Beemaster's International Beekeeping Forum
BEEKEEPING LEARNING CENTER => GENERAL BEEKEEPING - MAIN POSTING FORUM. => Topic started by: Aroc on July 27, 2019, 09:49:17 pm
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I?ve now done this for about 3 years now and my least favorite is removing the cappings. We use a hot knife but it seems to cool down about mid frame and becomes very hard to finish unless I wait for the knife to heat back up again. The other issue I have is our crazy bees often don?t fill out a frame all nice and even. Often they have high spots and low spots which then makes using the knife all that much harder.
I?ve heard people use a serrated knife but I would still have the issue with the uneven comb.
I heard someone uses a heat gun to melt the cappings, but I?m not sure how that would work.
Any feedback?
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I?ve now done this for about 3 years now and my least favorite is removing the cappings. We use a hot knife but it seems to cool down about mid frame and becomes very hard to finish unless I wait for the knife to heat back up again. The other issue I have is our crazy bees often don?t fill out a frame all nice and even. Often they have high spots and low spots which then makes using the knife all that much harder.
I?ve heard people use a serrated knife but I would still have the issue with the uneven comb.
I heard someone uses a heat gun to melt the cappings, but I?m not sure how that would work.
Any feedback?
Aroc, how many frames are you talking about processing?
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I use a long filet knife and for those pesky low parts I use a capping scratcher. You need to occasionally clean the knife blade as it gets a little wax build up and doesn't want to cut as well.
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I?ve now done this for about 3 years now and my least favorite is removing the cappings. We use a hot knife but it seems to cool down about mid frame and becomes very hard to finish unless I wait for the knife to heat back up again. The other issue I have is our crazy bees often don?t fill out a frame all nice and even. Often they have high spots and low spots which then makes using the knife all that much harder.
I?ve heard people use a serrated knife but I would still have the issue with the uneven comb.
I heard someone uses a heat gun to melt the cappings, but I?m not sure how that would work.
Any feedback?
Aroc, how many frames are you talking about processing?
This year maybe 70ish
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I helped a commercial guy once extract pallets of honey and when he came to an uneven frame he gave it to a guy with just a hive tool who uncapped over a 55 gal drum. I will bet he was as fast as an uncapping knife. I tried it myself and was amazed how easy it was. I still use a hot knife for most of the frames because it makes the frames balanced for the extractor.
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Hi Aroc, when it comes to uneven capping I know what you are talking about: Kinda a pain. What I do is to use the tip of the hot knife for low areas. I realize this slows things down a bit. Also, I have a plastic spiked roller that places holes in the caped honey for extracting. The spiked roller is faster the using the tip of the hot knife.
Blessings
Van
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This is what we are using now. We used to use a serrated decapping knife, for 9 years. This is faster. You do need push the thick wax off but new white wax cuts clean.
Jim Altmiller
https://www.amazon.com/Face-More-Scraper-Uncapping-Beekeeping/dp/B07S75TNNW/ref=asc_df_B07S75TNNW/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=366329529258&hvpos=1o5&hvnetw=g&hvrand=9802717640003467978&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9011486&hvtargid=pla-788969805812&psc=1&tag=&ref=&adgrpid=77768418938&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvadid=366329529258&hvpos=1o5&hvnetw=g&hvrand=9802717640003467978&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9011486&hvtargid=pla-788969805812
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This is what we are using now. We used to use a serrated decapping knife, for 9 years. This is faster. You do need push the thick wax off but new white wax cuts clean.
Jim Altmiller
https://www.amazon.com/Face-More-Scraper-Uncapping-Beekeeping/dp/B07S75TNNW/ref=asc_df_B07S75TNNW/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=366329529258&hvpos=1o5&hvnetw=g&hvrand=9802717640003467978&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9011486&hvtargid=pla-788969805812&psc=1&tag=&ref=&adgrpid=77768418938&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvadid=366329529258&hvpos=1o5&hvnetw=g&hvrand=9802717640003467978&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9011486&hvtargid=pla-788969805812
I like that Jim.
I gave up on the hot knife - it just wouldn't work right - too slow to heat up, and only made it thru 1/2 a frame before going cold.
Switched to an old bread knife - very sharp. That worked till it got wax on the edge. Then it just tore the wax.
Switched to a decapping scraper. Very quick. Able to keep ahead of the extractor (3 frame). That's where I'm at now.
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I'm using a spiked roller. My hot knife melted down. The pros of the roller, works great on uneven comb. No waiting for the honey to drain from the caps I cut off. The con, lots of wax particles in the honey. Stops up my screen filter about every 15 frames thru the extractor. It is not a big problem, I dump it in a bucket and let it slowly filter thru cheesecloth.
