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Author Topic: No bees in Cambodia..  (Read 1105 times)

Offline max2

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No bees in Cambodia..
« on: March 10, 2023, 03:32:11 am »
I have just returned from volunteering in Cambodia.

In the past i have taken beegear to this lovely country with so many friendly people.

Of course, Cambodia is home to the Asian bee but what has always concerned me that you see very few hives - managed or wild.

Those I knew off often did not survive for very long.

Every time I visit the country I take as many jars of honey as I can fit into my bag. Honey is expensive there and the people love a honey present.

I wonder if the bombing has a residual effect?
See this: https://ohiohistorycentral.org/w/Bombing_of_Cambodia

The number of baby's born with deformities is still far too high. Not normal. No comparison with the west.

Is there a connection?

I wonder.

Online Ben Framed

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Re: No bees in Cambodia..
« Reply #1 on: March 10, 2023, 03:49:54 am »
max2
"Of course, Cambodia is home to the Asian bee but what has always concerned me that you see very few hives - managed or wild.

Those I knew off often did not survive for very long."


That part of the World is beautiful Max. I have some friends from Vietnam, the Neighboring Country to Cambodia. The pictures they have shown me are marvelous. Do you have pictures of your Cambodia trip?

I don't know much about that part of the World as far as bees are concerned Max, maybe others do.  I can tell your that in my area of America, when I was a boy, wild hives could readily and easily be found, they abounded. Not so much since the interduction of 'Varroa Destructor' and 'Small Hive Beetles; from 'other parts of the world', which have 'invaded' my countries borders to our sorrow.  Our wild bee populations have suffered 'greatly' in my area since they have made my Country their home..  Sad

Phillip
2 Chronicles 7:14
14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

Online Ben Framed

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Re: No bees in Cambodia..
« Reply #2 on: March 10, 2023, 09:13:47 am »
I will add, I am subscribed to Khmer Beekeeping. They are located in Cambodia and seem to thrive. I have posted their version of a wax press here a few years ago. I never knew they had a problem keeping bees there. They seem to stay plenty busy. Their YouTube channel is all I know of bees in Cambodia.  Check out their YouTube Channel..

Phillip

Adding:
These folks have some interesting stuff on their videos Max.  From 2020
https://beemaster.com/forum/index.php?topic=53961.msg488227#msg488227
2 Chronicles 7:14
14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

Offline paus

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Re: No bees in Cambodia..
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2023, 05:49:02 pm »
I think that there are fewer feral hives in NE Texas because there is very little large hardwoods that would have "Hollows" or cavities for the bees to make a home. have a few on my place a couple of colonies but there are very scarce compared to fifty years ago.  I will not cut a Beetree unless it has to come down.  Another reason is that the Queen seldom survives because she is crushed between the combs.

Offline Lesgold

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Re: No bees in Cambodia..
« Reply #4 on: March 10, 2023, 07:34:33 pm »
That?s a sad situation Max. It would be nice to find out the truth of the matter. I wonder if the mistakes of the past are impacting on people and their environment. We are seeing a lot of this in relation to chemical usage. It?s something that we are becoming more aware of in the modern world. Im glad that you enjoyed your trip. Good to see you back on the forum.

Online Ben Framed

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Re: No bees in Cambodia..
« Reply #5 on: March 11, 2023, 03:00:12 am »
Honeybee decline has been an issue 'globally' where Varro is present, is my understanding; Not just the country of Cambodia if that be the case there. CCD was a mystery to the Scientific World as well as the beekeeping community in general, when the disappearance of bees first became noticed, 'is also my understanding'.
Note: (I was not a beekeeper then and did not follow the situation closely as some of you beekeepers might have during that time of mysterious Honey Bee decline )

The concerns for the HoneyBee decline were so great, documentaries on American TV about this subject were made and shown. News Media kept the topic going for the education of the public. The subject was in the spot light from the TV to Schoolhouse just a few short years ago, which led to the 'Save the Bees' campaign, where the general public climbed aboard. The discovery of the spread of Varroa Destructor in Honey Bees, along with the 'numerous' 'viruses' they carry, has been is a 'major culprit' to the mystery of the declining Honey Bee, (again, if I understand this correctly).

I for one know nothing of the Asian Bee or the problems it may, or may not have or face. I have watched several of the Cambodian Beekeeper Videos from the channel which I mentioned above.  Looking at the videos of the bees these folks 'keep', the bees 'look like' European Honey Bees to me, which might or might not have a bearing. I have watched from the same channel, these Cambodian folks retrieving wild bees, which seem to be in abundance in warm climate of that beautiful country featured in these videos.

I am not disputing or discounting Max claims or suspensions. I am pointing out that Cambodia is not alone in the decline of honey bees or bee health. It has been a world wide problem from my understanding.

You Austrilain folks are VERY fortunate (so far) in warding off this 'dreadful' pest. It is my hope that you win your war against Varroa Destructor as you continue in your battle against it. I have been in constant support of you in this effort as can be seen and read on the topic "Varroa detected in Australia".

As a side note;
May I also suggest in taking heed the handling of bee equipment, transferring back and forth to other countries, including bee suits where Varroa Destructor might live; Working bees, then bringing back the same bee suits to your country. Varroa Destructor is no joke.  It has been recommended storing equipment free of brood and adult bees for two weeks or more before being reused, even in countries which are infested. I have read that Varroa can only live a few days without their host the bee. I 'personally' would have fear of mite survivability any time short of two weeks 'just to be safe', including my bee suit. Again, that is just my opinion.

