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Author Topic: Ulster Observation Hives  (Read 4551 times)

Offline James M. Wagner

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Ulster Observation Hives
« on: April 15, 2015, 06:48:58 pm »
I am looking at getting an Ulster style hive to use in presentations on beekeeping. I've searched the forums and past threads on the subject seem to be outdated.

I like the Brushy Mountain one and have heard in the past that theirs is the better-built choice. It costs $160 but they are about 2 weeks behind on shipping. I notice that both Kelley and Mann Lake are now offering this style observation hive. The Kelley hive seems to have a couple of advantages, namely a ventilated detachable bottom board and places in the top for adding feeder jars. Also, it comes with 6 frames. Price is $145. The advantage of the Mann Lake unit is that the front opening has a latch and it comes with a frame feeder and viewing area shutters. However, I can see no mention of ventilation. These are currently on sale for $139.95.

Does anyone here have any experience with these hives? Has anyone been able to actually see and compare the different offerings?

Thanks.

-james
James M. Wagner

Online Michael Bush

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Re: Ulster Observation Hives
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2015, 07:58:06 am »
I've only had the Brushy Mt. one and a medium depth one built by someone on another forum.  I liked them for demo pretty well, although the one frame Tew hive I have is lighter to haul around.
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Offline sc-bee

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Re: Ulster Observation Hives
« Reply #2 on: April 16, 2015, 09:21:55 pm »
I have the brushy and I had issues with it fogging up. I had some more vent holes added. Also it was plexiglass and I went and had some tempered glass cut for it. The glass is clearer than the plexi. I only add one frame on the day of the demo or day before. that way you don't have as many bees that could gather on the top observation frame. You know everyone wants to see the queen.
I honestly have not even looked at pics of the others.
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Offline James M. Wagner

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Re: Ulster Observation Hives
« Reply #3 on: April 21, 2015, 10:20:54 pm »
UPDATE: I ordered the Ulster-style observation hive from Mann Lake. It is on page 132 of their 2015 catalog. The description in the catalog was vague on a few points, so I called with a few questions. The catalog said nothing about whether the bottom board was screened. I was informed it was. I then asked whether there was some provision for closing that off, ie: a sliding board that could be put in to close the bottom.  I was told there was but it was plastic. I was fine with that as many of my screened bottom boards use corrugated plastic inserts to close them off. I also asked if there was a queen excluder between the hive body and the observation deck. I was told that there was NOT one but I could buy one and cut it to fit. That was a disappointment, but I decided to order it anyway.

So, the observation hive came in today via FedEx. I'd ordered it on Friday, so I am pleased with the shipping. I am not so pleased with the unit, itself. Following are some of the issues I have with this box, in no particular order.

First, on the PLUS side of the equation, the lady lied to me about the queen excluder. There is one in there and I am happy about that. Also, the wood was nice with a nice grain and was mostly well put-together. It seems to be very sturdy. However, overall the unit seems to have been hastily built and shoved out the door. There a several glaring negatives.

First thing I noticed was that the box was built with rabbets, rather than box joints as the catalog clearly shows. I know some people prefer the rabbets but I much prefer the box joints. The catalog shows box joints and that is what I expected. Didn't happen.

Second, the observation deck does not sit square on the hive body. I couple of the hasps are going to have to be adjusted to fix that, I think.

Third, after the builder did the final sanding, he didn't even bother to wipe off the sawdust. Come on, they can't take a couple minutes with a damp rag and clean the product before it is sent out?

Fourth, there were no handles cut into the side of the box as clearly shown in the catalog. This is going to make it difficult to carry. The observation deck, when latched down, can be used as a handle but I'd hate to rely on that when the thing is full of frames and bees.

Fifth, there are two pieces of wood that are screwed into the unit at the top to hold the plexiglass in place. There is supposed to be a screw at each end of each piece. One of the pieces had a screw missing. The pilot hole was there but there was no screw. This is not a major issue but, like the dust issue, should have been caught by quality control before being sent from manufacturing to the warehouse.

Sixth, .... Remember that corrugated plastic I was told could be used to close off the bottom? Well, it IS there but on the UNDERSIDE of the unit. Yes, it has to be snapped into place from UNDERNEATH the unit. It cannot be slid into the slot. So, picture this....The hive is full of bees and the observation deck is on. It is getting hot in the display area of the county fair and the hive has to be tipped up in order to remove the board. Then tipped back up to replace it. Honestly, that makes the thing seem useless to me, unless there is some technique to doing this that I haven't thought of, yet.

I've ordered a lot of stuff from Mann Lake in the past and likely will continue to do so as I've had no problems all, including quality, until now. I am hoping this particular item is just an anomaly. The only thing sloppier than manufacturing of this hive was the quality control.



