesy:

Phillip



Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: salvo on February 25, 2022, 10:34:35 pm
Why... Thank you Ben.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on February 25, 2022, 11:18:01 pm
Why... Thank you Ben.

My pleasure Sal...   :grin:  :wink:

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Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on February 26, 2022, 12:26:47 am
Hahaha!!  I'm dying laughing!  :cheesy:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: salvo on February 26, 2022, 06:28:22 pm
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Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on February 26, 2022, 07:08:47 pm
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:cheesy: :cheesy:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on February 26, 2022, 07:15:17 pm
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:cheesy: :cheesy:

X-2
Never a dull moment with Sal!  :cheesy:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on February 26, 2022, 08:26:25 pm
Sal, :grin: :grin: :grin:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on February 26, 2022, 08:44:38 pm
Sal, I think I realized the problem.  Even wild corn dogs have to be baked or fried!  Why don't you go pick another batch and try them again.  They are usually ripe this time of year.  :wink: :cheesy:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on February 26, 2022, 08:59:38 pm
Just heat them up over an open flame. They do tend to bee a little smokey tasting.
Jim Altmiller
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: William Bagwell on February 26, 2022, 10:35:49 pm
Sal, I think I realized the problem.  Even wild corn dogs have to be baked or fried!  Why don't you go pick another batch and try them again.  They are usually ripe this time of year.  :wink: :cheesy:

Let them get over ripe and they magically turn into cotton candy.  :wink:

Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on April 07, 2022, 05:32:32 am
This interesting short video is about a 'Well' similar to those we were talking about last year...

On the Video you will see:

Video unavailable
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video owner
Watch On Youtube

Simply click on the screen below "Watch on YouTube" and it will play for you.   

https://youtube.com/shorts/y4QIK4pLy0w?feature=share
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: salvo on April 15, 2022, 05:36:08 pm
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Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on April 15, 2022, 09:44:56 pm
and a hand coffee grinder for both coffee beans and whole grains   :grin:
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on April 16, 2022, 09:02:45 am
We use about 100 gal of water per day per person.  We need 10-15 cups of fluid to live.  AS the Ukrainians know it is hard to get water and food in a conventional war.  The only saving grace is if the west can deactivate Putin's nukes.  Seems like we should have that technology but there is no indication that we do.  Nuclear war is global extermination if we don't.  There is no prepping to survive a nuclear war.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on April 16, 2022, 03:27:57 pm
Ace,
Have you ever flown across this country. The major cities will no doubt be wiped out but there is vast areas with low population numbers that are not targeted.
The people that prep properly are probably going to survive if they can keep what they have stored up.
Yes it is going to take a long while for goods to start moving again but a lot of people in farm country are going to bee able to survive.
Jim Altmiller
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on April 16, 2022, 03:57:53 pm
I am less worried about Russia proper, than about Iran.  Iran has reasons to get and use nukes.  They are also Russian surrogates.  Even if Putin is nuts enough to want to toss nukes, his military leaders understand the consequences.  We would hope there are enough Vasily Arkhipovs among them to stop it. 
Not that many of them would not like to nuke us, but there is a better way.

If Iran tosses off nukes at us or more likely at some NATO countries in Europe or at Israel, Russia can say they knew nothing about it!  Russia doesn't get nuked and whatever the goal, it is accomplished anyway.  Chaos ensues.  Iran is happy for as long as they last, and the world is in a bigger mess than it is now. 
And somewhere in there, you have to factor in the nutty NorKs.  They are completely unpredictable and China surrogates.  China can use them and never be touched.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on April 17, 2022, 09:57:18 am
The major cities will no doubt be wiped out but there is vast areas with low population numbers that are not targeted.
Nuclear war between Russia and the US will put so much radiation in the atmosphere that there will be no survivors no matter where you are.  The fall out will poison the earth such that you will not be able to raise animals or plant food.  Now add to that there are a whole lot of other countries that have stored nukes.  They will most likely join in the fun due to the fall out.
It was a difficult life in the pioneer days and many starved even though they did not have to deal with radiation.  We have neighbors growing self sustainable "food forests" but here again it is all for not when you add radiation.
Jim, do you feel safe because of your distance from Jacksonville and Atlanta?
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: The15thMember on April 17, 2022, 12:56:50 pm
I think there are scenarios where nuclear war causes the collapse of civilization, but it's unlikely to cause the extinction of humankind.  I found this article to be informative in taking stock of the potential effects of launching the world's current nuclear arsenals.  https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/sT6NxFxso6Z9xjS7o/nuclear-war-is-unlikely-to-cause-human-extinction

The other thing to remember is that radiation doesn't last forever.  It might take years, but as long as a small section of the population remains alive, rebuilding would eventually be possible.  Here's what Chernobyl is like today. 
https://www.unep.org/news-and-stories/story/how-chernobyl-has-become-unexpected-haven-wildlife
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: BeeMaster2 on April 17, 2022, 01:24:30 pm
Ace,
The main blast is 7km and the secondary ring is 14km. Considering that I?m close to 90km and even more from the main military targets, yes I think I can survive the first blasts. Considering that our prevailing winds are from the west and south west most of the fallout will go over the ocean. Then there is the nuclear winter. If I were to have a good stock of salt, which I will, I can preserve enough meat that is on the farm to bee able to survive quite a while.
Jim Altmiller
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on April 17, 2022, 02:43:51 pm

Quote
The other thing to remember is that radiation doesn't last forever.