As far as the war and bombing: If the war during the 60s and early 70s along with the weapons used in that war are 'the reason' for deformities in children in Cambodia, then that is a subject well worth discussing. The Coffeehouse is a great place 'set aside' for such political discussions and debate. Feel free to open up a topic there, and 'fire-away'. 
:grin:

Phillip
« Last Edit: March 11, 2023, 10:20:50 am by Ben Framed »
2 Chronicles 7:14
14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

Offline max2

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Re: No bees in Cambodia..
« Reply #6 on: March 12, 2023, 05:17:59 am »
The bees do look like European bees but are larger and very docile.
I have seen them in Cambodia, Thailand, Vietnam, India and China. I remember having a veil with me but as the woman keeper did not have any protection I did not bother and got nil stings.
The Asian bees seems to swarm very readily.
At the temple in India were i worked I saw probably a hundred hives hanging from the edge of the roof.
In Vietnam all hives were singles. The honey was harvested uncapped. I can't say that the taste was pleasant.
I often read that hives in China are feed sugar water. Not the ones I saw. They were very basic boxes made by farmers.

About the lack of bees in cambodia.
We have to remember that Cambodia and Laos were very heavily Napalmed (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napalm) and the chemicals may well leave a long term residue.
Cambodia, like Vietnam was also covered in Agent Orange ( and A green etc) and we know that the effect on US personel was devestating.
Agent Orange is a hormonal herbicide  and the effect on humans ( have a look at the museum in Cambodia at the deformed foetuses) is well documented.

The question I'm interested in is:
- what is the long term effect of Napalm and Agent orange on insects like bees?

Does anybody on this forum know?

I understand that growing Sunflowers concetrates some chemicals in the roots of the plant but would this work with the above chemicals?


Online Ben Framed

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Re: No bees in Cambodia..
« Reply #7 on: March 12, 2023, 08:22:30 am »
max2
"The question I'm interested in is:
- what is the long term effect of Napalm and Agent orange on insects like bees?"


Good question, I do not know Max but I don't see how it could be good for man nor beast; long term or short.. Maybe someone here might. Van from Arkansas would be a good one to ask. 

I still recommend viewing the "Khmer Beekeeping" channel. It is interesting to see how folks keep bees in other parts of the world, including 'these' commercial beekeepers in Cambodia. These folks are resourceful. I do not know if the area you visit is close to these nice people, but who knows, maybe you can take the time to visit them the next time you are over and they can give you a tour and help answer your questions.   

Phillip
« Last Edit: March 12, 2023, 10:17:22 am by Ben Framed »
2 Chronicles 7:14
14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

Offline The15thMember

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Re: No bees in Cambodia..
« Reply #8 on: March 12, 2023, 05:21:03 pm »
The bees do look like European bees but are larger and very docile.
I have seen them in Cambodia, Thailand, Vietnam, India and China. I remember having a veil with me but as the woman keeper did not have any protection I did not bother and got nil stings.
The Asian bees seems to swarm very readily.
At the temple in India were i worked I saw probably a hundred hives hanging from the edge of the roof.
In Vietnam all hives were singles. The honey was harvested uncapped. I can't say that the taste was pleasant.
I often read that hives in China are feed sugar water. Not the ones I saw. They were very basic boxes made by farmers.

About the lack of bees in cambodia.
We have to remember that Cambodia and Laos were very heavily Napalmed (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napalm) and the chemicals may well leave a long term residue.
Cambodia, like Vietnam was also covered in Agent Orange ( and A green etc) and we know that the effect on US personel was devestating.
Agent Orange is a hormonal herbicide  and the effect on humans ( have a look at the museum in Cambodia at the deformed foetuses) is well documented.

The question I'm interested in is:
- what is the long term effect of Napalm and Agent orange on insects like bees?

Does anybody on this forum know?

I understand that growing Sunflowers concetrates some chemicals in the roots of the plant but would this work with the above chemicals?


I did some digging around on the internet about this.  I wasn't able to find much on napalm or on Agent Orange as a total compound, as far their effects on insects, but I did find a little bit about 2,4-D herbicide, which is one of the two primary compounds in Agent Orange.  2,4-D isn't directly toxic to bees, although it can cause minor issues with their circulatory systems.  The bigger potential problem with it is that it's also an antimicrobial, and there are concerns that its presence in pollen interferes with the bees' ability to ferment the pollen into bee bread.     

Sort of related: I listen to an interesting podcast a while back about managing Apis dorsata in Cambodia.  Here is a link to the website of the organization.  https://www.beesunlimited.com/rafter-beekeeping     
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Offline Michael Bush

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Re: No bees in Cambodia..
« Reply #9 on: March 13, 2023, 07:14:24 am »
The bees you describe are Apis dorsata.  They never live in a hive, but just a single comb.  But you should also have Apis cerana there.  They are prone to swarm and abscond but can be kept in a hive.  You have to manage the space very carefully so they don't abscond or swarm.  To much and they abscond.  Too frequent inspections and they abscond.  Too small a space and they swarm.
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