Cuban beekeeping

[Dallasbeek]

Supposedly 100% organic and allegedly loss-free beekeeping.



https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/feb/09/organic-honey-is-a-sweet-success-for-cuba-as-other-bee-populations-suffer

[tjc1]

Wow - that's really interesting. Kind of an island-scale experimental trial of organic beekeeping, with what appears to be great results. An island oasis for bees.

[BeeMaster2]

Thanks Dallas,
I didn't know that they were producing large quantities of honey.
Jim

[Acebird]

Kind of an island-scale experimental trial of organic beekeeping, with what appears to be great results.

The big picture ... Europe using OA for 50 years and still battling mites.  Cuba not so much.  Cuba practicing organic farming without farm machines and not starving to death.  No limitation what so ever for using farm machines in this country but we would starve if it weren't for Monsanto.  Yeah let's build more walls so we can't learn anything.

[cpekarek]

I read somewhere the Varroa Mite was introduced to Cuba in 1996. I tend to think Cuba is not doing so well by 'going organic' at least when it comes to producing food. They use 30% of their land for agriculture, 20% of their population to produce food and still import 80-85% of their food. Without fertilizer and pesticides, crop production is greatly reduced. I'm all for organic but...

According to this article, they are using pesticides in Cuba. http://www.eurochile.cl/index.php/en/news/interviews/item/la-manera-de-hacer-apicultura-hoy-no-puede-seguir-siendo-la-misma-de-hace-50-anos   "Of paramount importance is the controlled use of pesticides to prevent the negative impact on these productive ecosystems, and specially the training received by beekeepers and foresters about it, because for us that work alliance allows us to understand better the importance and how to preserve the balance of the ecosystems."

[Acebird]

I tend to think Cuba is not doing so well by 'going organic' at least when it comes to producing food. They use 30% of their land for agriculture, 20% of their population to produce food and still import 80-85% of their food. Without fertilizer and pesticides, crop production is greatly reduced. I'm all for organic but...

You could have all the fertilizer and pesticides in the big apple and you won't produce enough food to feed the people in queens.  Just for comparison the density of the big apple is 27000 people/sq mi., for the state that drops down to 32 people/sq mi, for the country it is 84 people /sq mi., and Cuba is 277 people per sq mi.  many of the farms are out of business in NYS so the land is not used to produce food but NYS could support the big apple and all the rest of the people in the state with organic farming.  You can't expect a country with no machinery to feed a population density of 277.  It is not a question of organ vs. non organic it is a question of no mechanization.  Yet food is not a problem for them.  We are the problem for them.

[Dallasbeek]

Take away mountainous and other unsuitable land in Cuba and you have even higher population density per arable acre.

[Acebird]

Well nobody is growing anything on white face mountain either.  What should be learned is what you can do if you put your mind to it.  We use to be very good at that.  Now we are more focused on being rich even if daddy handed it to you.

[cpekarek]

I should have stuck with the point of the original article which is not accurate. Cuba does not produce organic honey. That's my point. They use 1,000 tonnes of pesticides for agriculture each year. How can they be sure the bees don't visit fields where pesticides are being applied? And while the U.S. embargo may be part of the problem, the reduction of pesticide use began with the break-up of the USSR in the early 1990's. The Soviets stopped providing many things to Cuba including 21,000 tonnes of pesticides annually.

[Acebird]

They use 1,000 tonnes of pesticides for agriculture each year. How can they be sure the bees don't visit fields where pesticides are being applied?

I have to assume if they got the certification the hives are 3-5 miles away from these fields using non organic pesticides.  Same in this country.

[Dallasbeek]

Who certifies them?  The Cuban govt.?

[Dallasbeek]

By my last post I'm just saying I'm a bit suspucious of anything and everything.  Shouldn't we all be, no matter what the source?

[Acebird]

Organic honey has become Cuba?s fourth most valuable agricultural export behind fish products, tobacco and drinks, but ahead of the Caribbean island?s more famous sugar and coffee, said Theodor Friedrich, the UN Food and Agriculture Organisation?s (FAO) representative for Cuba.

Certification would come from some international organization.

[cpekarek]

Again, my point is the Guardian article states "All of [Cuba?s] honey can be certified as organic,"

but there are many other articles that provide different info such as http://havana.biz/Cuban-Honey.html "Beekeeping in Cuba means now more than 470 producers, 900 apiaries and hives, of which about a third are certified as organic."

[divemaster1963]

i saw a show that talked to a beekeeper in cuba. he stated that he had 100 hives to cover his crops. the gov. lets him sell all the produce off his land but the gov. takes 85% of his honey crop. he is allowed to  keep 15 % for him and his family. he can not sell the honey he gets.

john

[PhilK]

...It is not a question of organ vs. non organic...

You say that, but then you wax lyrical about how nonorganic farming is disastrous and if everyone went organic you could suddenly feed so many more people. I don't think that's right, and if you do then is there a source or some proof you can provide?

[Acebird]

...It is not a question of organ vs. non organic...

You say that, but then you wax lyrical about how nonorganic farming is disastrous and if everyone went organic you could suddenly feed so many more people.