James M. Wagner

Online Michael Bush

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Re: Ulster Observation Hives
« Reply #4 on: April 22, 2015, 03:59:12 pm »
>Fourth, there were no handles cut into the side of the box as clearly shown in the catalog. This is going to make it difficult to carry. The observation deck, when latched down, can be used as a handle but I'd hate to rely on that when the thing is full of frames and bees.

When I picked mine (Brushy Mt.) up by the very top board it bowed enough to let a few bees out.  One of them crawled up a boy's sleeve.  Luckily he was a calm kid and we got it out without him getting stung...
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Offline Grandpa Jim

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Re: Ulster Observation Hives
« Reply #5 on: April 22, 2015, 09:53:29 pm »
I have used Brushy Mts. Ulster hive....no handles in hive....corrugated board slides in from side (no tilting needed)  I stapled wire over the bottom of the observation deck and only take it out to show, leaving the bottom behind.  Much lighter to carry.   

Something I have started to do in my OHs is to put push pins (the kind with plastic push parts) into the top and bottom bars of the frames (3 or 4 on each side) to be put into the OH.  They can be cut as needed with a wire cutter to get them just right.  This keeps the frame centered.  The hive can be tilted without the frame shifting and killing bees.
Jim

Offline James M. Wagner

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Re: Ulster Observation Hives
« Reply #6 on: August 16, 2015, 01:44:11 am »
UPDATE #2:

More issues with this observation hive. I stained it and got it looking really good and took it to an event where I set up a table to promote beekeeping. The observation hive was to be my primary attraction, and it was. Trouble is, no one could see the queen.

The bee space is ALL WRONG in the top/observation deck. I put the bees in the night before the event with the queen in the top on a frame with eggs, larvae, capped brood, pollen and honey so that I could show what each looked like.. By the next morning, bees were festooning between the frame of comb and the glass ON BOTH SIDES. By morning, they had two or three small sections of new comb already started on each side. They continued the festooning all day and, of course, this created a curtain of bees which effectively hid the queen and the comb from view.

So, I had a quite attractive (and expensive) box that was useless for education purposes.

I don't know what I am going to do with it, to be honest. It is useless for its intended purpose at this point.

-james
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Online Michael Bush

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Re: Ulster Observation Hives
« Reply #7 on: August 17, 2015, 05:00:34 pm »
Add a pane of glass (or plexi) on one side to reduce the space to 1 3/4" between the glass.
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Offline James M. Wagner

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Re: Ulster Observation Hives
« Reply #8 on: August 18, 2015, 02:00:10 pm »
Thanks Mike, but that would still leave the other side too wide and I don't think it would help that side, anyway. I believe what happened is the frames with the plexi were installed backwards. Even so, if they had been installed opposite of what they are now, there would still be 3/4" between the frame and the window. Isn't that still too much?

I thought about taking out the frames with the window, reversing them, and reinstalling. However, I don't believe I'll be able to as they were assembled with a pneumatic stapler and I'm afraid I'll break them in the process of disassembly. If they are also glued (as I suspect) then there will be no way to do it without messing it up.

I've sent a message to MannLake with no reply. Today I phoned and talked with a guy who said who would check it out and call me back. We'll see what they have to say.

-james
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Offline D Coates

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Re: Ulster Observation Hives
« Reply #9 on: August 18, 2015, 04:16:44 pm »
Brushy Mountain is the one I've had for years.  It's been great.  I've done all types of presentations with it.  The only problem I had was the bottom was vented via screen but countersunk.  I had some bees under there that then few out during a presentation.  Fortunately everything ended up okay but I added another screen to make it flush on the bottom and create enough of a gap the any stragglers trying to hang out on the bottom can't get fed via bees on the inside and will leave to find their way into the hive.

If you're not satisfied with the Mann Lake unit and send it back get the Brushy Mountain one.  It's rock solid and even comes with a feeder frame standard.
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Online Michael Bush

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Re: Ulster Observation Hives
« Reply #10 on: August 19, 2015, 10:46:15 am »
>Thanks Mike, but that would still leave the other side too wide and I don't think it would help that side, anyway.

The frame does not have to be in the center.

> I believe what happened is the frames with the plexi were installed backwards. Even so, if they had been installed opposite of what they are now, there would still be 3/4" between the frame and the window. Isn't that still too much?

Yes, 3/4" is too much.  It should be about 3/8" on each side between the comb and the glass.  That's 1 3/4".  I never go over 1 7/8" unless I WANT them build burr on the glass so I can see the larvae develop in them...
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