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For 70 frames, all you need is a decent quality capping fork. It doubles as a stratcher and as a plane. Use the tips to scratch out otherwise hard to reach cappings. Lay it flat and slide along the frame with the tines just barely under the cappings to lift them off, like a plane. Shapes the comb, taking out the highs and lows. Works best when the combs are warm of course.
A good fork in experienced hands will process through 70 frames quickly. Really quickly. As with many other things related to bees - just keep it simple.
The tined rollers work -OK-, kinda. They tend to load up up on honey and wax and then are not much use until you clean out every groove. If you do chose to give a roller a whirl, do not get the plastic tined style. Get the roller that has the largest drum and longest steel tines that you can find.
Hope that helps!
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I use either a serrated bread knife or an old unheated uncapping knife someone gave me. I keep a pot of hot water next to the uncapping station. Stick the knife in the pot for a second or two and it stays hot for the frame. In between frames, I just plunk the knife back into the ?hot pot?. Works like a charm. And, I also have the scratcher mentioned above. A regular knife, scratcher and hot pot of water makes for fairly easy uncapping.
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Gailmo,
Bee sure to use a tower and dry the hot knife every time you remove it from the water. Otherwise you will bee adding a lot of water to your honey. It does not take much to raise it above 18.5%.
Jim Altmiller
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Gailmo,
Bee sure to use a tower and dry the hot knife every time you remove it from the water. Otherwise you will bee adding a lot of water to your honey. It does not take much to raise it above 18.5%.
Jim Altmiller
Good point Jim, I would add, before rinsing the knife with water, use a icing spreader made in the configuration of a bondo spreader in order to save that much loved Honey from the blade. 🍯 depending on the size of your knife and the blade thickness, you could be losing as much as a spoon each time you rinse. Possibly equivalent to a good hot buttered biscuits worth. 😊
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I gave up on the hot knife - it just wouldn't work right - too slow to heat up, and only made it thru 1/2 a frame before going cold.
If you are using a hot knife you want to set it balls to the wall and have a way to shut it off when you are not uncapping.
https://www.youtube.com/edit?o=U&video_id=WG9_Zz0Xtho&ar=3
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I?ve now done this for about 3 years now and my least favorite is removing the cappings. We use a hot knife but it seems to cool down about mid frame and becomes very hard to finish unless I wait for the knife to heat back up again. The other issue I have is our crazy bees often don?t fill out a frame all nice and even. Often they have high spots and low spots which then makes using the knife all that much harder.
I?ve heard people use a serrated knife but I would still have the issue with the uneven comb.
I heard someone uses a heat gun to melt the cappings, but I?m not sure how that would work.
Any feedback?
How many frames do you run in your honey supers?
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If you run 7 frames in an 8, or 9 in a 10, then the bees will blow out the supers to take up the extra space and will make uncapping easier.
Though you will have more honey to deal with your cappings.
Commercially your frames go further, eg 100 supers only need 700 frames rather than 800.
All new frames are used at 8 frames per super to get even wax spread.
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Agreed Oldbeavo, in my video the frame came from 7 in 8 frame set up.
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If you run 7 frames in an 8, or 9 in a 10, then the bees will blow out the supers to take up the extra space and will make uncapping easier.
Though you will have more honey to deal with your cappings.
Commercially your frames go further, eg 100 supers only need 700 frames rather than 800.
All new frames are used at 8 frames per super to get even wax spread.
Precisely. I run eight frames in my 10 frame honey supers and seven frames in my 8 frame honey supers. Make uncapping soooooooooo much easier and my experience has been that the bees actually make as much if not more honey with less frames in this manner.
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If you run 7 frames in an 8, or 9 in a 10, then the bees will blow out the supers to take up the extra space and will make uncapping easier.
Though you will have more honey to deal with your cappings.
Commercially your frames go further, eg 100 supers only need 700 frames rather than 800.
All new frames are used at 8 frames per super to get even wax spread.
Precisely. I run eight frames in my 10 frame honey supers and seven frames in my 8 frame honey supers. Make uncapping soooooooooo much easier and my experience has been that the bees actually make as much if not more honey with less frames in this manner.
This is good to know and will be incorporated in my program next spring. Thanks men.
Phillip
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I guess I'm cheap. I use a thing my wife bought a while back for piercing pie crusts. about 4" wide and pretty heavy duty and sharp. I just run it along the capped frames real quick and spin 'em...since I don't filter I'm not worried about where the capping's go (they go in the honey jars). Tried a bread knife and a carving knife, with and without hot/warm water, I've found the pastry thingy works the best for me. Took some practice to get to where I didn't do too much damage to the comb.
