Author Topic: Branches and orientation (Read 5855 times)

manfre · « **on:** April 28, 2010, 10:06:37 am »

About a week ago, a swarm moved in to a box I set up on top of my 10' tall shed. I need to move it off the shed, so I'm assuming that screening the front and then ratcheting the heck out of it should be sufficient to let me carry it down a ladder. Normally you'd want to put a branch in front of the entrance to get the bees to reorient to the new hive location. There is currently a live tree branch right in front of the hive and the wind even moves it close enough that leaves touch the entrance.

Will putting a branch in front of the entrance still get them to orientate themselves after the move? Does moving vegetation in front of the hive make the scouts reorient every time they leave? I watched the hive for a bit and noticed that it has more bees hovering in front of the entrance than my other hives. I'm not sure if that is due to the elevation of the hive or they're just staying airborne to dodge the branch.

Link to pictures and a video showing the hive location.

iddee · « **Reply #1 on:** April 28, 2010, 10:17:08 am »

How far are you moving it? If less than 50 ft., I would just move it at dusk. The stragglers will find it in a day or so.

Michael Bush · « **Reply #2 on:** April 28, 2010, 11:48:39 am »

The branch will hlep some.

KD4MOJ · « **Reply #3 on:** April 28, 2010, 02:04:53 pm »

When I move a hive or nuc, I put a piece of a branch (6" - 8") in front of the entrance so when they enter or exit, they climb over it. You can watch them reorient, pretty interesting. I remove it several days later.

...DOUG
KD4MOJ

marksmith · « **Reply #4 on:** April 28, 2010, 02:10:03 pm »

This 'branch' trick... just place it in front of it somewhere so the entrance looks drastically different when they fly out?

Wouldn't it be just as confusing if they didn't have the branch when they came back?

Sorry for the newbee question...

KD4MOJ · « **Reply #5 on:** April 28, 2010, 02:26:30 pm »

From what I can tell (my measly experience) and from what I see them do, the obstacle forces them to reorient since it wasn't there before the hive/nuc was moved. Once they do their "dance in the air" in front of the hive and get the "lock on", they now have the new location "memorized". So removing the stick later doesn't seem to have any effect on them, just no more obstacle to have to walk over.

Sure does beat dragging a hive across town!

...DOUG
KD4MOJ

theriverhawk · « **Reply #6 on:** May 02, 2010, 10:02:16 pm »

I have NEVER had the branch/grass in front of the hive thing work. EVERY time I do it, all the field bees relocate to the old location. I place a super or box there, they go in, I take them AGAIN to the new location. Next day...THE SAME THING. I've stopped trying it after all the mishaps. Now I just move them 5 miles for 4-5 days and bring them back. Almost everyone knows somebody with a field that will let you keep them there for a very short period....yea, I know some folks don't. I've also walked up to a farmer's door and asked out of the clear blue. They've never said no. Most farmers/ranchers understand our "ranching".

David LaFerney · « **Reply #7 on:** May 02, 2010, 10:40:32 pm »

Anybody ever try changing from a bottom entrance to a top entrance or vise-versa when making a move? Or maybe putting on a robber screen? I haven't - yet. Just a random thought.

KD4MOJ · « **Reply #8 on:** May 03, 2010, 11:24:54 am »

Quote from: theriverhawk on May 02, 2010, 10:02:16 pm

I have NEVER had the branch/grass in front of the hive thing work. EVERY time I do it, all the field bees relocate to the old location.

Sorry it didn't work out for you. Thus far it has worked out for me every time (4 times now).

Your are correct about the field bees (the ones before the relocation) as they will return to the old location because they don't know any better. They were out and about before the obstruction was in place. The ones in the hive/NUC will reorient because they have to since you are partially blocking their entrance, they have to climb over it which it seems causes them to reevaluate the situation. They then fly back and forth in the front of the entrance for several minutes then in front of the hive. At least this is what I have observed here.

...DOUG
KD4MOJ

FRAMEshift · « **Reply #9 on:** May 03, 2010, 11:50:23 am »

What about changing the configuration of the hive without moving it? I've noticed that when the height of the hive is altered by adding/removing a deep, many of the bees will do orientation flights. I wonder if some get lost because they didn't do the re-orientation. Does anyone add a branch to the entrance when you change the hive configuration?

