What do you do with your cappings?

[max2]

Every time I take honey off I end up with up to 5 x 20l buckets of cappings.

It is lovely stull with plenty of honey.

But it can also be a bit of a pain and a lot of work.

I'm lucky. I have a mate who is big into Mead and Honey Alcoholic beverages and he picks it all up, wahes it and returns the washed gold to me to be melted into wax blocks...tealights, foundation etc

What are others doing with their cappings?

[The15thMember]

I don't have cappings per se, since I crush and strain, but I always just let the bees clean out the crushed wax.  I used to open feed it, but now I just dump it in a hive top feeder to let them clean it up for me. 

[max2]

Open feeding is actually not legal here in Australia.

[BeeMaster2]

I drain as much of the honey and add it to the rest of the honey. Then I put it out, a long way from my hives, for the bees to to clean out. Then I put it in a solar melter and collect the wax.
Jim Altmiller

[Ben Framed]

Open feeding is actually not legal here in Australia.

I hove found that stacking fresh extracted combs in empty supers next to the screened honey extracting area, (away from the bee area), a big plus and a win-win situation. The bees totally clean the comb as well as equipment, and not a 'drop' of honey wasted down a drain or fed to ants. My bees love it and so do I.
 
I suppose I could add the fresh empties back on the hives but am mindful that such a situation could possibly start robbing. I strain the capping for a few days in bucket in the honey house. With so many hives Max, how do you do it? Do you have a capping extractor?

Phillip

[max2]

Philip,

I hove found that stacking fresh extracted combs in empty supers next to the screened honey extracting area, (away from the bee area), a big plus and a win-win situation. The bees totally clean the comb as well as equipment, and not a 'drop' of honey wasted down a drain or fed to ants.

!!The reason that feding honey back to bees is based on good science. The comb you are giving back would be from multiple hives - 10, 20... - bees from many hives are likley to have access to this free lunch as bees fly for miles.
If a comb is sourced from a ahive with AFB the change of the diseases spreading is a possibility - thus open feeding is not permitted here.


My bees love it and so do I.

!!I bet!

I suppose I could add the fresh empties back on the hives but am mindful that such a situation could possibly start robbing.

!!Possible but i have never experienced. I would expect that open feeding also could encourage robbing.

I strain the capping for a few days in bucket in the honey house. How do you do it Max?

!!As mentioned above - I strain the cappings overnight and then place them into 20 l buckets with a lis and they go to my mead making friend.
A win/win?

Phillip

[Ben Framed]

I suppose AFB is a real problem there. I can see the reasoning..

How do you clean your freshly extracted combs for storage or refilling? Do you mark each comb and place it back in the exact marked box as it was taken from then back to the hive it was taken from 'to make sure' one of your possibly AFB infected hives does not spread the illness to the others in your apiary by mixed placement? How do you transport the same back to the apiary while insuring neighboring bees from miles away do not 'touch' or 'enter' these empties before you can place them back in their proper place, further spreading diseases?


Open feeding distance is debatable from a few hundred feet away up to 500 yards in order to dissuade robbing. Some open feed at closer distances than a few hundred feet with success.
'
"Proper open feeding, with the feeder set up at least 500 yards
from the apiary to minimize robbing, mitigates this advantage".
May 25, 2015
Ask Phil: June 2015 /
Bee Culture

[max2]

Heavy rain here...

I suppose AFB is a real problem there. I can see the reasoning..

!!It is an issue - prevention is best

How do you clean your freshly extracted combs for storage or refilling?

Do you mark each comb and place it back in the exact marked box as it was taken from then back to the hive it was taken from 'to make sure' one of your possibly AFB infected hives does not spread the illness to the others in your apiary by mixed placement? How do you transport the same back to the apiary while insuring neighboring bees from miles away do not 'touch' or 'enter' these empties before you can place them back in their proper place, further spreading diseases?

