Difficulty opening stuck beeboxs

[TheFuzz]

I'm having difficulty opening my bee boxs, particularly the lower I go in my hives the harder it is to open them. I literally snapped a hive tool into two parts trying to open one hive, I have also damaged my brood chamber box trying to open another box, it's not splitting apart as can be seen in these photos:

https://postimg.cc/gallery/vnwXjzb

It's been taking me forty minutes of struggle to open up a single bee box to examine what's going on.It's physically demanding and it's breaking my equipment trying. The paint and wood peels and breaks off when I try to open a box by lifting it with a hive tool. I have learned when trying that the frames from one box, are stuck to the frames underneath. When I try to use my force to open a box, the bees get very angry with me and it makes it then difficult to actually examine it because they become very hostile. I've realised that it can be easier to lift the frames above, to break off the attachment to the frames in the box below, to make it lift. I attempted to do this in the photo shown but instead of the frames lifting, the wood just splits and breaks, it's easier for the wood of the frame to get damaged then it is to be unstuck and lift.

I recognise there's a lot of honey comb on top of that hive. It needed a hivemat to prevent it. I haven't removed it yet because I haven't gotten myself set up to process that honey so I'm leaving it there for now until I start crushing and straining my bits of honey comb that I have.

I'm unsure how to go about opening up this hive considering the various different methods I've used has broken my hive tools, my frames and my boxs. Does anyone have any suggestions?

[Ben Framed]

I use an antique carbon blade butchers knife that belonged to my grandmother. It was made very very thin and easily slides between the toughest of boxes for easy separation without damaging my boxes. Let me add, it is much thinner than an old hickory brand type.

[Robo]

Looks and sounds like you have a bee spacing issue and your problems will continue until you address that.   Any space that is larger than 3/8" is going to allow them to draw comb and join things together.

[FloridaGardener]

1. Do you have an inner lid? Then the telescoping (overhanging) lid won't stick.  As Robo said, it will be the right gap so it's a hallway for bees - not a pantry.  The bees will glue its edge only and it is lightweight.  Put screen on the hole in an inner cover, so you can see what to expect, and give a puff of smoke.

If you don't have that handy, a propolis trap is a good alternative.  It can be peeled back or scooted to the side to keep more bees out of the air.

2.  Corners: That's why people use finger jointed boxes secured with both glue and exterior screws.  Because all wood rots.

3. If you rotate your boxes, especially as the colony downsizes in winter, you can scrape excess propolis that glues everything together.  Those pics show you have too much of a good thing.

4.  How well are your frames secured/nailed/stapled/glued at the corners? Might be time for new frames if they are decayed from the moisture in the hive.  Woodware gets old and crumbles apart.  A wood glue like Titebond when attaching frame joints helps to keep frames whole when prying them out of a propolis gum trap.

5. How often do you inspect? If you are in there every two weeks, you can keep a better eye on burr comb.

[Skeggley]

We don't use telescoping lids here.
My guess is that the box's paint wasn't properly dry when assembled and the edges were painted.
Broke a hive tool! Strewth mine would have bent before breaking!
Worst comes to worst use a wedge or two and hammer. Oh and a bee suit...

[Garigal]

Looks and sounds like you have a bee spacing issue and your problems will continue until you address that.   Any space that is larger than 3/8" is going to allow them to draw comb and join things together.

In Australia and New Zealand our boxes aren't made to the correct sizing, all my Alliance NZ made timber ware leaves 10mm below the frames and bottom of the box, and 5mm above the top bars, so a total of 15mm when stacked.

Usually results in burr comb between boxes (and excluder) and makes it extremely hard to get them apart as so much more surface area is joined together. The only solution is to shave your timber down to the correct dimensions or get a burr comb guard.

Our migratory tops are usually a 45-50mm deep frame so it's an invite for the bees to make burr comb too, but I'm converting mine to insulated tops by closing the holes up, then inserting 30mm foam insulation sandwiched under 12mm ply leaving a gap of 3mm, combined with the 5mm from the top of the box gives me 8mm bee-space under the lid.

Discussed in more detail here:

https://www.theabk.com.au/articles/2016/7/28/a-package-of-minor-changes-to-langstroth-hives-for-major-benefits

 

[Brub58]

It?s the middle of winter!!!!  Propolis sets very hard in this whether. But why are you even trying to open your hives.

[Oldbeavo]

What is the depth of your super? outside dimension.

[Garigal]

What is the depth of your super? outside dimension.

Full depth approximately 241mm, but there can be a great variance in sizes depending on the manufacturer. There are also frames of slightly different heights going around so that adds to the problem.

Discussed in more detail here: https://beekeepers.amazingbees.com.au/the-langstroth-hive.html

Edit: Remeasured with a better tape, boxes are all 245mm deep with paint, and the end bars of my frames are 230mm, leaves a 15mm gap. Think I might go and shave all my boxes down 6mm before Spring.

[Honeyeater]

We don't use telescoping lids here.

Yes we do.  Most Flow hives users have telescoping lids

My guess is that the box's paint wasn't properly dry when assembled and the edges were painted.

I smear a dab of olive oil or whatever I have handy on the edges because I find the paint keeps blocking long after it is supposedly cured.

[Acebird]

I say Robo is right but you should use an inner cover so you could slide a piano wire through to cut the comb.

[Ben Framed]

My guess is that the box's paint wasn't properly dry when assembled and the edges were painted.
Broke a hive tool! Strewth mine would have bent before breaking!
Worst comes to worst use a wedge or two and hammer. Oh and a bee suit...

Oldbeavo taught me to simply have a Block of wax handy to rub on the box edge before stacking to eliminate this problem.

[Oldbeavo]

I don't think the gap you have is the issue, all of our supers are about this depth. Having the gap under the frames allows you to put a new  super on and not squash bees.
We have some supers that are 238mm and they are a pain when adding to a hive or super as you have to smoke all the bees down to add them.
Your frames are standard size and so are your boxes, is the whole bees world wrong or do you need to look for another issue.

[Garigal]

I don't think the gap you have is the issue, all of our supers are about this depth. Having the gap under the frames allows you to put a new  super on and not squash bees.
We have some supers that are 238mm and they are a pain when adding to a hive or super as you have to smoke all the bees down to add them.
Your frames are standard size and so are your boxes, is the whole bees world wrong or do you need to look for another issue.

All my boxes and frames are Alliance from NZ, the box depth is 245mm, their frames are 230mm = 15mm void, 5mm above the frame & 10mm below.

The gap should be under 9mm to prevent building of brace or burr comb, apparently most manufacturers ignore this and use what ever suits them in terms of machining or raw material sizes, resulting in incorrect spacing between hive components that leads to burr and brace comb.

There is no standard that beekeeping equipment manufacturers follow they all do their own thing:

Alliance sizing: http://www.beehives.co.nz/hives.htm & http://www.beehives.co.nz/frames.htm

John L Guilfoyles sizing: http://www.johnlguilfoyle.com.au/australian%20hive%20sizes.htm

Then if you start mixing different brands it get even worse.

[JurassicApiary]

My guess is that the box's paint wasn't properly dry when assembled and the edges were painted.
Broke a hive tool! Strewth mine would have bent before breaking!
Worst comes to worst use a wedge or two and hammer. Oh and a bee suit...

Oldbeavo taught me to simply have a Block of wax handy to rub on the box edge before stacking to eliminate this problem.

I did this just yesterday to some newly painted boxes.  Works brilliantly!  (Funny, people have been waxing drawers on furniture for centuries...why not do it to beehive boxes?).