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...since I don't filter I'm not worried about where the capping's go (they go in the honey jars). ....
Just to clarify (since I'm still learning) - Filtering and Straining honey are 2 different things, right? ...
I use screens to strain the cappings out of the honey - 600 micron over 200 micron - seems to work for me. These screens mount on top of a 5 gallon (honey-gated) bucket. At first I used the fabric (plastic?) screens from Mannlake. I didn't think they'd last too long, and sometime during last winter they grew legs and left the property (common occurrence with my "in-laws" - no big deal) ... so I ordered, and used, Stainless Steel screens this year. I really like these because I can scrape capping's out of the way much easier without worrying.
(Total Sidetrack - I once found my Archery Bow Stand in an "in-laws" garden - it was holding 2 evening lamps! ... I grabbed it with a smile, right in front of them, and said "I've been wondering where that went". They just smiled back :cheesy:)
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...since I don't filter I'm not worried about where the capping's go (they go in the honey jars). ....
Just to clarify (since I'm still learning) - Filtering and Straining honey are 2 different things, right? ...
I use screens to strain the cappings out of the honey - 600 micron over 200 micron - seems to work for me. These screens mount on top of a 5 gallon (honey-gated) bucket. At first I used the fabric (plastic?) screens from Mannlake. I didn't think they'd last too long, and sometime during last winter they grew legs and left the property (common occurrence with my "in-laws" - no big deal) ... so I ordered, and used, Stainless Steel screens this year. I really like these because I can scrape capping's out of the way much easier without worrying.
(Total Sidetrack - I once found my Archery Bow Stand in an "in-laws" garden - it was holding 2 evening lamps! ... I grabbed it with a smile, right in front of them, and said "I've been wondering where that went". They just smiled back :cheesy:)
Allan I think that is the way it is. I don?t know this for a fact but I would think you are correct. Straining should not be considered the same as filtering In my opinion.
Phillip
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It depends on who you talk to but filtering is usually done under high pressure and temperature. Straining is just removing wax and bee parts.
Jim Altmiller
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You can't filter without applying heat. Both remove contents that make the honey raw. Straining does not remove or kill enzymes unless you apply heat.
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Stewart Spinks uses an electric un-capper which uses a long nylon bristle brush spinning at a high rate of speed that does a great job of removing caps. Check it out.
Phillip
https://youtu.be/lp5nqkFWo00
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Wow! I?d love to find a smaller version of that
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I really like the motorized uncapping brush.
I would really like to bee able to make one.
Jim Altmiller
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Me Two!!
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I really like the motorized uncapping brush.
I would really like to bee able to make one.
Jim Altmiller
I'm wondering if lawn sweeper parts would be a good starting point.
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I really like the motorized uncapping brush.
I would really like to bee able to make one.
Jim Altmiller
I'm wondering if lawn sweeper parts would be a good starting point.
I don't know but no doubt that this is derived form some type of sweeping system. I do not know of a lawn sweeper. You could very well be right. This may be a commercially made tool that Stewart uses, I did not ask him about this, or it could possibly be something that he made or had made. I am not familiar with a lot of the equipment end of things, yet. One thing is for sure, for a person with moderate set up this would be the trick in my opinion.
Phillip
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toro 12" power shovel. LOL
Toss those caps 20 feet.
https://www.acehardware.com/departments/lawn-and-garden/snow-removal-and-equipment/snow-blowers/75310?x429=true&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI06bPvu-I5AIVTz0MCh33dAUKEAQYASABEgJ22fD_BwE (https://www.acehardware.com/departments/lawn-and-garden/snow-removal-and-equipment/snow-blowers/75310?x429=true&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI06bPvu-I5AIVTz0MCh33dAUKEAQYASABEgJ22fD_BwE)
Add a variable speed switch and you are good to go. Just do not forget your safety glasses. Too bad the auger is not food grade.
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Incognito,
I cannot get that site to load. Please try posting it again.
Jim Altmiller
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Incognito, that is a good place to start but wouldn?t it be even better if the brush was wider , or at least as wide as the frame? I could not get it to pull up either but the link reads 12 inches. You are on the right track by investigating. Keep up the good work.
Phillip
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Incognito,
I cannot get that site to load. Please try posting it again.
Jim Altmiller
I was joking / brainstorming.
Do a search for a Toro power shovel 12 in. w single-stage electric start snow blower at Ace Hardware, Item no. 75310 | 38361
The one I had from decades ago had a plastic drum like auger, not the rubber one made today.
A deep frame is less than 12 inches tall.
(https://cdn-tp3.mozu.com/24645-37138/cms/37138/files/d3f5e23b-a577-46eb-a8f4-6293e0f865c2?max=300&_mzcb=_1564029509205)