!!Let me take you through the process.
We do rarely more than 8 hives in one session.
I take a clean, empty super with a lid to the hive i take frames with honey from. The super is getting a coloured peg and the hive is getting the same coloured peg for ID
I take a max of 8 frames  from a 10 frame super.
As i take a frame with capped honey fron the hive all the bees are blown off and the frame placed into the empty super .
This process is repeated 8 times.
The box with 8 frames ( but no bees ) is taken back to the bee house.
The frames are extracted .
While my dear helper is doing this work I bring back the next box with 8 frames of honey ( but a different coloured peg)

Between each hive the hive tool  and hands ( or gloves) are washed in a chlorine solution.

As I deliver a box with 8 frames for extraction I take back the empty frames and return them into the hive they came from.

Empty boxes are dipped in a chlorine solution and washed.
I use plastich bags to cover the below of the smoker and this bag is changed between uses.
I'm well aware that there are still possibilities for cross contamination. It is a matter of minimising transfer.

At the end of the season i send a sample of the last honey to the lag to be tested for any diseases ( AFB  and EFB)

I'm well aware that this is impossible to follow by a big producer - we produce up to about 4000 kg of honey - Boutique style, you may say.

Our local bee inspector tells me that my hugiene levels are " over the top". So be it. Touch wood, I have not had to deal with AFB for a long time and never had EFB.

Hope this explanation helps

[Ben Framed]

Keep up the good work Max. I did not realize AFB was such a problem in your country; Or is it just in your area of Australia?

I wonder if Les and Skeggley have the same severe problems with AFB in their areas of Australia?

Phillip

[Lesgold]

Hi Phillip,

AFB is one of those problems that turn up from time to time. Weather conditions and large quantities of hives moved from one area to another can help the spread of this problem. In my area there is generally a bit of news that filters through about AFB but in most cases the outbreaks are small and isolated. Max?s routine is a sensible one in relation to minimising disease spread. I know of a local beekeeper who had the problem a few years ago. He now follows a similar routine to Max but also washes all stainless gear in caustic soda after every extraction. He has become very particular with bees and management processes. In relation to cappings, I normally let them drain overnight and then move them to the wax melter and warm them for a day at 40C. It is surprising how much extra honey drains off. I then melt the cappings and drain off a heated honey which sits below the molten wax. Each melt produces a few jars of dark honey. This honey sells well at the markets. The flavour is very nice and it is quite often used by customers for sauces, stir fries, cakes or just put into tea or coffee. It is a bit of a win, win really.

[Ben Framed]

Max, Les; Thinking back it seems I remember Mr Bill ("Eltalia") and Iddee being in a 'semi'-'heated' debate of how to handle hives with AFB. ('If') I remember correctly, Mr Bill said the proper way to deal with the situation was to burn the complete hive, woodware and bees while Iddee stated that his State of North Carolina had some sort of radiation method of killing AFB spores, thus saving the woodware. But that was at least 4 years ago and my memory is foggy on this one. One thing if for sure; Mr Bill was in Australia and apparently was very keen to the disaster that AFB causes on our bees.

Phillip

[max2]

Max, Les; Thinking back it seems I remember Mr Bill ("Eltalia") and Iddee being in a 'semi'-'heated' debate of how to handle hives with AFB. ('If') I remember correctly, Mr Bill said the proper way to deal with the situation was to burn the complete hive, woodware and bees while Iddee stated that his State of North Carolina had some sort of radiation method of killing AFB spores, thus saving the woodware. But that was at least 4 years ago and my memory is foggy on this one. One thing if for sure; Mr Bill was in Australia and apparently was very keen to the disaster that AFB causes on our bees.

Phillip

Burning is the most common way to deal with AFB. Most beekeepers would shut the hive after dark, pour a cup or two od petrol  over the frames , kill the bees and burn the lot. Horrible!

Irradiation is approved ( Gamma) but is also expensive as the plant is quite a distance from here. Also equipment has to be stacked in a very specific way on a pallet. I don't have a forklift or truck and without the right gear it is complicated.

For a while I have treated all hives with a dead-out as if they had AFB  - just in case. i sell nuc's and I want to be sure I don't sell diseased bees.