I don't remember ever saying that.  What I believe is if industry would move more closer to organic farming there would be enough food for everyone that is getting food now.  People starve not because there isn't enough food in the world, there clearly is an abundance such that is gets stock piled and also wasted simply to affect the price of the commodity on the stock market.  Because the price of organically grown crops are so much higher than non-organic it doesn't get stock piled.  certainly some gets wasted because it doesn't have the shelf life that the food with poison applied does.
Presently, the world grows so much food that we can take up millions of acres to feed the gasoline engine in our cars.  It is ridiculous to think we can't feed ourselves when we are using land to make fuel for our cars.

[BeeMaster2]

'Presently, the world grows so much food that we can take up millions of acres to feed the gasoline engine in our cars.  It is ridiculous to think we can't feed ourselves when we are using land to make fuel for our cars."

Good point Brian.

[PhilK]

What do you mean we are using millions of acres to feed our cares? Also, who are you saying 'can't feed themselves'? Do you just mean the world in general?

[nella]

'Presently, the world grows so much food that we can take up millions of acres to feed the gasoline engine in our cars.  It is ridiculous to think we can't feed ourselves when we are using land to make fuel for our cars."

Good point Brian.

This is correct, and the by product which is every kernel of corn that is used comes out as a very good type of animal feed, so none of it is wasted.

[paus]

I totally agree with sawdust maker. I read an article somewhere,  yeah , yeah, I know that's like "they say".  There was a list of all the tractors, trucks and of the BTUs used in making ethanol, this research summed all of the BTUs and it took 55,000 BTUs to produce one gallon of 38,000 BTU ethanol. Someone didn't think this out.

[Dallasbeek]

Even so, if it didn't reduce vehicles mileage and destroy small engines (like lawn mowers, etc.), maybe it wouldn't be such a disaster.

[little john]

Every newspaper in the world has it's own agenda, and although I wouldn't expect the international audience to know this - the Guardian is very much a Left Wing newspaper - so you'd expect it's articles to be biased favourably towards Cuba.

Just because an article appears in print, that doesn't necessarily mean that it's not biased, or even based on fact.
LJ
 

[BeeMaster2]

Even so, if it didn't reduce vehicles mileage and destroy small engines (like lawn mowers, etc.), maybe it wouldn't be such a disaster.

Add to that list tractors, weed wackers, chain saws and everyother engine on the farm. It destroys rubber seals in no time.

[paus]

My local time is 2:05 as I start to write.  about ten minutes ago  I came in  from the cool where a friend and I have been working on a log splitter that took us over 3 hrs to get running because of ethanol in the gasoline. It had softened or dissolved all of the hoses and gaskets. 

[Michael Bush]

>Supposedly 100% organic and allegedly loss-free beekeeping.

Isolationism has it's advantages and it's disadvantages...

[KeyLargoBees]

 Living in extreme south Florida I have quite a few friends who still have family in Cuba trust me the Cubans don't consider it "organic" farming they consider it subsistence farming and the only reason they don't use pesticides or fertilizers other than cow manure and compost  is because they can't get it because of the communist scenario being played out there....that article has some glaring misinformation in places and paints a much rosier picture than is portrayed by the family of Cubans still stuck there.

[Acebird]

the Cubans don't consider it "organic" farming they consider it subsistence farming

I wonder what percentage of Cubans die of cancer, Alzheimer, Parkinson and heart disease.

[KeyLargoBees]

Hard to say because if there's one thing a communist government is better at than even the Clinton's....it's media control ;-)

[jimineycricket]

I wonder what percentage of Cubans die of cancer, Alzheimer, Parkinson and heart disease.

I suspect that the percentage of old age conditions is less than in a place where the life expectancy is 60 years. 

[Acebird]

Fidel 90, Rual 85, still living, Juanita 83, still living.  Poverty has a lot to do with a short life span.  The environment and the food you eat has a lot to do with how healthy you are.

[Jim134]

Even so, if it didn't reduce vehicles mileage and destroy small engines (like lawn mowers, etc.), maybe it wouldn't be such a disaster.

Add to that list tractors, weed wackers, chain saws and everyother engine on the farm. It destroys rubber seals in no time.

I see you have the exact same idea as the farmer where I keep my honeybees. What he does send someone to the airport to get Aviation gas. He tells me he has a lot less repairs on all his machinery. Plus he has more power on his chain saws and small engines then with pump gas.


       BEE HAPPY Jim 134  :)

[BeeMaster2]

I now buy ethanol free gas. It cost about 65 cents more per gallon but it does not damage my equipment.
Jim

[Michael Bush]

>Hard to say because if there's one thing a communist government is better at than even the Clinton's....it's media control ;-)

Well, now they passed their "fake news bill" so it's coming...

[Ben Framed]

Supposedly 100% organic and allegedly loss-free beekeeping.



https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/feb/09/organic-honey-is-a-sweet-success-for-cuba-as-other-bee-populations-suffer

The original post and its intent is Interesting. The rest sound like politics of the Coffeehouse lol

[paus]

Just a thought.  Producing ethanol takes 55,000 BTU, mostly diesel to produce one gallon of ethanol which has only 38,00 but per gallon.  Typical logic for our "Rulers".  Phillip you are right but here is my first thought anyway.