David LaFerney · « **Reply #10 on:** May 03, 2010, 01:11:37 pm »

Quote from: duckintheface on May 03, 2010, 11:50:23 am

What about changing the configuration of the hive without moving it? I've noticed that when the height of the hive is altered by adding/removing a deep, many of the bees will do orientation flights. I wonder if some get lost because they didn't do the re-orientation. Does anyone add a branch to the entrance when you change the hive configuration?

That's probably true to some extent, but if you move the entire hive and leave nothing but a BB the foragers will hang out there scratching their heads for quite a long time. It even freaks them out if you just change the entrance reducer so that the entrance is a few inches from where they are used to.

tim adams · « **Reply #11 on:** May 12, 2010, 11:21:04 am »

I just recently moved 4 out of 9 hives about 25 feet at night. I used palm leaves to cover the entrance , I thought this would help but that's not what happen. All the field bees went back to the old location the next morning so now I have 4 hives with not many field bees and 5 hives that have almost doubled in population. Guess I know which hives will be my strongest producer this year.
Tim Adams

KD4MOJ · « **Reply #12 on:** May 12, 2010, 12:03:41 pm »

Quote from: tim adams on May 12, 2010, 11:21:04 am

I just recently moved 4 out of 9 hives about 25 feet at night. I used palm leaves to cover the entrance , I thought this would help but that's not what happen.

Tim what has worked for me, is that I put an obstruction (usually a pine limb parts, sticks etc) across the entrance on the bottom board, the complete entrance width. With the obstruction in place, the bees that leave or arrive, have to crawl over this piece of wood. The forages that leave, tend to get confused about the wood since it wasn't there the previous day so they tend the start the reorientation as soon as they crawl over the obstruction and take flight.

Again this is something that has worked for me when I made splits and the NUCs tend to do just fine with little drifting. Matter of fact, I just put one of my splits from the NUC into a deep yesterday. They even got confused about the bigger box and bigger opening at the same location!

...DOUG
KD4MOJ

tim adams · « **Reply #13 on:** May 12, 2010, 06:22:13 pm »

I understand and I stuffed them in the entrance and layed them across and it still didn't work. I'll try something else next time.
Tim

KD4MOJ · « **Reply #14 on:** May 12, 2010, 06:59:39 pm »

Sorry that didn't work for you Tim... Maybe I have just been lucky judging from the other responses here... I have to move another hive in the next few days and I'll report back on that move. Just transfered the nuc into the deep (that I mentioned above) but I need to move it to a full sun spot on the east side of the yard. Too bad I can't use the west side of the yard for morning sun but it's too close to the neighbors.. and their nice big POOL! ARGH! Already had a problem with that last summer... :(

...DOUG
KD4MOJ

Davepeg · « **Reply #15 on:** May 12, 2010, 07:56:56 pm »

We did a split about a week ago. Put a branch in front of the split and some grass on the landing board - the girls had the grass all pushed out onto the ground within a few hours! Guess they didn't like to climb over the grass.

joker1656 · « **Reply #16 on:** May 13, 2010, 02:24:22 pm »

Glad to see this thread. Even though I have heard about the "branch accross the entrance" trick, I was unsure whether it worked.

I have no choice. I did a cutout a week ago. I put the two deeps (pretty heavy to carry) out in the front yard. It was dark and I did not feel like carrying it the 400 yds to my bee yard. I was pretty wiped out. Like I said, that was a week ago. It has either poured rain, been cold, or I have had to work late.

I hope to move them tonight, or tomorrow night. I am gonna try the branch.

manfre · « **Reply #17 on:** May 13, 2010, 03:31:26 pm »

joker,

Sound like you need a hand truck. If you have screened bottoms, you'll need a small piece of plywood to use a base.

MacfromNS · « **Reply #18 on:** May 13, 2010, 11:13:16 pm »

I was thinking(something new) when doing a spit and your putting something over the entrance of the spit why not put something over the main hive entrance also.

Sparky · « **Reply #19 on:** May 13, 2010, 11:34:30 pm »

Next time you move one, try to find a bunch of tall grass and stuff it in the entrance to plug up all but a small hole to make them orient to the new location and leave it there for a week. Then little by little start to pull some of it out and let it fall on the ground in front of the hive.