The alternative is a specific heat treatment which is approved.

The bloke who has the right gear is not far from here and is using solar power and it is quite cheap. Frames come back very clean - just a bit dark.
Sadly he is not doing it anymore.
I trying to buy the equipment but he can't make a decision.

I have been considering building one. I could also use solar power as i have excess power on a sunny day.

Having said all that...

My mate with 2500 hives and a regular problem with AFB soaks his hives ( supers with frames) in a strong chlorine solution in a large tub.
He cleans the gear with clean water, airs the lot and reuses supers and frames.
He assures me that AFB spores do not survive this treatment.
I have his word for it but IHAVE NOT TRIED THIS AND HAVE NO PERSONAL EXPERINCE. It is NOT an approved means to treat for AFB in Qld.

[beesnweeds]

Ive often thought of getting a wax press.  Extruders are to expensive for sideliners and hobbyists.  I mostly use wax for coating foundation and candles.

[Ben Framed]

Max, Les; Thinking back it seems I remember Mr Bill ("Eltalia") and Iddee being in a 'semi'-'heated' debate of how to handle hives with AFB. ('If') I remember correctly, Mr Bill said the proper way to deal with the situation was to burn the complete hive, woodware and bees while Iddee stated that his State of North Carolina had some sort of radiation method of killing AFB spores, thus saving the woodware. But that was at least 4 years ago and my memory is foggy on this one. One thing if for sure; Mr Bill was in Australia and apparently was very keen to the disaster that AFB causes on our bees.

Phillip

Burning is the most common way to deal with AFB. Most beekeepers would shut the hive after dark, pour a cup or two od petrol  over the frames , kill the bees and burn the lot. Horrible!

Irradiation is approved ( Gamma) but is also expensive as the plant is quite a distance from here. Also equipment has to be stacked in a very specific way on a pallet. I don't have a forklift or truck and without the right gear it is complicated.

For a while I have treated all hives with a dead-out as if they had AFB  - just in case. i sell nuc's and I want to be sure I don't sell diseased bees.

The alternative is a specific heat treatment which is approved.

The bloke who has the right gear is not far from here and is using solar power and it is quite cheap. Frames come back very clean - just a bit dark.
Sadly he is not doing it anymore.
I trying to buy the equipment but he can't make a decision.

I have been considering building one. I could also use solar power as i have excess power on a sunny day.

Having said all that...

My mate with 2500 hives and a regular problem with AFB soaks his hives ( supers with frames) in a strong chlorine solution in a large tub.
He cleans the gear with clean water, airs the lot and reuses supers and frames.
He assures me that AFB spores do not survive this treatment.
I have his word for it but IHAVE NOT TRIED THIS AND HAVE NO PERSONAL EXPERINCE. It is NOT an approved means to treat for AFB in Qld.

I particularly paid 'much' attention to reply <<Reply #3>> in the following..

https://beemaster.com/forum/index.php?topic=55884.msg511495#msg511495

[Ben Framed]

Ive often thought of getting a wax press.  Extruders are to expensive for sideliners and hobbyists.  I mostly use wax for coating foundation and candles.

They are expensive beesnweeds.  Thanks for your input.

Phillip

[The15thMember]

Ive often thought of getting a wax press.  Extruders are to expensive for sideliners and hobbyists.  I mostly use wax for coating foundation and candles.

I know a guy who uses a cheese/fruit press for wax, which is cheaper than the wax press in the bee supply catalog but essentially the same piece of equipment, and he loves it.  I almost bought one myself based on his recommendation. 

[Lesgold]

They do a good job of getting the majority of honey pressed out of the cappings.  Up until last year, the fruit press was what I was using for the job.They do take a bit of cleaning but if you plan to run 6 or so hives they would be a great piece of equipment to have.