And Japan.  A lot of what we were told back in the day about radiation and long term impact has not been born out by facts on the ground.  Same with oil spills...not to start another word war... :grin:

I honestly don't think it will happen between the US and either China or Russia.  I DO think that if the 12ers in Iran have the power, they will be happy to use nukes to bring about their understanding of their end time prophecies. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on April 18, 2022, 08:23:26 am
Ace,
The main blast is 7km and the secondary ring is 14km. Considering that I?m close to 90km and even more from the main military targets, yes I think I can survive the first blasts.
It is not going to be one blast.  It is going to be every port city and the west coast plus major cities on the east coast. Jim the amount of salt that is required to preserve meat will kill you at your age.
Kathy, Iran by itself will never have enough nukes to end the world.  Same with N Korea.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on April 18, 2022, 08:29:16 am

The other thing to remember is that radiation doesn't last forever.  It might take years, but as long as a small section of the population remains alive, rebuilding would eventually be possible.  Here's what Chernobyl is like today. 
https://www.unep.org/news-and-stories/story/how-chernobyl-has-become-unexpected-haven-wildlife
Chernobyl is not a nuclear weapon.  The core in Chernobyl is contained and will last hundred of years.  No one is living there or growing food.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Ben Framed on April 18, 2022, 11:12:53 am
List of United States nuclear weapons tests
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See also: List of nuclear weapons tests

Trinity, part of Project Manhattan, was the first ever nuclear explosion.
The nuclear weapons tests of the United States were performed between 1945 and 1992 as part of the nuclear arms race. The United States conducted around 1,054 nuclear tests by official count, including 216 atmospheric, underwater, and space tests.[1][notes 1] Most of the tests took place at the Nevada Test Site (NNSS/NTS) and the Pacific Proving Grounds in the Marshall Islands and off Kiritimati Island in the Pacific, plus three in the Atlantic Ocean. Ten other tests took place at various locations in the United States, including Alaska, Nevada other than the NNSS/NTS, Colorado, Mississippi, and New Mexico.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_nuclear_weapons_tests
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on April 18, 2022, 12:08:26 pm
Chernobyl is not a nuclear weapon.  The core in Chernobyl is contained and will last hundred of years.  No one is living there or growing food.

Not so and people still work there.  The other reactors are unhooked from the grid, but they are not "contained".  they require human care.

https://www.businessinsider.com/what-daily-life-inside-chernobyls-exclusion-zone-is-really-like-2019-4?op=1#ivan-shamyanok-who-told-reuters-in-2016-that-he-lives-in-the-belarusian-village-of-tulgovich-in-the-exclusion-zone-refused-the-offer-to-relocate-following-the-explosion-8

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3019536/Living-working-Chernobyl-Fascinating-insight-lives-work-live-exclusion-zone-nuclear-plant-nearly-30-years-disaster-shook-world.html

One of the main reasons Chernobyl area is so contaminated is the graphite that was spewed out of it.  All of the other material from the building was contaminated and the water.  The radiation released into the air was much more than that released from our earlier nuclear bombs because of the explosions and the amount of radioactive material involved.  Fukashima was a slower release, no explosion, and the contaminated water was contained.  It will be released into the ocean at the rate of a two year old peeing in the Olympic size pool.


Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Acebird on April 19, 2022, 09:17:26 am
Quote
As Mikhail Gorbachev stated : ?The nuclear meltdown at Chernobyl 20 years ago ? even more than my launch of pre-restroika, was perhaps the real cause of the collapse of the Soviet Union five years later. ? Chernobyl opened my eyes like nothing else: it showed the horrible consequences of nuclear power ?One could now imagine much more clearly what might happen if a nuclear bomb exploded ?one SS-18 rocket could contain a hundred Chernobyls. Unfortunately, the problem of nuclear arms is still very serious today.? (Gorbachev 2006).
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2889503/

And there are thousands of nuclear warheads today.
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: Kathyp on April 19, 2022, 12:05:30 pm
Quote
And there are thousands of nuclear warheads today.

There are.  Rational actors understand that they still need a place to live when it's all over.  Even if MAD slipped through our fingers, they'd be more apt to do limited strikes and someone would quickly cry Uncle.  I am more concerned with the non-rational actors and those driven by ideology.  They don't care what happens to them or the world. 
Title: Re: Something else to consider-becoming the crazy prepper
Post by: salvo on April 19, 2022, 02:27:29 pm
Hi Folks,

Kathy. By this statement: * I am more concerned with the non-rational actors and those driven by ideology.  They don't care what happens to them or the world. *

It's almost as if you're describing what I, personally, would refer to as PROGRESSIVES.

AOC, ILLIAD OMAR, TALEEB, [insert your choice here ad nauseum].... and the beat goes on.

Sal