[max2]

Fruit press like this: https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/384685229917?chn=ps&_ul=AU&_trkparms=ispr%3D1&amdata=enc%3A1earUaOyMSCahWJcAu5gVKA1&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=705-166974-041499-5&mkcid=2&mkscid=101&itemid=384685229917&targetid=2244090933996&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=9069063&poi=&campaignid=20857121994&mkgroupid=159761746267&rlsatarget=pla-2244090933996&abcId=9355961&merchantid=7616912&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIuaeWvLu2gwMVIddMAh2QFAoJEAQYBiABEgKT6vD_BwE

A supplier had one on the floor. He told me that it had to be bolted to the floor or it woulkd jump all over the place. I wonder...?

[max2]

Here is an example.
Reminds me as a child making cider with a much bigger press.
Looks slow and I would hate to clean this gadget up after;
here it is ( warning:  Australian adult language) https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=using+a+fruit+press+as+a+wax+press#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:20b76a34,vid:Vtc9LKNolWM,st:0

[Lesgold]

That?s them. It is slow and the cleanup is a learned process testing patience but the results are quite good. I wouldn?t consider it in your situation Max as you have too many hives and there wouldn?t be enough hours in the day for you to get all your jobs done.

[Ben Framed]

https://beemaster.com/forum/index.php?topic=55549.msg508129#msg508129

And you might enjoy the video which is to follow that post in reply 15..

Phillip

[NigelP]

For what it's worth I drain my capping's, turn them a few times and melt down what is left. I found pressing (after draining) was more effort than honey recovered. Also vertical fruit press are very inefficient trapping a load of honey inside the round plug (cavitation). The better presses are hydro presses which expand laterally, but are more expensive but do a great job.

[Terri Yaki]

I have an antique sausage press like this one, it looks to me like it would serve the purpose.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/364651767264?hash=item54e6f065e0:g:iKUAAOSw3yZj7nWP&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA4NoUqfPrQpOd1OnR0iRZ3qCZY8sBefr6aDiQI9Te%2FvOUjPEwD7cSoOQXDVZpf9NHCOspbTtwS%2But18YHp0C4aYQu6P9nFh1cpAWGylD3jzyK%2BoEX05ynCtAdQc7far7E64GlzfuMrGXVxvl5iAHy%2Fw%2F45leJEjJN2pO9nIUcQBU8bAAh42INqHP7JOTsfnBP97oqecEEkZB%2BIpaQHxojKBX8EgcXKYt5PYKYsO3HZUIY1l7YvdB%2FFxHKZ0f9o70kn7J34M8eOL3ZcKS2fivKnNIfsI9McfNraCOscR5JuMfj%7Ctkp%3ABFBMgP2Orpdj

[beesnweeds]

Ive often thought of getting a wax press.  Extruders are to expensive for sideliners and hobbyists.  I mostly use wax for coating foundation and candles.

I know a guy who uses a cheese/fruit press for wax, which is cheaper than the wax press in the bee supply catalog but essentially the same piece of equipment, and he loves it.  I almost bought one myself based on his recommendation.

Thats great.  One of the missing steps in some of the videos posted is wrapping the wax in cheese cloth.  It would make for much easier clean up.

Then there's always this!  On my wax bucket list to try.  So simple to make with stuff laying around in the barn or shed.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wzkxq7qGqxQ

[Terri Yaki]

Ive often thought of getting a wax press.  Extruders are to expensive for sideliners and hobbyists.  I mostly use wax for coating foundation and candles.

I know a guy who uses a cheese/fruit press for wax, which is cheaper than the wax press in the bee supply catalog but essentially the same piece of equipment, and he loves it.  I almost bought one myself based on his recommendation.

Thats great.  One of the missing steps in some of the videos posted is wrapping the wax in cheese cloth.  It would make for much easier clean up.

Then there's always this!  On my wax bucket list to try.  So simple to make with stuff laying around in the barn or shed.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wzkxq7qGqxQ

That was interesting, I love seeing homebrewed solutions like that. Where in the ADK are you? I have a camp up near Saranac Lake.

[max2]

I have an antique sausage press like this one, it looks to me like it would serve the purpose.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/364651767264?hash=item54e6f065e0:g:iKUAAOSw3yZj7nWP&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA4NoUqfPrQpOd1OnR0iRZ3qCZY8sBefr6aDiQI9Te%2FvOUjPEwD7cSoOQXDVZpf9NHCOspbTtwS%2But18YHp0C4aYQu6P9nFh1cpAWGylD3jzyK%2BoEX05ynCtAdQc7far7E64GlzfuMrGXVxvl5iAHy%2Fw%2F45leJEjJN2pO9nIUcQBU8bAAh42INqHP7JOTsfnBP97oqecEEkZB%2BIpaQHxojKBX8EgcXKYt5PYKYsO3HZUIY1l7YvdB%2FFxHKZ0f9o70kn7J34M8eOL3ZcKS2fivKnNIfsI9McfNraCOscR5JuMfj%7Ctkp%3ABFBMgP2Orpdj

I'm worried about clean -up!
How does the press work for you?
Any idea about the percentage of honey recovered?

[Terri Yaki]

I have an antique sausage press like this one, it looks to me like it would serve the purpose.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/364651767264?hash=item54e6f065e0:g:iKUAAOSw3yZj7nWP&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA4NoUqfPrQpOd1OnR0iRZ3qCZY8sBefr6aDiQI9Te%2FvOUjPEwD7cSoOQXDVZpf9NHCOspbTtwS%2But18YHp0C4aYQu6P9nFh1cpAWGylD3jzyK%2BoEX05ynCtAdQc7far7E64GlzfuMrGXVxvl5iAHy%2Fw%2F45leJEjJN2pO9nIUcQBU8bAAh42INqHP7JOTsfnBP97oqecEEkZB%2BIpaQHxojKBX8EgcXKYt5PYKYsO3HZUIY1l7YvdB%2FFxHKZ0f9o70kn7J34M8eOL3ZcKS2fivKnNIfsI9McfNraCOscR5JuMfj%7Ctkp%3ABFBMgP2Orpdj

I'm worried about clean -up!
How does the press work for you?
Any idea about the percentage of honey recovered?

I haven't done anything with it yet besides sand blast it clean after I got it.

[Lesgold]

Max,

The amount of honey recovered compared to the time taken to do the work and then clean up the equipment is probably closer to a young child?s pocket money. Waste is not good but sometimes you have to use common sense and just put up with that sort of loss. Obviously large scale operations or people with a few hives would see it differently. Now that I use a wax melter to do the hard work for me, a lot of time is saved and the honey is still recovered.

[Bill Murray]

Ive never to my knowledge had AFB, but I have had EFB and the chlorine solution is my go to. Thanks max for your input.

[Michael Bush]

If you put the cappings in a turkey roasting pan in the oven at 180 F or so you can melt the wax and separate the honey.  Then use that honey for baking and cooking.  After thoroughly draining of course.

[max2]

If you put the cappings in a turkey roasting pan in the oven at 180 F or so you can melt the wax and separate the honey.  Then use that honey for baking and cooking.  After thoroughly draining of course.

How many kg can one of these Turekey Roasting things hold?

[Michael Bush]

https://www.amazon.com/extra-large-roasting-pan-lid/s?k=extra+large+roasting+pan+with+lid

It would take some time to do five bucket loads.  I would guess somewhere between 7 to 10 batches.  But its not like you have to watch it the whole time.

[Terri Yaki]

If you put the cappings in a turkey roasting pan in the oven at 180 F or so you can melt the wax and separate the honey.  Then use that honey for baking and cooking.  After thoroughly draining of course.

How many kg can one of these Turekey Roasting things hold?

Probably just a couple, they're not all that huge. I'd guess that a big one would hold about two gallons of liquid. I could be off a little.

[yes2matt]

If you put the cappings in a turkey roasting pan in the oven at 180 F or so you can melt the wax and separate the honey.  Then use that honey for baking and cooking.  After thoroughly draining of course.

This cooked honey does a decent substitute for molasses in recipes.




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[Bill Murray]

Matt I love that. Gotta tell me where you got it.